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Poll: Re:Zero kara Hajimeru Isekai Seikatsu Episode 16 Discussion


Jul 18, 2016 10:03 AM

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RainyRai said:
Alright, so I now know that the show doesn't fucking care about Subaru's rapid character change for no reason and is now going along with the idea that arc 1-2 Subaru never fucking existed and arc 3 Subaru is the only one that mattered.

If I decided to forget that I'd probably enjoy the show a lot better.


Oh, man. You people really enjoy ignoring what's occurred. What he's going through must be too complex, huh. There were different circumstances. He didn't have to deal with people at the candidate's level before. And he was bringing Rem with him. He didn't think the issue in the mansion was something he couldn't handle. Because he handled the dogs before (except for the big one). But in his state, he wanted to prove himself that he could. It was selfish of him. You don't have to like it. But don't say that it was OOC. It only applies in an ignored context.
 
Jul 18, 2016 10:09 AM
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Rehls said:
Bananaoranges said:


That's perfectly fine. Everyone is entitled to their own opinion.


If only he hadn't ignored my arguments. That's what he's been doing, if you've noticed. If he brings the same things again, I'll do the same. No need for him to care about it, then.


It happens more often than not. A lot of the negative things people bring up are purely because of their own perspective and nothing to do with how is handling Subaru's character. Honestly, you're not going to change how they see Re:Zero. I personally agree with you, I think the author handled Subaru's character perfectly. In the end it all comes down to your personal tastes, people who dislike the show will continue to do so even if you refute their points. It's hardwired into them, and it's the same for us too.
 
Jul 18, 2016 10:10 AM
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Bananaoranges said:
Rehls said:


If only he hadn't ignored my arguments. That's what he's been doing, if you've noticed. If he brings the same things again, I'll do the same. No need for him to care about it, then.


It happens more often than not. A lot of the negative things people bring up are purely because of their own perspective and nothing to do with how is handling Subaru's character. Honestly, you're not going to change how they see Re:Zero. I personally agree with you, I think the author handled Subaru's character perfectly. In the end it all comes down to your personal tastes, people who dislike the show will continue to do so even if you refute their points. It's hardwired into them, and it's the same for us too.



Pfft... insulting comment on how you don't understand Re:Zero the way it was meant to be understood.
 
Jul 18, 2016 10:14 AM

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In the end, Re:Zero will still get good sales when I think about it so eh
 
Jul 18, 2016 10:31 AM
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a little Spoiler to shut the mouth who complain about Subaru character Development and for thick headed Skull + not pay attention to the story + kiddo
 
Jul 18, 2016 10:32 AM

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Nope, still not feeling sorry for MC cuck.
 
Jul 18, 2016 10:41 AM
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He is learning and progressing in negotiating
Modified by MyPen, Jul 18, 2016 10:45 AM
 
Jul 18, 2016 10:47 AM

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@MyPen You're pretty desperate, aren't you?
Re:Zero nice troll ending.
 
Jul 18, 2016 10:47 AM

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Rehls said:
RainyRai said:
Alright, so I now know that the show doesn't fucking care about Subaru's rapid character change for no reason and is now going along with the idea that arc 1-2 Subaru never fucking existed and arc 3 Subaru is the only one that mattered.

If I decided to forget that I'd probably enjoy the show a lot better.


Oh, man. You people really enjoy ignoring what's occurred. What he's going through must be too complex, huh. There were different circumstances. He didn't have to deal with people at the candidate's level before. And he was bringing Rem with him. He didn't think the issue in the mansion was something he couldn't handle. Because he handled the dogs before (except for the big one). But in his state, he wanted to prove himself that he could. It was selfish of him. You don't have to like it. But don't say that it was OOC. It only applies in an ignored context.

>yes sir, subaru removes any character traits he has in the previous arcs because he was in a different situation
It makes sense if you only pretend arc 3 Subaru is the only Subaru that has existed, but arcs 1-2 Subaru's was established to do different things.

Take this fucking episode for example: "oh look he learned how to negotiate" except the moment he got dropped in, he managed to do successful negotiations by offering what he had up front with a bag of chips and a flip phone. He already knew this. This is not development if you didn't start watching from arc 3.

"Oh Subaru is filled with self-pride and is egotistical" despite the fact that Subaru stated before that he couldn't do jack shit on his own in arc 2.
erased sucks lol what an original opinion
 
Jul 18, 2016 10:55 AM
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Sometimes791 said:
@MyPen You're pretty desperate, aren't you?


yeah... it just... kinda get my nerve. sorry

i've watched so many Generic Anime, still i rated it ten, but this Anime is one of those rare one but major just still dont get it, even if hey rated it 5/5 or 3/5 they probably still dont get the point of the story. (at least they don't whine it)

forgive my misinterpretation, kinda hard to choose the word
Modified by MyPen, Jul 18, 2016 11:01 AM
 
Jul 18, 2016 11:03 AM

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That cliffhanger ending, I really wanted to know what it was at the end and why nobody else noticed that beast thing. Subaru must still be traumatized from his deaths and knowing him he isn't the smartest fish in the sea but it looks like in his next loops he will know how to win the other candidates over
Sasuke or Kaneki I can't decide
 
Jul 18, 2016 11:06 AM

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RainyRai said:
Rehls said:


Oh, man. You people really enjoy ignoring what's occurred. What he's going through must be too complex, huh. There were different circumstances. He didn't have to deal with people at the candidate's level before. And he was bringing Rem with him. He didn't think the issue in the mansion was something he couldn't handle. Because he handled the dogs before (except for the big one). But in his state, he wanted to prove himself that he could. It was selfish of him. You don't have to like it. But don't say that it was OOC. It only applies in an ignored context.

