[Spoilers] Does Re:Zero have bad writing?

PantsOnHead said:


....are you telling me the author removed their powers just so that he can make a plausible explanation about how Rem followed them to the cave?

Because it certainly can't be that Betelgeuse wanted Rem to find Subaru, "Bring the girl here. If she lives, kill her. If not, bring me her head."

PantsOnHead said:


I'm still waiting for you to point me exactly when Subaru came up with the conclusion that Emilia called herself Satella to protect him.

PantsOnHead said:


If Rem wasn't enough of a mental support for him by episode 15, then why was the trigger for Subaru's mental breakdown (despair, not catatonia) Rem's death? Even after witnessing the charred bodies of the villagers, all he could think about was where Rem was located. It was only after he found out about Rem's death that he started to think about Emilia. Did you not watch episode 14? Thanks for continually feeding me examples of this trope.

AzuStar said:
well, I assumed Rem could follow where they took subaru using his scent, regardless of the method.

Psyotic said:


The first thing, although @Rehls' explanation also works.

Jagd84 said:


Forgotten to respond to this but here from ep 8. BTW, Crunchyroll mistranslated line in last image. It should be inverse, as that anyone hearing say that wouldn't want get involved with her and royal selection.




*cue some brief flashblacks to episode 1 regarding her behavior when comes to her heritage*




Basically Emilia was trying scare him off by making him she was crazy, so that Subaru wouldn't end up getting caught in her troubles in the royal election since somebody was targeting her.
So let's move on from this already.

PantsOnHead said:


I already pointed out the night thing earlier.
...but that doesn't excuse the image he posted of cultists during the night in episode 14.

PantsOnHead said:


You proved that Subaru thinks Emilia called herself Satella because she wishes that she wasn't involved in the royal selection.
You did not prove that Subaru thinks Emilia called herself Satella because she wants to protect him.

Jagd84 said:


This is wrong and I don't blame you for missing it since C.R also mistranslated a little of what happened there. Go back and watch episode 14 and scene the village. Rather than the translation pay attention to the dialogue. Subaru actually say Emi- then switches to Rem before he could finish. He Emilia was actually the first thing on his mind, but eh didn't want imagine her dead so he replaced that thought with Rem instead. THis was also in his internal monologue in the LN.

Psyotic said:


You mean the night in Episode 14, where they could move quickly *if* that's their ability vs the Episode 15 when it is still evening?



I look like the founder of ISIS.
I say I am the founder of ISIS.
Are you still going to help me?

(Great, now I'm on a watchlist)

PantsOnHead said:


You proved that Subaru thinks Emilia called herself Satella because she wishes that she wasn't involved in the royal selection.
You did not prove that Subaru thinks Emilia called herself Satella because she wants to protect him.

PantsOnHead said:


I just rewatched it with headphones on and without subtitles. He still says Rem.

Are you sure the LN translators aren't mixing up the breathing sounds he makes at the start of his speech? Can you give me a link to the line in the LN? I don't mean the translation of the LN. I mean the actual line in japanese.

Rehls said:


@Psyotic @PantsOnHead @Jagd84
Can you guys use spoiler tags on those images? Or I'll have to call a mod to cleanse your mess? Hahah.

Rehls said:


I was just pointing out how skilled they are. They're very apt. It's only natural to expect them to possess something as basic as stun techniques. It's useful in more stealthy activities. Even more when even a maid was shown to know it.

@Psyotic @PantsOnHead @Jagd84
Can you guys use spoiler tags on those images? Or I'll have to call a mod to cleanse your mess? Hahah.

Jagd84 said:


Dude don't be this dense. I preface that last line was mistranslated and you still referred to it. I'm gonna post manga's version and of that scene for comparison and if you still don't get then I give up.



All this of just like in episode 1 has been Emilia looking out for him. She was just beeping dishonest (aka tsundere) about it back then just as Puck said.



Just listen her dialogue just before and after Subaru collapsed. She was trying so hard to pretend not be worried about his condition.

Jagd84 said:


Look again, it's at 24:59-25:00. It's also a whisper.

PantsOnHead said:


You claim the anime is mistranslated, and as "proof" you show me the fan translated manga version.
.....are you serious?

PantsOnHead said:


I just did, again. Why don't you rewatch it with headphones and the volume turned up?
Subaru breaths heavily, and then says 「レム。。。レムは。。。レムはどうしての」

Rehls said:


... And what says that they couldn't simply stun him again?

