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#1
Feb 3, 2016 2:26 PM

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A thread for people to place and discuss about anything related Anime Studios financial situation.

I will start by placing some financial data of kyoto animation, Bones, Sunrise, A-1 Pictures, Studio Ghibli, Toei Animation.

Note:
Sales = Revenue
Net Income
Gross Profit = Sales - Cost of Sales
Worth = Shareholders Equity = Equity = Capital + Retained Earnings - Treasury Stock

Main Anime Studios, Year Net Sales(In Yen)
TEIKOKU DATABANK Reports!
Note: Is not the fiscal year! I believe is exactly the entire year.


Anime Studios Profiles




Toei Animation 2015 3rd quarter sales(April 1, 2015 to December 31, 2015)

Toei Animation 2015 Operating Results(April 1, 2015 to March 31, 2016)


Toei Animation 2016 1st Quarter Results(April 1, 2016 to Jun 30, 2016)


Toei Animation 2016 3rd Quarter Results(April 1, 2016 to Dec 31, 2016)
Modified by bigivelfhq, Feb 10, 2017 3:27 PM
 
#2
Feb 3, 2016 2:40 PM

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so, ghibli does bad job recently, that's sad to hear. hope can be better in upcoming result (should be next march right?)

toei stay strong! "almost died" they said. lOl

correct me if i am wrong. doesn't really understand the tabble.
"If taking responsibility for a mistake that cannot be undone means death, it's not that hard to die. At least, not as hard as to live on."
 
#3
Feb 3, 2016 2:50 PM

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Well, Ghibli did nothing in 2014 Fiscal Year. They are right now only a Licensing Business, meaning that Sales and so Income will not be big. Still is doing better than every anime studio here with the exception of Sunrise and Toei Animation.

Yep, Toei Animation is staying strong. And in the 3rd Quarter of this Fiscal Year(2015) already is the best income Toei Animation had in the last 5 years.
Modified by bigivelfhq, Feb 4, 2016 5:58 AM
 
#4
Feb 3, 2016 2:51 PM
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Kyoto Animation:
$14k in 1 year? That's it?! That's their profit? This factors in the costs of producing anime right?
My bad...That's about $1.4 million
More great animation from them in the future xD

Bones:
So they lost money here? That's actually sad to hear..

Sunrise:
I don't give a shit about them..Their studio can die for all I care.

A-1 Pictures:
So they made approximately $1 million in 1 year? That's good to hear..Glad A-1 Pictures is still in business. They just need to fix the way they treat their workers.

Toei Animation:
Holy shit! $20 million in gross profit? Man, they sure are milking One Piece and their other long running anime shows.

Modified by jc9622, Feb 3, 2016 3:08 PM
 
#5
Feb 3, 2016 2:56 PM

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I just finished reading the Toei first quarter financial report and it seems like those guys were caking it in the first quarter. Their legends fucking suck, by the way.

My education is finally doing me some good. The irony.

what a waste of my fucking money

Foreign sales made less than 21% of sales at the highest point in the quarter and people still make threads about the industry like it belongs to us.
I'm also filled with pure-hearted ulterior motives.

 
#6
Feb 3, 2016 2:58 PM

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Hutch_1945 said:
I'm going to use Kyoto Animation....Sales and Income for Year 2014-2015

$14k in 1 year? That's their profit? This factors in the costs of producing anime right?


Is not 14k dollars, but 1.4 Million dollars. And Gross Profit is after removing every costs and expenses. This means after paying all the employees, paying the common building expenses(water, Electricity, ...), paying the Building loan, paying the Country Taxes, paying debts and so on.

Holybaptiser said:
I just finished reading the Toei first quarter financial report and it seems like those guys were caking it in the first quarter. Their legends fucking suck, by the way.

My education is finally doing me some good. The irony.

what a waste of my fucking money

Foreign sales made less than 21% of sales at the highest point in the quarter and people still make threads about the industry like it belongs to us.


Caking it? Sorry, but I really don't understand what you mean.