>yes sir, subaru removes any character traits he has in the previous arcs because he was in a different situation
It makes sense if you only pretend arc 3 Subaru is the only Subaru that has existed, but arcs 1-2 Subaru's was established to do different things.

Take this fucking episode for example: "oh look he learned how to negotiate" except the moment he got dropped in, he managed to do successful negotiations by offering what he had up front with a bag of chips and a flip phone. He already knew this. This is not development if you didn't start watching from arc 3.

"Oh Subaru is filled with self-pride and is egotistical" despite the fact that Subaru stated before that he couldn't do jack shit on his own in arc 2.


Yeah, so he brought Rem with him. He learned to rely more on others. I told already why he asked for more help only later. You could say that he could try and negotiate with Anastasia using the phone. But he wasn't pretending to. He hadn't interacted with her before. He wasn't sure if he could rely on her. But then she 'disappointed' him. And after, he was surprised by her personal squad.

Priscilla stated that she could even kill him. Don't think he can bargain with her. And someone like Crusch wouldn't accept a phone. She'd want better. It'd be ridiculous of him to try... And didn't you notice that he was appealing to their good nature? He might've thought that they were more like friends. He doesn't understands well the intricacies of politics... He didn't know how evil Priscilla was. He didn't see her treating him like a toy. He thought she was being nice to him. And he wasn't in a stable state of mind. He was too consumed by hatred, frustration etc... He didn't think well. He wanted to talk with them as soon as possible. He was naive.
 
Jul 18, 2016 11:06 AM

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Damn... I can't stand seeing Subaru being refused, rejected, trolled, blamed and no ones from the candidates willing to help him. Crusch wants benefit, Priscilla crushing a man's pride and Anastasia deceived him, Reinhardt is not in the capital and Roswaal has busy schedule. Man... Being powerless in that kind of world is one of the worst things ever.

It's really not entirely his fault, if it were me maybe I would do something worse than him.

And that whale at the end, are we gonna see another suffering ?!
 
Jul 18, 2016 11:10 AM

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Rehls said:
RainyRai said:

>yes sir, subaru removes any character traits he has in the previous arcs because he was in a different situation
It makes sense if you only pretend arc 3 Subaru is the only Subaru that has existed, but arcs 1-2 Subaru's was established to do different things.

Take this fucking episode for example: "oh look he learned how to negotiate" except the moment he got dropped in, he managed to do successful negotiations by offering what he had up front with a bag of chips and a flip phone. He already knew this. This is not development if you didn't start watching from arc 3.

"Oh Subaru is filled with self-pride and is egotistical" despite the fact that Subaru stated before that he couldn't do jack shit on his own in arc 2.


Yeah, so he brought Rem with him. He learned to rely more on others. I told already why he asked for more help only later. You could say that he could try and negotiate with Anastasia using the phone. But he wasn't pretending to. He hadn't interacted with her before. He wasn't sure if he could rely on her. But then she 'disappointed' him. And after, he was surprised by her personal squad.

Priscilla stated that she could even kill him. Don't think he can bargain with her. And someone like Crusch wouldn't accept a phone. She'd want better. It'd be ridiculous of him to try... And didn't you notice that he was appealing to their good nature? He might've thought that they were more like friends. He doesn't understands well the intricacies of politics... He didn't know how evil Priscilla was. He didn't see her treating him like a toy. He thought she was being nice to him. And he wasn't in a stable state of mind. He was too consumed by hatred, frustration etc... He didn't think well. He wanted to talk with them as soon as possible. He was naive.

"so he brought rem"
I'm talking about his character as a whole in arc 3, who as we all know, is still stuck in his "I can fix everything muh self cause I got magic powers".
"don't think he can bargain everyone else with a phone"
The point is not that he is supposed to offer the phone, the point is that "Subaru learns to negotiate" is not a new trait to his character because he already negotiated by doing what he didn't in this episode: showing what he had to offer and making it what they want in exchange to get what he wants.
erased sucks lol what an original opinion
 
Jul 18, 2016 11:12 AM
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Rumble_Shift said:
Damn... I can't stand seeing Subaru being refused, rejected, trolled, blamed and no ones from the candidates willing to help him. Crusch wants benefit, Priscilla crushing a man's pride and Anastasia deceived him, Reinhardt is not in the capital and Roswaal has busy schedule. Man... Being powerless in that kind of world is one of the worst things ever.

It's really not entirely his fault, if it were me maybe I would do something worse than him.

And that whale at the end, are we gonna see another suffering ?!


Definitely ; )

a powerless MC in a Great show and Great Characters is special.
a powerless MC in a generic show and generic character is generic
 
Jul 18, 2016 11:14 AM

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I would pay to lick Priscilla's feet and be stepped on.
 