The images are occupying much space. It's practically spam, duh.

Jagd84 said:


Then maybe you have an issue with you're earphones, because I can hear it clearly. Others such as @Fappa, @Zk4, @NitroKageAki etc can back me up.

Jagd84 said:


Except no? The fanstranstion is actually for the scene in the manga happens a little different because it is done with Puck and instead of Betty in the anime, but still get the same point of the scene across.

Again you're arguing someone has already the work in Japanese. Just admit you're wrong here due to misunderstanding. All most everyone has scene these scenes understood this and those that didn't did after others such as myself made the context clear.

BTW, I added an extra pic under the tags so you can understand flow of conversation better.

PantsOnHead said:


Nope. I think you're confused by the heavy inhaling noise he makes the first time he says "Rem". Its an easy mistake considering "em(ilia)" and "(r)em" sound the same.

Jagd84 said:


Then maybe you have an issue with you're earphones, because I can hear it clearly. Others such as @Fappa, @Z4k, @NitroKageAki etc can back me up.

　首を振り、恐ろしい想像を振り払おうとする。しかし、一度脳裏を過よぎったそれは、振り払おうとするスバルを執しつ拗ように追い詰め、耳元で囁ささやくことで忘却を拒絶する。
　故にスバルは、それから逃れるために最低の手段に縋すがった。その可能性を口にするぐらいならば、それで『彼女』の身が危うくなるぐらいなら。
「レム、は……？　レムは……どう、したんだ……？」

　愛いとしい少女が失われる可能性を口にするぐらいならば、それで自分の心が壊れてしまうぐらいならば、もっと別の生いけ贄にえを差し出してしまえばいいのだと。

EmpirenXD said:
Ok I'm just going to make this thread because I've been thinking about the show as it has been airing.

(Characters)
First point: A lot of flat characters. In the show the total number of round characters I could list is 3-4.
-Subaru.
-Emilia(possibly).
-Rem
-Ram.
Everyone else in the show is flat and simply exist as a sort of nod to "oh ok this character has this archetype, moving on." I'm not saying that they can't potentially become round, but we have a lot of characters that are supposedly vital to the story still be really, really flat.

Second point: Development.

Now here's something I'm very puzzled about. Does Subaru actually know about his power?

It seems he does, he references it, he uses the knowledge when he resets, and he remembers the deaths.

But he doesn't take his ability into account when taking actions or even thinking about the actions.

See right here is a very big problem for me, because I'm not seeing Subaru actually develop as a character. He's still just Subaru from episode 1. Sure, he might be reeling from a recent event, but he's still just Subaru. He hasn't "moved on" to "Subaru 1.5"

All of the rest of the cast's "development" feels very....cliche? I don't want to say cliche, but it just feels like I've seen these events dozens of times before. It's not particularly bad when done right, but events like that with the cgi dogs seemed so incredibly similar to other, mediocre series.

-------------------------------------------------
(Story)

The story in Re:Zero has two sides. Subaru's experience and the final timeline.

See in other series like "Steins;Gate", "Edge of Tommorow", or "Groundhog day" the time reset is on a single event. In Re:Zero it happens constantly and throughout most of the events in the series.


So in Subaru's side we get some character development on Subaru's half(90%) and maybe something from the other characters (10%)

In the final verdict it's......a very generic fantasy tale. Selective ceremonies, dragons, evil witch. All of this stuff is something you'll find in your general fantasy.

So if a person were to just connect the dots of the final verdicts without Subaru's "development"(which it really isn't much), then it's really just your run-of-the-mill story that would be passed over in a heartbeat for something with more "bite" to it.

Which leads me to........
===========================================
Plot devices.

Time resetting is an interesting device. It's rarely used and it's got a lot of potential. However in Re:Zero the actual effects of the time reset are extremely limited. They primarily involve Subaru taking "mental trauma" which at about episode 12 or so you just start not caring because it's a repetitive show of trauma.

Sounds weird right? But let's say that Simba loses his father Mufasa = Trauma
Now he gets an adoptive father, loses him again = Trauma
Another, and another.

You see, other series (steins;gate) show a "wearing down" trauma over time from the experience, while Subaru shows a very ptsd/broken trauma every time the "tragedy" happens in his timeline before he resets.

This creates an issue of repetitive trauma for the viewer as the viewer (eventually) becomes desensitized to the events while the character has not reached that point(and maybe never will).
----------------------------------------------
Death and the Reset button.

Usually death is permanent in series, but since ReZero is about a time reset on death, it should be rather unlike other series.