Mod edit: Please don't double post. Edit your last post instead
Modified by Ardanaz, Feb 4, 2016 1:05 PM
 
#7
Feb 3, 2016 3:00 PM

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bigivelfhq said:
Holybaptiser said:
I just finished reading the Toei first quarter financial report and it seems like those guys were caking it in the first quarter. Their legends fucking suck, by the way.

My education is finally doing me some good. The irony.

what a waste of my fucking money

Foreign sales made less than 21% of sales at the highest point in the quarter and people still make threads about the industry like it belongs to us.


Caking it? Sorry, but I really don't understand what you mean.
Slang for making money. Stupid rap songs get to me sometimes.
I'm also filled with pure-hearted ulterior motives.

 
#8
Feb 3, 2016 3:02 PM
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bigivelfhq said:
Hutch_1945 said:
I'm going to use Kyoto Animation....Sales and Income for Year 2014-2015

$14k in 1 year? That's their profit? This factors in the costs of producing anime right?


Is not 14k dollars, but 1.4 Million dollars. And Gross Profit is after removing every costs and expenses. This means after paying all the employees, paying the common building expenses(water, Electricity, ...), paying the Building loan, paying the Country Taxes, paying debts and so on.
Yea, my bad..I made a mistake while converting yen to dollars.
 
#9
Feb 3, 2016 3:10 PM
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bigivelfhq said:


Is not 14k dollars, but 1.4 Million dollars. And Gross Profit is after removing every costs and expenses. This means after paying all the employees, paying the common building expenses(water, Electricity, ...), paying the Building loan, paying the Country Taxes, paying debts and so on.


Isn't gross before all that stuff (the total), and then net is the profit after all that?
 
Feb 3, 2016 3:15 PM

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ostiniatoze said:
bigivelfhq said:


Is not 14k dollars, but 1.4 Million dollars. And Gross Profit is after removing every costs and expenses. This means after paying all the employees, paying the common building expenses(water, Electricity, ...), paying the Building loan, paying the Country Taxes, paying debts and so on.


Isn't gross before all that stuff (the total), and then net is the profit after all that?


Nope, Gross Profit is the same as Net Income. They are interchangeable!

Probably you're confusing with Operating and Ordinary Income. Normally when Just talking of Profit(without the Gross) people are talking of the Operating Income.
 
Feb 3, 2016 3:21 PM

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I wonder what Pierrot data would look like..you know, after Osomatsu's success and everything..
 
Feb 3, 2016 3:22 PM

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Bones in the red XD
Must be due to Captain Earth which bombed hard.

Toei :O
Use some of that money and animate toriko again, move it to another channel/time slot or whatever.
Even 1 year is fine, you will get your money back guaranteed, don't let the potential die :'(
 
Feb 3, 2016 3:24 PM

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@bigivelfhq can you searching for specially small studio? like xebec or trigger? because they are the fragile one.

also where is madhouse and pierrot?

ichii_1 said:
Bones in the red XD
Must be due to Captain Earth which bombed hard.
kekkai sensen doing very well done sells. so probably not that bad this year. also they has many upcoming shows. they are on fire! hope not flopping.
Modified by Kuma, Feb 3, 2016 3:27 PM
"If taking responsibility for a mistake that cannot be undone means death, it's not that hard to die. At least, not as hard as to live on."
 
Feb 3, 2016 4:03 PM

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Bones lost money 2 years in a row... Hopefully Kekkai Sensen reversed the trend for them.
5 main aspects I base my ratings on:
1. Did DramaEnthusiast make a thread about it?
2. Is it better than Breaking Bad?
3. Did MellowJello recommend the shit out of it?
4. Has it caused a (very entertaining) shitstorm on MAL?
5. Is it actually good?

Scratch the fifth point, it's not very relevant...
 