Jul 18, 2016 11:14 AM
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purpleninja0006 said:
That cliffhanger ending, I really wanted to know what it was at the end and why nobody else noticed that beast thing. Subaru must still be traumatized from his deaths and knowing him he isn't the smartest fish in the sea but it looks like in his next loops he will know how to win the other candidates over


back to the previous pages, it already mentioned as White Whale
 
Jul 18, 2016 11:19 AM

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RainyRai said:
Rehls said:


Yeah, so he brought Rem with him. He learned to rely more on others. I told already why he asked for more help only later. You could say that he could try and negotiate with Anastasia using the phone. But he wasn't pretending to. He hadn't interacted with her before. He wasn't sure if he could rely on her. But then she 'disappointed' him. And after, he was surprised by her personal squad.

Priscilla stated that she could even kill him. Don't think he can bargain with her. And someone like Crusch wouldn't accept a phone. She'd want better. It'd be ridiculous of him to try... And didn't you notice that he was appealing to their good nature? He might've thought that they were more like friends. He doesn't understands well the intricacies of politics... He didn't know how evil Priscilla was. He didn't see her treating him like a toy. He thought she was being nice to him. And he wasn't in a stable state of mind. He was too consumed by hatred, frustration etc... He didn't think well. He wanted to talk with them as soon as possible. He was naive.

"so he brought rem"
I'm talking about his character as a whole in arc 3, who as we all know, is still stuck in his "I can fix everything muh self cause I got magic powers".
"don't think he can bargain everyone else with a phone"
The point is not that he is supposed to offer the phone, the point is that "Subaru learns to negotiate" is not a new trait to his character because he already negotiated by doing what he didn't in this episode: showing what he had to offer and making it what they want in exchange to get what he wants.


Well, haven't you seen him thinking about abusing the RbD? It gave him a good amount of confidence. And he wasn't sure about how serious the issue in the mansion was. He learned that it was beyond what he could handle.

You didn't get that it wasn't his approach. He appealed to their good nature. By warning them about a mutual threat and such. He couldn't believe that they'd ignore it. And what else could he offer? Money wouldn't do it. His indebtment isn't worth much. So, what?
 
Jul 18, 2016 11:19 AM

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RainyRai said:

Take this fucking episode for example: "oh look he learned how to negotiate" except the moment he got dropped in, he managed to do successful negotiations by offering what he had up front with a bag of chips and a flip phone. He already knew this. This is not development if you didn't start watching from arc 3.

Assuming that the negotiations with uneducated street thugs is at the same level of negotiating with ruler candidates. have you even thought what he could offer to someone who is a candidate to the throne?

Bananaoranges said:
Rehls said:


If only he hadn't ignored my arguments. That's what he's been doing, if you've noticed. If he brings the same things again, I'll do the same. No need for him to care about it, then.


It happens more often than not. A lot of the negative things people bring up are purely because of their own perspective and nothing to do with how is handling Subaru's character. Honestly, you're not going to change how they see Re:Zero. I personally agree with you, I think the author handled Subaru's character perfectly. In the end it all comes down to your personal tastes, people who dislike the show will continue to do so even if you refute their points. It's hardwired into them, and it's the same for us too.

couldn't have said it better myself.
 
Jul 18, 2016 11:21 AM
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Shigure said:
I would pay to lick Priscilla's feet and be stepped on.


a-are you sure?










my reaction
 
Jul 18, 2016 11:23 AM
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RainyRai said:
Rehls said:


Oh, man. You people really enjoy ignoring what's occurred. What he's going through must be too complex, huh. There were different circumstances. He didn't have to deal with people at the candidate's level before. And he was bringing Rem with him. He didn't think the issue in the mansion was something he couldn't handle. Because he handled the dogs before (except for the big one). But in his state, he wanted to prove himself that he could. It was selfish of him. You don't have to like it. But don't say that it was OOC. It only applies in an ignored context.

>yes sir, subaru removes any character traits he has in the previous arcs because he was in a different situation
It makes sense if you only pretend arc 3 Subaru is the only Subaru that has existed, but arcs 1-2 Subaru's was established to do different things.

Take this fucking episode for example: "oh look he learned how to negotiate" except the moment he got dropped in, he managed to do successful negotiations by offering what he had up front with a bag of chips and a flip phone. He already knew this. This is not development if you didn't start watching from arc 3.

"Oh Subaru is filled with self-pride and is egotistical" despite the fact that Subaru stated before that he couldn't do jack shit on his own in arc 2.


The whole negotiation process from this episode does not negate Arc 1 Subaru's development in that area. The reason he was so advantageous in that first negotiation was because of his bargaining chips that worked in his favor, being the phone and chips. This time around, he's learning what he can use as bargaining chips against the candidates. It's illogical to conclude that since Subaru was successful in negotiations in arc 1 he can't possibly fail in negotiations in arc 3, or it would simply erase arc 1 Subaru as a whole.

Also, I don't understand how anyone can call Subaru prideful from this arc when this episode showed his willingness to cast his pride aside and agree to Priscilla's demands AND seek aid from his opponents to no avail. He was ready to suck it up and seek help. In fact this carries over from his development in arc 2 which established that he is powerless by himself.
 
