| I mean, all you really get are some financial benefits like tax deductions and inheritance benefits (at least in the USA, along with a few more minor legal options). Do people really need the government to acknowledge whether you're married or not? If it's not a financial/legal benefit matter, then what say does the government actually have to two (or more) peoples' relationship? (Assuming government isn't some sort of police-state that would arrest you) If it's just a financial/legal benefit matter, why do people bring in ethical/moral arguments against it? |
MortalMelancholySep 26, 2016 5:23 AM
| Be thankful for the wisdom granted to you. |
| Have your ever thought about things like cheating ? You can only sue him or her for cheating if the government has acknowledged your marriage , if not then there's pretty much nothing legally that you can do about it |
 |
| I guess it's kind of like pirating games vs steam games to some people. With pirated games, you don't get the official achievements and everything (because it's not official to Steam), and therefore no Steam achievements. Some people go crazy about not having their steam achievements while others couldn't care less I suppose. To be honest, I've been pondering the same question as well. I honestly couldn't care less whether a marriage was official or not, so long as things turn out for the better. |
 |
Seiryus said: Have your ever thought about things like cheating ? You can only sue him or her for cheating if the government has acknowledged your marriage , if not then there's pretty much nothing legally that you can do about it LOL you can sue your spouse for cheating? That's actually hilarious. What can you get out of it? |
| Be thankful for the wisdom granted to you. |
| Hey OP, you know I like you :p. I think most people look for security unconsciously. They probably feel their partner is less likely to drop them if they lose their job/fall sick/lose a limb/whatever. I can't imagine a reason to get married that doesn't sound petty but maybe that's just me. |
 |
MortalMelancholy said: Well it's not technically suing but filling in for a divorce because he/she was committing adultery can affect the division of the property . However ,in some states , you can sue the person that ruins your marriage and request punitive damages (money damages to punish defendants for their bad actions)Seiryus said: Have your ever thought about things like cheating ? You can only sue him or her for cheating if the government has acknowledged your marriage , if not then there's pretty much nothing legally that you can do about it LOL you can sue your spouse for cheating? That's actually hilarious. What can you get out of it? In one North Carolina case, a jury awarded wife Cynthia Shackelford $9 million from her cheating husband’s mistress |
SeiryusSep 26, 2016 6:23 AM
|
Clebardman said: Hey OP, you know I like you :p. I think most people look for security unconsciously. They probably feel their partner is less likely to drop them if they lose their job/fall sick/lose a limb/whatever. I can't imagine a reason to get married that doesn't sound petty but maybe that's just me. Hmm, there's definitely a certain amount of security to marriage (all I see are tax cuts though :3) MindForged said: Is this really a sensible question? Aside from the obvious attempt to discriminate and the legal benefits, you're forgetting marriage's social function. We raise people in our socieities (and portray in our artistic mediums) that when you love someone, and have been with them for some amount of time, you're supposed to get married. So gays wanted legal marriage for the exact same reasons straight people want (and have) legal marriage: that's what we teach them to want. It does make sense. If you tell someone you're married in a social context, they're not gonna ask to see your marriage certificate. Even if it's obvious that your marriage is not supported by the local governing body, I doubt someone would try to argue with you about the legality of your marriage. (And if they don't agree with the morality of your marriage, its legality is unlikely to change their opinion of you) And I'm not asking why people in atypical relationships want legal marriage; I'm asking why anyone thinks that they need the government to acknowledge a marriage (especially when marriage is considered a social construct). Seiryus said: MortalMelancholy said: Well it's not technically suing but filling in for a divorce because he/she was committing adultery can affect the division of the property . However ,in some states , you can sue the person that ruins your marriage and request punitive damages (money damages to punish defendants for their bad actions)LOL you can sue your spouse for cheating? That's actually hilarious. What can you get out of it? In one North Carolina case, a jury awarded wife Cynthia Shackelford $9 million from her cheating husband’s mistress Lol that's a little entertaining; it goes a bit further than simply being liable for knowingly causing financial harm. Kinda reminds me of that thing, where some Chinese guy sued his wife for getting plastic surgery, pretending to be beautiful, and having ugly children lel. |
| Be thankful for the wisdom granted to you. |
| Okay so basically, people get married to take all their partner's money if he cheats on them. So romantic. |
|
| No idea. My parents aren't legally married and have said "it's just a piece of paper in the end". |
| "No, son, you may not have your body pillow at the dinner table!" |