Feb 3, 2016 4:21 PM

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Kuma said:
@bigivelfhq can you searching for specially small studio? like xebec or trigger? because they are the fragile one.

also where is madhouse and pierrot?

ichii_1 said:
Bones in the red XD
Must be due to Captain Earth which bombed hard.
kekkai sensen doing very well done sells. so probably not that bad this year. also they has many upcoming shows. they are on fire! hope not flopping.


I can search for them, but I wouldn't put my hopes on it.

Note that other than Toei Animation, all the companies don't report to the public.

bigivelfhq said:
ostiniatoze said:


Isn't gross before all that stuff (the total), and then net is the profit after all that?


Nope, Gross Profit is the same as Net Income. They are interchangeable!

Probably you're confusing with Operating and Ordinary Income. Normally when Just talking of Profit(without the Gross) people are talking of the Operating Income.


Been Looking at it again, and maybe you're right. I'm gonna look at that in the future and change things appropriately.

Mod edit: Please don't double post. Edit your last post instead
Modified by Ardanaz, Feb 4, 2016 1:04 PM
 
Feb 3, 2016 6:01 PM

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Kekkai Sensen, save best Studio pls

Bones should just make Kekkai Sensen season 2
do it.

Boku No Hero Academia could also make money if they do it right.
erased sucks lol what an original opinion
 
Feb 4, 2016 1:31 AM

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Updated first post:

. Differentiated between Net Income and Gross Profit
. Added Toei Animation Workers, Cost of Sales and Gross Profit

Found new info about Studios Sales, I will later update the first post.


Main Anime Studios, Year Net Sales(In Yen)
Note: Is not the fiscal year! I believe is exactly the entire year.


Source - http://www.tdb.co.jp/report/watching/press/pdf/p100803.pdf
2007
20,247,000,000 - Toei Animation
14,589,000,000 - TMS Entertainment
12,126,000,000 - Sunrise
*5,092,000,000 - Studio Pierrot
*4,807,000,000 - Gonzo
*3,900,000,000 - Madhouse
*3,400,000,000 - Studio Ghibli
*3,309,000,000 - OLM
*2,640,000,000 - Gainax
*2,280,000,000 - Nippon Animation

2008
20,943,000,000 - Toei Animation
13,000,000,000 - Studio Ghibli
11,600,000,000 - Sunrise
11,556,000,000 - TMS Entertainment
*5,061,000,000 - Studio Pierrot
*4,500,000,000 - Madhouse
*3,374,000,000 - Gonzo
*2,770,000,000 - Production I.G
*2,580,000,000 - OLM
*2,500,000,000 - Gainax
*2,175,000,000 - Nippon Animation

2009
20,181,000,000 - Toei Animation
*9,500,000,000 - Sunrise
*9,320,000,000 - TMS Entertainment
*4,946,000,000 - Studio Pierrot
*4,220,000,000 - Production I.G
*4,000,000,000 - Madhouse
*3,300,000,000 - Gainax
*3,127,000,000 - OLM
*2,320,000,000 - Gonzo
*2,040,000,000 - Nippon Animation

Source: https://www.tdb.co.jp/report/watching/press/pdf/p121205.pdf
2010
25,909,000,000 - Toei Animation
10,309,000,000 - TMS Entertainment
*8,147,000,000 - Sunrise
*8,000,000,000 - Studio Ghibli
*5,345,000,000 - Studio Pierrot
*3,635,000,000 - Production I.G
*3,509,000,000 - Shin-Ei Animation
*3,067,000,000 - Satelight
*2,966,000,000 - OLM
*2,100,000,000 - A-1 Pictures

2011
32,027,000,000 - Toei Animation
*9,751,000,000 - Sunrise(Irregular report)
*9,693,000,000 - TMS Entertainment
*8,000,000,000 - Studio Ghibli
*5,522,000,000 - Studio Pierrot
*4,342,000,000 - OLM
*3,446,000,000 - Shin-Ei Animation
*3,309,000,000 - Satelight
*2,909,000,000 - Production I.G
*2,500,000,000 - A-1 Pictures

Mod edit: Please don't double post. Edit your last post instead
Modified by Ardanaz, Feb 4, 2016 1:04 PM
 
Feb 4, 2016 4:16 AM
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Huh... so the Top 5 studios in terms of income has been the same since 2007

Toei Animation
Sunrise(Irregular report)
TMS Entertainment
Studio Ghibli
Studio Pierrot

They're all pretty consistent to be honest.
 