Jul 18, 2016 11:30 AM

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Rehls said:
RainyRai said:

"so he brought rem"
I'm talking about his character as a whole in arc 3, who as we all know, is still stuck in his "I can fix everything muh self cause I got magic powers".
"don't think he can bargain everyone else with a phone"
The point is not that he is supposed to offer the phone, the point is that "Subaru learns to negotiate" is not a new trait to his character because he already negotiated by doing what he didn't in this episode: showing what he had to offer and making it what they want in exchange to get what he wants.


Well, haven't you seen him thinking about abusing the RbD? It gave him a good amount of confidence. And he wasn't sure about how serious the issue in the mansion was. He learned that it was beyond what he could handle.

You didn't get that it wasn't his approach. He appealed to their good nature. By warning them about a mutual threat and such. He couldn't believe that they'd ignore it. And what else could he offer? Money wouldn't do it. His indebtment isn't worth much. So, what?

And like I said, he only starts thinking about abusing the RbD in arc 3 only, with no inclination of transition.
>he appealed to good nature and had nothing else to offer
Except the message of the episode was that Subaru was treating them as an object of want; he never brought anything to the table that he could offer in the first place; those were simply brought up by the opposition. Subaru didn't know what he was doing.
RinFTW said:
RainyRai said:

Take this fucking episode for example: "oh look he learned how to negotiate" except the moment he got dropped in, he managed to do successful negotiations by offering what he had up front with a bag of chips and a flip phone. He already knew this. This is not development if you didn't start watching from arc 3.

Assuming that the negotiations with uneducated street thugs is at the same level of negotiating with ruler candidates. have you even thought what he could offer to someone who is a candidate to the throne?

The point was never what he could offer. One of the points of this episode was that Subaru learns to bring something to the table in the proposal first instead of going in and begging(as seen at the end where he changes his words to "I have a proposal" instead of "I need help" and offers to pay Otto and his friends with a large sum for help.)
And my argument is that Subaru already knew how to do that the moment he was thrown in the world. It doesn't matter that Felt and Rom are a lot lower class; with the candidates, Subaru never tried to offer anything in the first place, he was just plain asking them.
erased sucks lol what an original opinion
 
Jul 18, 2016 11:31 AM

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trannon1 said:

Finally, Subaru is naive. Obviously we can't blame him for being naive, but he could have at least tried to read the mood. The scene where he proclaimed himself to be Emilia's knight was very cringeworthy and I am of the opinion that he has grown too overconfident with himself. After saving people, he has gained a Messiah complex. To want gratitude after saving someone, that can no longer be called saving, that is just give and take. Is Subaru the protagonist of some light novel or something. Well he is of course, but he doesn't know that. The world doesn't revolve around him, but Subaru started thinking it did after he solved the previous two loops, which ends up alienating him from everyone else.


I do not exactly understood this knight scene. Was it a crime? Is it forbidden to be a knight without any experience?
 
Jul 18, 2016 11:34 AM
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Rehls said:
He appealed to their good nature. By warning them about a mutual threat and such. He couldn't believe that they'd ignore it. And what else could he offer? Money wouldn't do it. His indebtment isn't worth much. So, what?
Anastasia told him outright, he was just too angry with being deceived to properly process the huge clue she gave him.

He needs to find out what the candidates want or need. In their case, information is worth far more than money, trinkets or the indebtment of a character of questionable usefulness. He finds out what they want to know, then go try to get that info. It would normally be close to impossible, but his ability to return in time would give him a huge edge since he can "reuse" whatever info he gets on the negotiations.

Of course, it requires some brain as well as the determination to kill himself as many times as necessary, which might be well beyond him. But it's a possible path.
"Against stupidity the gods themselves contend in vain"
Friedrich Schiller
 
Jul 18, 2016 11:40 AM

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Ein said:
RainyRai said:

>yes sir, subaru removes any character traits he has in the previous arcs because he was in a different situation
It makes sense if you only pretend arc 3 Subaru is the only Subaru that has existed, but arcs 1-2 Subaru's was established to do different things.

Take this fucking episode for example: "oh look he learned how to negotiate" except the moment he got dropped in, he managed to do successful negotiations by offering what he had up front with a bag of chips and a flip phone. He already knew this. This is not development if you didn't start watching from arc 3.

"Oh Subaru is filled with self-pride and is egotistical" despite the fact that Subaru stated before that he couldn't do jack shit on his own in arc 2.


The whole negotiation process from this episode does not negate Arc 1 Subaru's development in that area. The reason he was so advantageous in that first negotiation was because of his bargaining chips that worked in his favor, being the phone and chips. This time around, he's learning what he can use as bargaining chips against the candidates. It's illogical to conclude that since Subaru was successful in negotiations in arc 1 he can't possibly fail in negotiations in arc 3, or it would simply erase arc 1 Subaru as a whole.

Also, I don't understand how anyone can call Subaru prideful from this arc when this episode showed his willingness to cast his pride aside and agree to Priscilla's demands AND seek aid from his opponents to no avail. He was ready to suck it up and seek help. In fact this carries over from his development in arc 2 which established that he is powerless by himself.