CatSoul said: No idea. My parents aren't legally married and have said "it's just a piece of paper in the end". Tell them to grab those tax-cut upgrades >.o |
| Be thankful for the wisdom granted to you. |
MortalMelancholy said: Clebardman said: Hey OP, you know I like you :p. I think most people look for security unconsciously. They probably feel their partner is less likely to drop them if they lose their job/fall sick/lose a limb/whatever. I can't imagine a reason to get married that doesn't sound petty but maybe that's just me. Hmm, there's definitely a certain amount of security to marriage (all I see are tax cuts though :3) MindForged said: Is this really a sensible question? Aside from the obvious attempt to discriminate and the legal benefits, you're forgetting marriage's social function. We raise people in our socieities (and portray in our artistic mediums) that when you love someone, and have been with them for some amount of time, you're supposed to get married. So gays wanted legal marriage for the exact same reasons straight people want (and have) legal marriage: that's what we teach them to want. It does make sense. If you tell someone you're married in a social context, they're not gonna ask to see your marriage certificate. Even if it's obvious that your marriage is not supported by the local governing body, I doubt someone would try to argue with you about the legality of your marriage. (And if they don't agree with the morality of your marriage, its legality is unlikely to change their opinion of you) And I'm not asking why people in atypical relationships want legal marriage; I'm asking why anyone thinks that they need the government to acknowledge a marriage (especially when marriage is considered a social construct). Seiryus said: Well it's not technically suing but filling in for a divorce because he/she was committing adultery can affect the division of the property . However ,in some states , you can sue the person that ruins your marriage and request punitive damages (money damages to punish defendants for their bad actions) In one North Carolina case, a jury awarded wife Cynthia Shackelford $9 million from her cheating husband’s mistress Lol that's a little entertaining; it goes a bit further than simply being liable for knowingly causing financial harm. Kinda reminds me of that thing, where some Chinese guy sued his wife for getting plastic surgery, pretending to be beautiful, and having ugly children lel. Yeah , I remember laughing quite a bit when i first saw that and the best , or worst part that he actually won that lawsuit lel |
|
| Because people like to show their status is married Lord_Sithis said: This is what OP is asking.Finally! I've been asked myself this question since ages ago! No, really, what's the point? |
| Today they say you're crazy, tomorrow they will say you're a genious. |
| No, there is absolutely no point apart from legal and financial benefits. However if it does happen, I wouldn't mind getting married considering that my partner would earn just about as much as I do.. |
| You know, people tend to mythologize marriage, with all that "eternal love" stuff. In the end, it's just a paper which only can give them very few benefits. ¯\_(ツ)_/¯ |
 |
| Well I think It's about traditions. |
sasalx said: Well I think It's about traditions. I don't recall any cultures whose tradition includes the government telling you that you're married, and then giving you financial and legal benefits. MindForged said: People don't tend to like having double standards applied to them. Heterosexuals don't have to worry about the legality of their marriage being disputed on the grounds that it's heterosexual, so your question really only makes sense to apply to other groups. We raise people to want actual marriage, not a fake one. So it's unsurprising that people often seek marriage. I don't think it's very complicated. And it doesn't matter that marriageis a social construct. Lots of things everyone wants are social constructs. Money? That's a social construct (it varies by society, it's "value" would not exist without people, etc.) Sports rules? A social construct. If you don't think people should value marriage, you have a lot of.minds to change. I can definitely see the double standards thing for people who aren't allowed to marry by law (Although I'm generalizing to more than just homosexuals; there's also age, number of spouses, etc). One of my questions is essentially, why do people think that the local government is the ultimate decider in whether a marriage is "real" or "fake?" If say, you're a homosexual married couple in the United States, and you go to Mexico, suddenly your marriage becomes fake? And when you return to the US, it becomes real? I think not. It does matter that it's a social construct, because that means it is not a legal construct; the government only adapted its policies to benefit the social construct in question. Yes, money and sports rules are social constructions, as are laws and government, but you're missing my question entirely. Which is, why do people care about the government's decision how they handle a social construct such as marriage, when it won't change the society's opinion? |
| Be thankful for the wisdom granted to you. |
| @MortalMelancholy I was not talking about cultures.Since middle ages(I guess) it's a thing and people still doing that.It's more like a process. |