Feb 4, 2016 4:19 AM

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Z4k said:
Huh... so the Top 5 studios in terms of income has been the same since 2007

Toei Animation
Sunrise(Irregular report)
TMS Entertainment
Studio Ghibli
Studio Pierrot

They're all pretty consistent to be honest.


In 2009 Production I.G was able to get in 5th position. Though Studio Ghibli sales are unknown in that Period.
In 2007 Studio Ghibli wasn't also in the top 5, instead Gonzo was in 5th position.
Modified by bigivelfhq, Feb 4, 2016 5:11 AM
 
Feb 4, 2016 5:43 AM
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Bones does not look good. Don't care for ghibli since they make family movies
 
Feb 4, 2016 10:04 AM

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@bigivelfhq good thread my friend.

Surprising to see madhouse made 4 bil ¥ in 2009 & dropped off the list altogether in '10, quite a bad hit.

I'm sure bones will be in profit for 2015, kekkai sensen & show by rock did well. 2013-14 looks like a result of space dandy, such a shame that this is how japan repays you for doing ambitious shows.

It'd be a shame if bones goes in red, from what I know their current president is really passionate one about animation. Hero Aca might just be what they need.
Modified by JetNoir, Feb 4, 2016 10:10 AM
Imagine a berserk anime by Yoshiaki kawajiri at Madhouse.

Now take a look at Berserk (2016).

YOU HAVE MY PERMISSION TO CRY.
 
Feb 4, 2016 11:59 AM

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Pierrot is gonna break records with those osomatsu-san sales :)

Gonzo sure fell hard :(
They did a big restructure so maybe they'll bounce back.
 
Feb 4, 2016 12:09 PM

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^ While Madhouse seem to have been doing well until 2009, they weren't. While their sales are good their Net Income was bad, just like the Bones situation and probably worse. In 2010 they filed bankruptcy and were saved by NTV: http://myanimelist.net/forum/?topicid=284403
Almost certainly that has something to do with them getting out of the Top sellers in 2010 and 2011.

Bones still got good sales in those years(in comparison with the top 10 animation studios), so the debt must be because of bad handling of business(or investment).
If we assume that the cause is Space Dandy, than they have them to blame and nobody else. They should know their financial situation and do works/spend money appropriate to that situation, instead of gambling.

Manglobe(Now Defunct)
Source: http://www.tdb.co.jp/tosan/syosai/4093.html
Capital -> 10,000,000 yen

2013
Sales -> 1,017,000,000 yen

2014
Sales -> 460,000,000 Yen
Liabilities(debt) -> 350,000,000 Yen(Preliminary number made at the bankruptcy moment. Expected more debt).

ichii_1 said:
Pierrot is gonna break records with those osomatsu-san sales :)

Gonzo sure fell hard :(
They did a big restructure so maybe they'll bounce back.


I don't think so. While is almost certain that Pierrot will increase its sales incredible, I don't think is gonna break any records.
Note that Bakemonogatari, with an average of 79,201 copies per volume, in 2009. Still Shaft didn't made into the list in 2009 nor in 2010 and neither 2011. Kyoto Animation also got K-On! in 2009 that made 43,878 copies per volume, and didn't got into the list.

Note that 16 volumes(1 year) of 7,344 yen(around 63 dollars) Blu-rays, when selling 79,000 copies per volumes are 9,282,816,000 Yen. If that money would all go to Pierrot, something that doesn't happen, they would still only jump to 2nd place with around 14,000,000,000 Yen something that TMS Entertainment did in 2007 and that Toei does more than 2 times.