>he's learning what to use as chips
No, he's starting to learn to stop treating others as "I want something from you" and that you can't do that, you have to bring a beneficial relationship to the table. The problem is not that Subaru would win negotiations, the problem is that Subaru does not try to to negotiate like he did before. Before he did have bargaining chips, but you could see that he would try to do other stuff as well. Here, he does not offer anything. Crusch brings up the idea of Emilia dropping out. Priscilla brings up the idea of Subaru licking her feet. Anastasia brings up talking to Subaru. Subaru did not do anything.

>he was ready to suck it up and seek help
When right before episode 15, he was going "I am the reason stuff went okay, I have return by death so I can fix things, they just don't know it", and now in episode 16 he is sucking up to Priscilla. The difference is that the message in this episode is that Subaru is being a greedy pig who only sees Priscilla as something that can provide what he wants, and he doesn't think about the proposal she is actually offering to him. Otherwise he went straight from "i am zee best" to "pig" with no provocation.
erased sucks lol what an original opinion
 
Jul 18, 2016 11:43 AM

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RainyRai said:
Rehls said:


Well, haven't you seen him thinking about abusing the RbD? It gave him a good amount of confidence. And he wasn't sure about how serious the issue in the mansion was. He learned that it was beyond what he could handle.

You didn't get that it wasn't his approach. He appealed to their good nature. By warning them about a mutual threat and such. He couldn't believe that they'd ignore it. And what else could he offer? Money wouldn't do it. His indebtment isn't worth much. So, what?

And like I said, he only starts thinking about abusing the RbD in arc 3 only, with no inclination of transition.


The inclination was his desperation, of wanting to find worth in himself after being cast aside by Emilia. And prove her somehow that she needs him.
 
Jul 18, 2016 11:49 AM

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MyPen said:
Sometimes791 said:
@MyPen You're pretty desperate, aren't you?


yeah... it just... kinda get my nerve. sorry

i've watched so many Generic Anime, still i rated it ten, but this Anime is one of those rare one but major just still dont get it, even if hey rated it 5/5 or 3/5 they probably still dont get the point of the story. (at least they don't whine it)

forgive my misinterpretation, kinda hard to choose the word


My exact thoughts. I honestly enjoy reading the novels these guys write about how shitty Subaru is and how he's OOC (I hate this term). Its frustarting when you present your arguement to make them see the other side and they put up a wall. I've never seen anything like it

But like a guy here said earlier. Opinions are opinions and we cant change theirs and their view. So we just have to stop
 
Jul 18, 2016 11:51 AM

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_Hans_ said:
MyPen said:


yeah... it just... kinda get my nerve. sorry

i've watched so many Generic Anime, still i rated it ten, but this Anime is one of those rare one but major just still dont get it, even if hey rated it 5/5 or 3/5 they probably still dont get the point of the story. (at least they don't whine it)

forgive my misinterpretation, kinda hard to choose the word


My exact thoughts. I honestly enjoy reading the novels these guys write about how shitty Subaru is and how he's OOC (I hate this term). Its frustarting when you present your arguement to make them see the other side and they put up a wall. I've never seen anything like it

But like a guy here said earlier. Opinions are opinions and we cant change theirs and their view. So we just have to stop


But it's still not as bad as in the UBW discussion threads.
Re:Zero nice troll ending.
 
Jul 18, 2016 11:54 AM
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Diwo said:
trannon1 said:

Finally, Subaru is naive. Obviously we can't blame him for being naive, but he could have at least tried to read the mood. The scene where he proclaimed himself to be Emilia's knight was very cringeworthy and I am of the opinion that he has grown too overconfident with himself. After saving people, he has gained a Messiah complex. To want gratitude after saving someone, that can no longer be called saving, that is just give and take. Is Subaru the protagonist of some light novel or something. Well he is of course, but he doesn't know that. The world doesn't revolve around him, but Subaru started thinking it did after he solved the previous two loops, which ends up alienating him from everyone else.


I do not exactly understood this knight scene. Was it a crime? Is it forbidden to be a knight without any experience?


It's not that. Anyone can learn to be a knight. But this is on the level of personal knight. Basically a person who would live for you and die for you. Will be with you through heaven and hell. The thing is, a personal knight is a person who will definitely protect their master no matter what.

It wouldn't be a problem if he actually had the qualities of a knight. This one is a particularly important job too, since its a personal knight. Basically, I would compare them to the SS of the President. You don't become one just because you want to become one. Subaru at this point thinks that he is the only one who can save people, ergo of his inflated ego. You see the reactions of all the other personal knights. They all works hard to becomes the personal knights of their masters, but Subaru just skipped through the formalities as if he were a boss. Not to mention that he did so against Emilia's wishes.
 
Jul 18, 2016 11:54 AM

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Rehls said:
Hey, I got it that he blamed her, for not trusting him. It was obvious. So you just said that he blamed himself instead? Could've been both, or not. If were, I'd think the blame was more on Rem. Because he was pretty confident. Which was shattered later on. Oh there was this line "I thought you would understand me..." So she basically disappoints him.


When Subaru was in the back of the wagon en route to Rem, rather than his usual rage after being shot down by others, it appeared he was slumping more in despair after the initial anger had passed. A part of him was obviously angry at being abandoned, but he was also aware she did what she did to protect him, and the fact she thought that way would've hurt more than the rest given - as he said - he thought her, of everyone, would understand him. That even she abandoned him must have made him feel some level of guilt over his failings or else he would've remained angry.