MortalMelancholy said: I mean, all you really get are some financial benefits like tax deductions and inheritance benefits (at least in the USA, along with a few more minor legal options). Do people really need the government to acknowledge whether you're married or not? Tax benefits, social security, medical benefits etc etc. https://en.wikipedia.org/wiki/Rights_and_responsibilities_of_marriages_in_the_United_States If it's not a financial/legal benefit matter, then what say does the government actually have to two (or more) peoples' relationship? (Assuming government isn't some sort of police-state that would arrest you) If it's just a financial/legal benefit matter, why do people bring in ethical/moral arguments against it? And commitment, symbolically speaking. Or religious reasons. |
| ゴロゴロゴロ ゴロゴロゴロ ゴロゴロゴロ ゴロゴロゴロ ゴゴゴゴゴゴ ゴゴゴゴゴゴ ゴゴゴゴゴゴ |
| The government should pull out of the religious foundation of marriage. Disassociate it from the government entirely and replace it with an across the board civi union. It's a win/win for gay people who want the benefits that come with marriage, and for the religious nuts who can't fathom the idea of gay people being joined in a religious ceremony. "But wut if gay peepul want to git mareed stil?" They still can, they just don't receive any benefits from it outside of personal satisfaction. "But wut about the luv?" Hardly a traditional standpoint. Love in marriage is very much a 20th century idea. So yeah, remove the government and benefits from marriage and the only reason is effectively wanting to be married for happiness. |
| People who put MAL stats in their sigs are losers lol |
| I guess people feel much safer when legally married, as it gives the impression that the bond between partners becomes stronger. Also, there is the issue of social expectations. |
   |
| Worth it in the long run if you and your spouse make roughly the same amount, if not then I can't help but see it as anything but a safety net for the spouse who doesn't make as much. |
 |
| Marriage is entirely meaningless. 'Marriage' should only exist as a system to make sure a children has parents - whether he's adopted or born. You don't want people just having babies without making sure there's a contract binding the parents, else they could jump ship whenever they want to. Other than that, marriage's kind of pointless. |
| WEAPONS - My blog, for reviews of music, anime, books, and other things |
| Tradition plays a part. Inheritance does so as well, both the family name and resources. The people who bring "love" into it tend to do so because it creates more pressure framing it as a moral issue rather than a financial one. |
| "Let Justice Be Done!" My Theme Fight again, fight again for justice! |
| It used to mean a bond and promise for faithfulness and love before the money grubbing peopl got their hands on it. |
 |
ichii_1 said: +1It used to mean a bond and promise for faithfulness and love before the money grubbing peopl got their hands on it. Or you can just not get married, then get out of a relationship as fast as you can when the going gets tough and let one side just handle all the burden alone. Be it emotional pain, or any debts, or arguments or kids along the way :) |
 Signature by Sylinchen / Enchanted Pixels |
| I like the idea of marriage, but honestly, I do think it's pointless. I've seen couples who've been together for years, but they aren't married, legally at least. I don't care much about the financial benefit to getting married, but I do like the idea of being married to the person I love. I guess it's just etched into my brain that that's the thing you do; you marry the person you love the most. In general, I think that's probably the view of most people who get married. |
 Singing a song of melancholy..  |
| There really is no point to it, at least where I live. A widow will get a small raise to their retirement money, but that's pretty much worthless. I feel like people do it only because the generations before did it :/ |
RedRoseFring said: Tradition plays a part. Inheritance does so as well, both the family name and resources. The people who bring "love" into it tend to do so because it creates more pressure framing it as a moral issue rather than a financial one. Can't you just write a will that says all your property goes to your SO if you die? Do we need the marriage institute for that? |
| WEAPONS - My blog, for reviews of music, anime, books, and other things |
TheBrainintheJar said: RedRoseFring said: Tradition plays a part. Inheritance does so as well, both the family name and resources. The people who bring "love" into it tend to do so because it creates more pressure framing it as a moral issue rather than a financial one. Can't you just write a will that says all your property goes to your SO if you die? Do we need the marriage institute for that? I think the death tax is higher for non-nuclear family members and such. |
| Be thankful for the wisdom granted to you. |
TheBrainintheJar said: RedRoseFring said: Tradition plays a part. Inheritance does so as well, both the family name and resources. The people who bring "love" into it tend to do so because it creates more pressure framing it as a moral issue rather than a financial one. Can't you just write a will that says all your property goes to your SO if you die? Do we need the marriage institute for that? You may have other family members or even past lovers coming out of the woodwork to make claims and counter that, or if you have children with multiple partners, etc. It just becomes a mess. |
| "Let Justice Be Done!" My Theme Fight again, fight again for justice! |