Mod edit: Please don't triple post. Edit your last post instead
Modified by Ardanaz, Feb 4, 2016 1:03 PM
 
Feb 4, 2016 12:41 PM
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Good work.interesting data

Toei(One piece,dragon ball)>sunrise(Gundam)=TMS entertainment (Anpanman lupin )
 
Feb 5, 2016 2:23 PM

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Toei Animation 2015 3rd quarter sales(April 1, 2015 to December 31, 2015)

Note:
Gross Profit = Sales - Cost of Sales

Net Sales - 26,144,000,000 Yen
---
Licensing- 10,829,000,000 Yen
Film Sales - 10,735,000,000 Yen
Sale of Goods - 3,711,000,000 Yen
Others - 994,000,000 Yen
---
Cost of Sales to Net Sales - 68.4%
Cost of Sales - 16,128,000,000 Yen
Gross Profit - 10,015,000,000 Yen

Film Sales
---
Domestic Film - 5,448,000,000 Yen
Overseas Film - 5,286,000,000 Yen

Domestic Film
---
TV - 2,320,000,000 Yen
Others - 1,509,000,000 Yen
DVDs - 892,000,000 Yen
Movies - 727,000,000 Yen

Licensing
---
Domestic Licensing - 6,902,000,000 Yen
Overseas Licensing - 3,926,000,000 Yen

Notes:
- In Licensing Toei sells around Sunrise entire year sales.
- In Film Toei makes almost the same in both Domestic and Overseas. Each one sells around Studio Pierrot Entire year sales.
- In sales of goods Toei sells around Production I.G entire year sales.
(Talking of available other studios values, so from 2007 to 2011)



Top 4 series and remainder

Domestic Licensing
---
1º - 2,677,000,000 Yen -> One Piece
2º - 1,422,000,000 Yen -> Dragon Ball
3º - *,416,000,000 Yen -> Precure
4º - *,227,000,000 Yen -> Sailor Moon
*º - 2,160,000,000 Yen -> Remainder of Series

Overseas Film
---
1º - 1,395,000,000 Yen -> One Piece
2º - 1,316,000,000 Yen -> Dragon Ball
3º - *,272,000,000 Yen -> Sailor Moon
4º - *,251,000,000 Yen -> Precure
*º - 2,052,000,000 Yen -> Remainder of Series

Overseas Licensing
---
1º - 1,202,000,000 Yen -> Dragon Ball
2º - 1,179,000,000 Yen -> One Piece
3º - *,493,000,000 Yen -> Saint Seiya
4º - *,145,000,000 Yen -> Slam Dunk(Yep, Slam Dunk :D)
*º- *,907,000,000 Yen -> Remainder of Series

Notes:
- 3 quarters of One Piece 2015 Overseas Film sold more than Bones entire 2014 sales!
- 3 quarters of One Piece 2015 Domestic Licensing sold more than Kyoto Animation entire 2014 sales!
- Toei Animation without the 4 biggest series of each section(and we forgetting about the Domestic Film) sold in 3 quarters 5,119 Million Yen. Values close to Studio Pierrot Entire Year Sales.
Modified by bigivelfhq, Feb 5, 2016 2:30 PM
 
Feb 6, 2016 1:45 AM

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watching *saving* this thread. those figures might be useful, being a business student and all, that is, when they'd freely make us choose on what we'd like to write about.

Bones tho :(
 
Feb 8, 2016 10:44 AM

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Madhouse Debt/Liabilities(Reported by NTV as parent contingency Liabilities)

2010 -> 700,000,000 Yen(8,418,000 Dollars)
2011 -> 700,000,000 Yen(8,517,000 Dollars)
2012 -> 400,000,000 Yen(8,418,000 Dollars)
2013 -> 150,000,000 Yen(1,457,000 Dollars)
2014 -> 120,000,000 Yen(*,999,000 Dollars)

Source: http://www.ntvhd.co.jp/english/ir/annual/index.html

Note: Financial Year! so 2010 -> April 1 of 2010 to March 31 of 2011.
 