There was no acceptance from him he was too weak to help, hence him going after her, but to me he seemed down that the one person with faith in him thought the same as everyone else.

Ein said:
The whole negotiation process from this episode does not negate Arc 1 Subaru's development in that area. The reason he was so advantageous in that first negotiation was because of his bargaining chips that worked in his favor, being the phone and chips.

Also, I don't understand how anyone can call Subaru prideful from this arc when this episode showed his willingness to cast his pride aside and agree to Priscilla's demands


The reason he was more successful negotiating in the first arc is less to do with bargaining chips and more to do with the fact he was dealing with a child and a giant. He could hardly pull out his phone with candidates for the throne and exchange it for an army of knights. But, yeah: in no way was it character regression on Subaru's part that he didn't whip out his phone. His attitude towards negotiating changed, but that was borne out of desperation and growing frustration.

As for pride, Subaru's pride seems very specific: he's willing to sacrifice himself for Emilia, and if that means licking feet, no problem. But the moment it is suggested he is in any way inadequate, he digs his feet in or responds with anger. Whether it was during the 'I AM KNIGHT' cringe or when the green-haired character + catboy warned him he was powerless, he does not back down or submit when challenged, and that is because he won't throw away his pride.

trannon1 said:
I was trying to have a civil conversation though, he was the one who called my words bullshit from the very beginning. If you look at my past posts, I haven't been aggressive with my language and make my points logically, but apparently its all bullshit to him.


It isn't a matter of whether you were civil or not, or who started what: if someone is putting up a wall and refusing to accept your stance, a smart person would shrug their shoulders and let them get on with it. If a wall in real life blocked you, would you stand beating your head against it or walk around it? Apply some real life logic to e-interactions and it's much less irksome for all.
Modified by AironicallyHuman, Jul 18, 2016 11:59 AM
 
Jul 18, 2016 11:56 AM

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Sometimes791 said:
_Hans_ said:


My exact thoughts. I honestly enjoy reading the novels these guys write about how shitty Subaru is and how he's OOC (I hate this term). Its frustarting when you present your arguement to make them see the other side and they put up a wall. I've never seen anything like it

But like a guy here said earlier. Opinions are opinions and we cant change theirs and their view. So we just have to stop


But it's still not as bad as in the UBW discussion threads.


Oh god yes! Forgot about those bad boys. I cant wait to read those Heavens feels threads when the movie drops
 
Jul 18, 2016 11:57 AM

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_Hans_ said:
Sometimes791 said:


But it's still not as bad as in the UBW discussion threads.


Oh god yes! I cant wait to read those Heavens feels threads when the movie drops


#rip MAL 2017 haha
Re:Zero nice troll ending.
 
Jul 18, 2016 12:04 PM
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RainyRai said:
Rehls said:


Well, haven't you seen him thinking about abusing the RbD? It gave him a good amount of confidence. And he wasn't sure about how serious the issue in the mansion was. He learned that it was beyond what he could handle.

You didn't get that it wasn't his approach. He appealed to their good nature. By warning them about a mutual threat and such. He couldn't believe that they'd ignore it. And what else could he offer? Money wouldn't do it. His indebtment isn't worth much. So, what?

And like I said, he only starts thinking about abusing the RbD in arc 3 only, with no inclination of transition.
>he appealed to good nature and had nothing else to offer
Except the message of the episode was that Subaru was treating them as an object of want; he never brought anything to the table that he could offer in the first place; those were simply brought up by the opposition. Subaru didn't know what he was doing.
RinFTW said:

Assuming that the negotiations with uneducated street thugs is at the same level of negotiating with ruler candidates. have you even thought what he could offer to someone who is a candidate to the throne?

The point was never what he could offer. One of the points of this episode was that Subaru learns to bring something to the table in the proposal first instead of going in and begging(as seen at the end where he changes his words to "I have a proposal" instead of "I need help" and offers to pay Otto and his friends with a large sum for help.)
And my argument is that Subaru already knew how to do that the moment he was thrown in the world. It doesn't matter that Felt and Rom are a lot lower class; with the candidates, Subaru never tried to offer anything in the first place, he was just plain asking them.


He did the same with Felt and Rom. He asked for the emblem, he didn't say ''I have an offer''. He didn't think about it as a negotiation until Rom said ''It won't be for free''.

Same here, except this time he LEARNED that no one will actually do something for free.

EDIT : I'm too lazy to get into a big argument, I was just stating what I thought by reading this. Let's not get into a ''Who has the thickest wall'' war, mmh?
Modified by AmejiHunter, Jul 18, 2016 12:10 PM
 
Jul 18, 2016 12:06 PM
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RainyRai said:
Ein said:


The whole negotiation process from this episode does not negate Arc 1 Subaru's development in that area. The reason he was so advantageous in that first negotiation was because of his bargaining chips that worked in his favor, being the phone and chips. This time around, he's learning what he can use as bargaining chips against the candidates. It's illogical to conclude that since Subaru was successful in negotiations in arc 1 he can't possibly fail in negotiations in arc 3, or it would simply erase arc 1 Subaru as a whole.