| Because it's not just a financial/legal benefit matter or a moral/ethical matter, it's all of those at once but can also be neither or only one. You can do the whole "not signing a piece of paper" deal that some couples do where they consider themselves married but the government doesn't (which is entirely foolish because you're depriving yourself of a number of benefits at the one-time cost of like $30 for a half-baked edgelord stance) and you can also get married for reasons other than love or without the intention of staying together forever such as in marriages of convenience when it's beneficial to one or both parties to be married for some reason or amount of time. |
RedRoseFring said: TheBrainintheJar said: Can't you just write a will that says all your property goes to your SO if you die? Do we need the marriage institute for that? You may have other family members or even past lovers coming out of the woodwork to make claims and counter that, or if you have children with multiple partners, etc. It just becomes a mess. Not to mention that requires you to have a) written a will, and b) kept it up-to-date. I didn't have a will until after I had kids, and even then I haven't updated it since I originally wrote it. Despite that I had been married for 7 years before having my first child, so if I had died in an accident anytime in those 7 years my assets would have gone to my wife, whereas had I not been married they would have probably gone to my parents and there would have been disputes over some things. |
RedRoseFring said: TheBrainintheJar said: Can't you just write a will that says all your property goes to your SO if you die? Do we need the marriage institute for that? You may have other family members or even past lovers coming out of the woodwork to make claims and counter that, or if you have children with multiple partners, etc. It just becomes a mess. I see. Well, this kind of justifies the existence of marriage me. Have a delta, as they say in CMV. |
| WEAPONS - My blog, for reviews of music, anime, books, and other things |
| I actually dont but some like to marry as a celebration of their commitment to one another. And its fine. I dont need to nor do I care about marrying and legal stuff are actually a pain in the ass for me. |
Soul-Master said: I actually dont but some like to marry as a celebration of their commitment to one another. And its fine. I dont need to nor do I care about marrying and legal stuff are actually a pain in the ass for me. I think a celebration of every year is more meaningful than marriage. It shows the relationship is still going strong. Also, every reason to party is a good reason. |
| WEAPONS - My blog, for reviews of music, anime, books, and other things |
| well if bae decides to divorce me that way he cant escape till i sign the legal documents.. and he cant steal my shit and get away with it lol! |
| marriage is completely unnecessary to show your love for someone but us as humans have made it so commonplace that it's just a fact of life, you either get married or you dont, no inbetween |
| Man + Woman (marriage) + Babies = Family Family is the basis of society. Society incentivizes (tax benefits, etc.) marriage because it is good for society. As for why "legal unions" weren't good enough... it's not because of discrimination... it's not for tax benefits... it's because people want to be affirmed in their disordered relationships. "You're not doing anything wrong." "What you're doing is 'normal'." |
  |
TheBrainintheJar said: Marriage is entirely meaningless. 'Marriage' should only exist as a system to make sure a children has parents - whether he's adopted or born. You don't want people just having babies without making sure there's a contract binding the parents, else they could jump ship whenever they want to. Other than that, marriage's kind of pointless. I get where you're coming from, but if a parent really wants to abandon his kid I highly doubt a legal contract will stop him/her. |
S-Shiro said: TheBrainintheJar said: I think a celebration of every year is more meaningful than marriage. It shows the relationship is still going strong. Also, every reason to party is a good reason. They do that. It's called an anniversary, lmao. I know, but it deserves more importance than marriage. Marriage is often the 'climax' of the relationship. |
| WEAPONS - My blog, for reviews of music, anime, books, and other things |
Absol said: TheBrainintheJar said: Marriage is entirely meaningless. 'Marriage' should only exist as a system to make sure a children has parents - whether he's adopted or born. You don't want people just having babies without making sure there's a contract binding the parents, else they could jump ship whenever they want to. Other than that, marriage's kind of pointless. I get where you're coming from, but if a parent really wants to abandon his kid I highly doubt a legal contract will stop him/her. It can, because this legal contract makes them easy to trace and easy to fine. Laws also enforce cultural norms. A society in which divorce is hard to get will lead to divorce being less common and less accepted. |
| WEAPONS - My blog, for reviews of music, anime, books, and other things |
More topics from this board
Poll: » school uniform or no school uniform which is better? ( 1 2 )deg - Feb 21 |
92 |
by dreamingneon
»»
11 minutes ago |
|
Poll: » thoughts on social experiments?deg - 3 hours ago |
2 |
by deg
»»
12 minutes ago |
|
» Is fanart cheating?spaceslut - Mar 5, 2023 |
42 |
by dreamingneon
»»
13 minutes ago |
|
» do you like the fandom of your fave musical artists ??ame - Apr 17 |
18 |
by dreamingneon
»»
16 minutes ago |
|
» The level of NoLifer / NEET / Hiki you are?IpreferEcchi - 7 hours ago |
11 |
by juanlqr
»»
18 minutes ago |