Unfortunately Re:Zero handles death in an identical manner to other series. The issue here is not that the deaths are still "brutal" or whatever, it's that a lot of them exist just to reset Subaru for an event that has very, very little meaning to the over-arcing plot.

A lot of the events are simply "party up" or "subaru gained a friend." It just comes off as an overly complex way to show a very simple story that isn't particularly deep as far as thematic exploration or actually complex plot.
-----------------------------
Lost and the unanswered question.

Every episode of Re:Zero gives me 3-5 questions and gives me maybe one answer. Lost (a famous TV show) did this exact same thing without ever answering so many of the issues with this show.

Re;Zero does not need a huge exposition episode featuring the witches, it needs a consistently (smart) analysis of the scenario by it's characters. It needs it's character to be naturally curious especially Subaru.
(still waiting on him to define his ability limit and that's from episode 1).
--------------------------------------
Erasing characters is erasing credibility.

IF Rem is gone or removed from the story then the series has essentially removed the point of 5-6 of it's episodes which are focused on Rem/Ram/Subaru's relationships and backstory.

This presents probably the biggest problem the series faces outside of the mess involved with a black hole...........
============================
Subaru 100%

If you don't like Subaru you basically hate the entire show. That's it. Everything revolves around Subaru, everything is about Subaru, and if you dislike how he reacts or what he does, that's it, you dislike the show.

In a related note I am going to say that Subaru borders on the line of a self insert character.

He has a loli harem, a waifu(Emilia), and is constantly "the hero." His otaku/autistic nature, the claims of the fans that his reaction to trauma as "realistic", and his constant "pity me" nature(which oh do the fans pity him) believes me to recognize him as a gary stu. Not in a "always saves the day", but as a huge self insert for the fanbase.


This in total is why I have decided this series has bad writing.

Summary:
It's characters are mostly flat
It's story has a real issue with presentation due to it being generic outside of a single plot device element which I don't feel is properly acclimated to the character or the setting in the series.(it is often forgotten or disregarded until it is conveniently used).
It's story is also full of unanswered questions that take a small amount of time to address and should not be put off for such long periods of time.
If you dislike the MC you dislike the entire series. Outside of "best girl" or "waifu" stuff, you're really left with nothing else but a very bland fantasy.

wrathael said:
This is sad you all get so aggressive because you disagree with someone else's opinion. You could also just not agree without being angry nerds. I do agree the anime is cliche and Subaru is a bad character. It does feel like a harem because the majority of characters in the show are women and they all admire Subaru, constantly complimenting him and stroking his ego. Who cares how Rem and Ram started off treating him for a few episodes, now they both support him growing his harem. Emilia turns him down but continues to be close with him constantly sharing intimate moments. I'm surprised people are defending this for not being a harem. The most consistent male character so far is roswaal and he's constantly in and out of the story. story's cliche, writing is constantly cheesy, he constantly speaks and acts as a chivalrous knight. its just more isekai mass produced garbage which caters to the same demographic. Ya the return to death mechanic is cool, too bad its used behind poorly written 1 dimensional characters ruining its potential to be more then just another fan service anime. You can admit to liking the anime for the character designs but please don't confuse pretty visuals with an interesting story or good writing. In the end the plot is basically, the weeb neet is beloved by everyone. Wow the amount of fan boys living in their mom's basements that can relate.

CesarMagnan said:


But the MC becomes relatable to everyone who watches it and all the plotholes are resolved by season 10 XD

Emillian said:

Plothole? Wtf are you talking about? As hard as i tried to find any of them, this series has NO plothole but only mistery points that doesn't affect the story or make it illogical by some bullsh*t saving situation trope. Also the story developes slow but it developes in a way everything makes sense in the end (and don't worry, everything you need to know comes exactly as the information should be especially till the end of season 2 lmao. At least talk being informed about the situation imo.)

CesarMagnan said:


I gave the show a chance by watching season 1,but I won't watch season 2 due to not finding Subaru journey worth it, I like Frederica design but, with how the show uses Subaru its not worth it for me if you liked it good for you and keep enjoying it. I'd rather watch a compilation of Frederica apperances.

You can admit to liking the anime for the character designs but please don't confuse pretty visuals with an interesting story or good writing.

You can admit to disliking the anime for not liking the character tropes but please don't confuse poor understanding with inferior story or bad writing.

HanashiD4 said:
This is the most cancerous thread I have ever known. Please let this be rotten in hell.