Also, I don't understand how anyone can call Subaru prideful from this arc when this episode showed his willingness to cast his pride aside and agree to Priscilla's demands AND seek aid from his opponents to no avail. He was ready to suck it up and seek help. In fact this carries over from his development in arc 2 which established that he is powerless by himself.

>he's learning what to use as chips
No, he's starting to learn to stop treating others as "I want something from you" and that you can't do that, you have to bring a beneficial relationship to the table. The problem is not that Subaru would win negotiations, the problem is that Subaru does not try to to negotiate like he did before. Before he did have bargaining chips, but you could see that he would try to do other stuff as well. Here, he does not offer anything. Crusch brings up the idea of Emilia dropping out. Priscilla brings up the idea of Subaru licking her feet. Anastasia brings up talking to Subaru. Subaru did not do anything.

>he was ready to suck it up and seek help
When right before episode 15, he was going "I am the reason stuff went okay, I have return by death so I can fix things, they just don't know it", and now in episode 16 he is sucking up to Priscilla. The difference is that the message in this episode is that Subaru is being a greedy pig who only sees Priscilla as something that can provide what he wants, and he doesn't think about the proposal she is actually offering to him. Otherwise he went straight from "i am zee best" to "pig" with no provocation.


..He really has nothing to offer. Before, he would try different approaches but that path is not open to him this time. He's facing way more threatening opponents in the negotiations with much less options. The point is there isn't any approach he could take with them besides bargaining for their assistance. It's really just a "might as well" situation where he has nothing to lose by requesting their aid and trying to bargain for it. Back in arc 1, he tried things like meeting Felt before she got to the loothouse but options like that are not available to Subaru this time around. He is much more limited in those tactics.

Also, I don't think his greed with Priscilla is contradictory with him sacrificing his pride and ego. That just shows that hes twisted even when commiting what would normally be a noble act. Also wouldn't the provocation be everything that happened between before episode 15 until now?
 
Jul 18, 2016 12:18 PM

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MyPen said:
Sometimes791 said:
@MyPen You're pretty desperate, aren't you?


yeah... it just... kinda get my nerve. sorry

i've watched so many Generic Anime, still i rated it ten, but this Anime is one of those rare one but major just still dont get it, even if hey rated it 5/5 or 3/5 they probably still dont get the point of the story. (at least they don't whine it)

forgive my misinterpretation, kinda hard to choose the word


What is the point of the story from your opinion?
 
Jul 18, 2016 12:20 PM

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Diwo said:
trannon1 said:

Finally, Subaru is naive. Obviously we can't blame him for being naive, but he could have at least tried to read the mood. The scene where he proclaimed himself to be Emilia's knight was very cringeworthy and I am of the opinion that he has grown too overconfident with himself. After saving people, he has gained a Messiah complex. To want gratitude after saving someone, that can no longer be called saving, that is just give and take. Is Subaru the protagonist of some light novel or something. Well he is of course, but he doesn't know that. The world doesn't revolve around him, but Subaru started thinking it did after he solved the previous two loops, which ends up alienating him from everyone else.


I do not exactly understood this knight scene. Was it a crime? Is it forbidden to be a knight without any experience?


Someone unqualified as him to be considered qualified would be considered an insult for the profession by those that are much more qualified. And it's a great responsibility. Subaru's weak. He'd let people die, instead of protecting them... He's been doing it.
 
Jul 18, 2016 12:21 PM

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@MyPen Im actually curious too homie, as to your point of view of Re:zero as a whole and the point of the story.
 
Jul 18, 2016 12:54 PM

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nobody dies this episode. Boring. 0/10
(joke)
"This emotion is mine alone.
It is for Madoka alone." - Homura
or how I would descripe Mahou Shoujo Madoka Magica.
 
Jul 18, 2016 12:57 PM

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Subaru got kicked in the face +1
Rem was lovely and cute +1

2/5

Not joke. ;)
 
Jul 18, 2016 1:04 PM

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For a moment, I really thought she was going to let him lick her feet O_o

He clearly needs help to save Ram and the others, but he can't do it with his current approach.

I hope he dies soon... so that he can reset and properly ask for help. I hope that this "lesson" is burned into his mind.

If that lady asks him to lick her feet again, he should stand up and walk away. Perhaps it will display that he actually have a honor (which is most likely very important in that "era").

As for the others, he should think of how it would benefit them.

For some reason, I want that little Felt to help him... but from what we've seen from the first arc, she's going to get murdered without assistance.

 
Jul 18, 2016 1:20 PM
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Devil_Slayer said:
subaru was totall joke in this episode "giving me ep 13 deja-vu " there no writer in my memory made his MC a big joke

subaru have his rage and emotion controlling him he need to chill and think in proper way ,no one will listen to you if you keep saying "i want , i want , i want " and no one will know what you been through

anyway this ep conformed the candidates are bunch of bitches , like really the blonde and purple hair are totally bitches , i still think he could had Crush on his side if he used his mind

Man he has been killed and had seen his love ones being killed several times and you ask him to chill, you clearly don't know what ptsd is
 
Jul 18, 2016 1:22 PM

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_Hans_ said:
Sometimes791 said:


But it's still not as bad as in the UBW discussion threads.


Oh god yes! Forgot about those bad boys. I cant wait to read those Heavens feels threads when the movie drops

you know, We are all still here. In the Re:Zero subforum :p. This is just a taste of what's to come.