Feb 8, 2016 12:31 PM

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bigivelfhq said:
Madhouse Debt/Liabilities(Reported by NTV as parent contingency Liabilities)

2010 -> 700,000,000 Yen(8,418,000 Dollars)
2011 -> 700,000,000 Yen(8,517,000 Dollars)
2012 -> 400,000,000 Yen(8,418,000 Dollars)
2013 -> 150,000,000 Yen(1,457,000 Dollars)
2014 -> 120,000,000 Yen(*,999,000 Dollars)

Source: http://www.ntvhd.co.jp/english/ir/annual/index.html

Note: Financial Year! so 2010 -> April 1 of 2010 to March 31 of 2011.
shouldn't it be like:
2011 -> 700,000,000 Yen(8,418,000 Dollars)
2012 -> 700,000,000 Yen(8,517,000 Dollars)
2013 -> 400,000,000 Yen(8,418,000 Dollars)
2014 -> 150,000,000 Yen(1,457,000 Dollars)
2015 -> 120,000,000 Yen(*,999,000 Dollars)
or that have something to do with the Financial Year..?

now I don't know what that means exactly..but I guess it's a good thing for Madhouse since there debts have been decreasing during the last 5 years.
Modified by malki, Feb 8, 2016 12:41 PM
 
Feb 8, 2016 2:20 PM

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malki said:
bigivelfhq said:
Madhouse Debt/Liabilities(Reported by NTV as parent contingency Liabilities)

2010 -> 700,000,000 Yen(8,418,000 Dollars)
2011 -> 700,000,000 Yen(8,517,000 Dollars)
2012 -> 400,000,000 Yen(8,418,000 Dollars)
2013 -> 150,000,000 Yen(1,457,000 Dollars)
2014 -> 120,000,000 Yen(*,999,000 Dollars)

Source: http://www.ntvhd.co.jp/english/ir/annual/index.html

Note: Financial Year! so 2010 -> April 1 of 2010 to March 31 of 2011.
shouldn't it be like:
2011 -> 700,000,000 Yen(8,418,000 Dollars)
2012 -> 700,000,000 Yen(8,517,000 Dollars)
2013 -> 400,000,000 Yen(8,418,000 Dollars)
2014 -> 150,000,000 Yen(1,457,000 Dollars)
2015 -> 120,000,000 Yen(*,999,000 Dollars)
or that have something to do with the Financial Year..?

now I don't know what that means exactly..but I guess it's a good thing for Madhouse since there debts have been decreasing during the last 5 years.


The Financial Year instead of going from January to December, it goes from April to March, of next year. So Instead of 2010 year being from January 1 of 2010 to December 31 of 2010, you go from April 1 of 2010 to March 31 of 2011. Note how it only covers 3 months of 2011 and 9 of 2010.
Though it seems you can call it Financial Year for the year ended March 2011. I will place the most predominant part of the year though.


Yep, is a good thing they being able to pay this debt, though I believe this is debt already payed by NTV and they are just waiting for Madhouse to pay them back, so this way they have all the time of the world to pay it. They are almost there.
Modified by bigivelfhq, Feb 8, 2016 2:26 PM
 
Feb 10, 2016 6:23 AM

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bigivelfhq said:
malki said:
shouldn't it be like:
2011 -> 700,000,000 Yen(8,418,000 Dollars)
2012 -> 700,000,000 Yen(8,517,000 Dollars)
2013 -> 400,000,000 Yen(8,418,000 Dollars)
2014 -> 150,000,000 Yen(1,457,000 Dollars)
2015 -> 120,000,000 Yen(*,999,000 Dollars)
or that have something to do with the Financial Year..?

now I don't know what that means exactly..but I guess it's a good thing for Madhouse since there debts have been decreasing during the last 5 years.


The Financial Year instead of going from January to December, it goes from April to March, of next year. So Instead of 2010 year being from January 1 of 2010 to December 31 of 2010, you go from April 1 of 2010 to March 31 of 2011. Note how it only covers 3 months of 2011 and 9 of 2010.
Though it seems you can call it Financial Year for the year ended March 2011. I will place the most predominant part of the year though.