@Rainyrai
While i agree with you on Arc3 Subaru being a different Character, acting like he did in ep16 atleast made sense, considering what happened in ep15. A 'Recession' now is acceptable and makes sense, unlike what came out of nowhere in ep12-14.

_Hans_ said:

My exact thoughts. I honestly enjoy reading the novels these guys write about how shitty Subaru is and how he's OOC (I hate this term). Its frustarting when you present your arguement to make them see the other side and they put up a wall.

Ya know, i don't want to make this personal or say anything about anyone, but you guys are also 'building Walls' when we present our arguements and keep calling everyone with a different opinion an Idiot and telling them to drop the show even tough they like it.

Also,
Anything Priscilla does, Rem can do better
 
Jul 18, 2016 1:28 PM

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Shrimperor said:
_Hans_ said:


Oh god yes! Forgot about those bad boys. I cant wait to read those Heavens feels threads when the movie drops

you know, We are all still here. In the Re:Zero subforum :p. This is just a taste of what's to come.

@Rainyrai
While i agree with you on Arc3 Subaru being a different Character, acting like he did in ep16 atleast made sense, considering what happened in ep15. A 'Recession' now is acceptable and makes sense, unlike what came out of nowhere in ep12-14.

_Hans_ said:

My exact thoughts. I honestly enjoy reading the novels these guys write about how shitty Subaru is and how he's OOC (I hate this term). Its frustarting when you present your arguement to make them see the other side and they put up a wall.

Ya know, i don't want to make this personal or say anything about anyone, but you guys are also 'building Walls' when we present our arguements and keep calling everyone with a different opinion an Idiot and telling them to drop the show even tough they like it.

Also,
Anything Priscilla does, Rem can do better


You're absolutely right. It took me a minute to realize that. We all are just swinging are dicks arouund trying to see who's is bigger (That was a interesting analogy but bear with it) We aren't going to change each others views but I just hope as we look at each others different viewpoints, we learn. That's all.

We gotta stop this Subaru bickering every week. Its lost its luster. Im not laughing anymore
Modified by _Hans_, Jul 18, 2016 1:38 PM
 
Jul 18, 2016 1:30 PM

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@Shrimperor

Also, thank you for that Rem pic.

Im adding it to my collection ( ͡° ͜ʖ ͡°) Waifu is too cute
 
Jul 18, 2016 1:35 PM
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Raven_Wingz said:
Subaru got kicked in the face +1
Rem was lovely and cute +1

2/5

Not joke. ;)


You really gotta fix your way of rating things huh
 
Jul 18, 2016 1:42 PM

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_Hans_ said:

You're absolutely right. It took me a minute to realize that. We all are just swinging are dicks arouund trying to see who's is bigger (That was a interesting analogy but bear with it) We aren't going to change each others views but I just hope as we look at each others different viewpoints, we learn. That's all.

True. Tbh, the arguing is even fun sometimes, but when it turns personal and people start calling each other Idiots and stuff, it just gets ugly.

_Hans_ said:
@Shrimperor

Also, thank you for that Rem pic.

Im adding it to my collection ( ͡° ͜ʖ ͡°) Waifu is too cute

Np np :D
Well, here is a 300+ Rem Album i got from Reddit
http://imgur.com/a/jBrIW
 
Jul 18, 2016 1:49 PM

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Shrimperor said:
_Hans_ said:

You're absolutely right. It took me a minute to realize that. We all are just swinging are dicks arouund trying to see who's is bigger (That was a interesting analogy but bear with it) We aren't going to change each others views but I just hope as we look at each others different viewpoints, we learn. That's all.

True. Tbh, the arguing is even fun sometimes, but when it turns personal and people start calling each other Idiots and stuff, it just gets ugly.

_Hans_ said:
@Shrimperor

Also, thank you for that Rem pic.

Im adding it to my collection ( ͡° ͜ʖ ͡°) Waifu is too cute

Np np :D
Well, here is a 300+ Rem Album i got from Reddit
http://imgur.com/a/jBrIW


Yes, these threads are fun sometimes. Apologies for my earlier comment.

Oh look at all this Rem goodness ( ͡° ͜ʖ ͡°)( ͡°( ͡° ͜ʖ( ͡° ͜ʖ ͡°)ʖ ͡°) ͡°) you're a good man
 
Jul 18, 2016 1:53 PM

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FrozenSheep said:
For a moment, I really thought she was going to let him lick her feet O_o

He clearly needs help to save Ram and the others, but he can't do it with his current approach.

I hope he dies soon... so that he can reset and properly ask for help. I hope that this "lesson" is burned into his mind.

If that lady asks him to lick her feet again, he should stand up and walk away. Perhaps it will display that he actually have a honor (which is most likely very important in that "era").

As for the others, he should think of how it would benefit them.

For some reason, I want that little Felt to help him... but from what we've seen from the first arc, she's going to get murdered without assistance.

Hindsight 20/20?

Either way he wouldn't be able to get anything from her.
 
Jul 18, 2016 2:03 PM

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This show became my favor after the foot scene .. DAMN JUST LET HIM LICK THE FUCKING FEET
 
Jul 18, 2016 2:10 PM

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damn both of those candidates were bitches and shit that ending
 
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