Yep, is a good thing they being able to pay this debt, though I believe this is debt already payed by NTV and they are just waiting for Madhouse to pay them back, so this way they have all the time of the world to pay it. They are almost there.


oh wow, this is great. Probably they're outta debts by now, given how mh gets a position on committees recently.

It will be interesting to see what direction madhouse takes from now on.

I hope ntv/madhouse revives madhouse's theatrical films/movies division. That's the major thing I dont like about current madhouse.
Modified by JetNoir, Feb 10, 2016 6:27 AM
Imagine a berserk anime by Yoshiaki kawajiri at Madhouse.

Now take a look at Berserk (2016).

YOU HAVE MY PERMISSION TO CRY.
 
Feb 10, 2016 7:36 AM

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Where is P.A. Works' Bookkeeping? I want to see it!



insert cool edgy lines
shameless self promote
lame poet and quote
 
Feb 10, 2016 9:49 AM

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eromangasensei said:
bigivelfhq said:


The Financial Year instead of going from January to December, it goes from April to March, of next year. So Instead of 2010 year being from January 1 of 2010 to December 31 of 2010, you go from April 1 of 2010 to March 31 of 2011. Note how it only covers 3 months of 2011 and 9 of 2010.
Though it seems you can call it Financial Year for the year ended March 2011. I will place the most predominant part of the year though.


Yep, is a good thing they being able to pay this debt, though I believe this is debt already payed by NTV and they are just waiting for Madhouse to pay them back, so this way they have all the time of the world to pay it. They are almost there.


oh wow, this is great. Probably they're outta debts by now, given how mh gets a position on committees recently.

It will be interesting to see what direction madhouse takes from now on.

I hope ntv/madhouse revives madhouse's theatrical films/movies division. That's the major thing I dont like about current madhouse.


A company will always have debts whether it is from Notes, Securites or Loans payables.

You can have a shit ton of liabilities and still be a successful business if you have a good net income.

There is not a single big company out there without a liability or "debt".

What matters is that their cash flow is good enough so they can pay those out in the time they are due and make steady income.
 
Feb 10, 2016 12:23 PM

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eromangasensei said:
bigivelfhq said:


The Financial Year instead of going from January to December, it goes from April to March, of next year. So Instead of 2010 year being from January 1 of 2010 to December 31 of 2010, you go from April 1 of 2010 to March 31 of 2011. Note how it only covers 3 months of 2011 and 9 of 2010.
Though it seems you can call it Financial Year for the year ended March 2011. I will place the most predominant part of the year though.


Yep, is a good thing they being able to pay this debt, though I believe this is debt already payed by NTV and they are just waiting for Madhouse to pay them back, so this way they have all the time of the world to pay it. They are almost there.


oh wow, this is great. Probably they're outta debts by now, given how mh gets a position on committees recently.

It will be interesting to see what direction madhouse takes from now on.

I hope ntv/madhouse revives madhouse's theatrical films/movies division. That's the major thing I dont like about current madhouse.


I'm not seeing them changing their business management, just because they payed the debt. Debt that was made during and almost certain because of the previous way of doing business.

Madhouse and AAA movie films probably will stop being produced for good. In reality for a long before being bought by NTV, their movies weren't selling that much.
Summer Wars sold at the Box office just around 18.4 Million dollars(As comparison you have One Piece Film Z sold 74.2 Million and Boruto around 22.8 Billions), The Girl that Leapt Through Time sold just around 2.28 Million.
Counting the Tibetan Dog, Redline, Trigun, Yona Yona Penguin and others flops, is easy to see why getting back to that must be their last priority.
 
Feb 10, 2016 12:33 PM

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hoopla123 said:
eromangasensei said:


oh wow, this is great. Probably they're outta debts by now, given how mh gets a position on committees recently.

It will be interesting to see what direction madhouse takes from now on.

I hope ntv/madhouse revives madhouse's theatrical films/movies division. That's the major thing I dont like about current madhouse.


A company will always have debts whether it is from Notes, Securites or Loans payables.

You can have a shit ton of liabilities and still be a successful business if you have a good net income.

There is not a single big company out there without a liability or "debt".

What matters is that their cash flow is good enough so they can pay those out in the time they are due and make steady income.


Yep, every company has liabilities though this ones aren't Madhouse normal liabilities. This are Liabilities that NTV inherited when they bought Madhouse and rescued it from Bankrupcy.
Note that this are quite big liabilities to a company of the size of Madhouse. Manglobe went to bankrupcy with 350,000,000 Yen. This started as double of that value.
Looking at Madhouse sales and comparing with Kyoto Animation, if we consider that their Net Income per Sales is the same, we have that madhouse makes a Net Income of around 250-300 Million Yen per year. This means that they had a debt of the size of 2-3 entire years of operations. And as we can see it already passed 5 years and they still didn't payed that debt in entirety.

I don't think that in this case cash flow is good enough. In this case of debt, they could even never pay for it, because NTV their current parent company is responsible of it. So obviously NTV, being Madhouse Parent, will not have a defined time of payment.
 
Feb 10, 2016 1:11 PM

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bigivelfhq said:
eromangasensei said:


oh wow, this is great. Probably they're outta debts by now, given how mh gets a position on committees recently.

It will be interesting to see what direction madhouse takes from now on.

I hope ntv/madhouse revives madhouse's theatrical films/movies division. That's the major thing I dont like about current madhouse.


I'm not seeing them changing their business management, just because they payed the debt. Debt that was made during and almost certain because of the previous way of doing business.

Madhouse and AAA movie films probably will stop being produced for good. In reality for a long before being bought by NTV, their movies weren't selling that much.
Summer Wars sold at the Box office just around 18.4 Million dollars(As comparison you have One Piece Film Z sold 74.2 Million and Boruto around 22.8 Billions), The Girl that Leapt Through Time sold just around 2.28 Million.
Counting the Tibetan Dog, Redline, Trigun, Yona Yona Penguin and others flops, is easy to see why getting back to that must be their last priority.


NTV funds tms entertainment & studio chizu movies tho, so they're definitely into it (plus they exclusively own ghibli tv broadcast license). Even before that they were funding madhouse movies you mentioned like Girl who leapt through time, summer wars, etc

Given these things I'm really hoping they do change madhouse a bit for a movie division like they had before 2011.

Since Ghibli & madhouse stopped their big movie productions the whole anime movie scene has been really desolate.
Modified by JetNoir, Feb 10, 2016 1:25 PM
Imagine a berserk anime by Yoshiaki kawajiri at Madhouse.

Now take a look at Berserk (2016).

YOU HAVE MY PERMISSION TO CRY.
 
Feb 10, 2016 1:24 PM
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informative thread

Gainax have fallen so hard starting with year 2010
 
Feb 10, 2016 2:26 PM

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bigivelfhq said:

Summer Wars sold at the Box office just around 18.4 Million dollars(As comparison you have One Piece Film Z sold 74.2 Million and Boruto around 22.8 Millions), The Girl that Leapt Through Time sold just around 2.28 Million.

The latter is highly critically acclaimed thou and has won many awards (it's disk sales are also high).
And are you saying 18 million isn't good :(
ntv definitely wants more of those success, now that madhouse is better managed they can definitely pull it off.
 
Feb 10, 2016 3:48 PM

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ichii_1 said:
bigivelfhq said:

Summer Wars sold at the Box office just around 18.4 Million dollars(As comparison you have One Piece Film Z sold 74.2 Million and Boruto around 22.8 Millions), The Girl that Leapt Through Time sold just around 2.28 Million.

The latter is highly critically acclaimed thou and has won many awards (it's disk sales are also high).
And are you saying 18 million isn't good :(
ntv definitely wants more of those success, now that madhouse is better managed they can definitely pull it off.


Being Highly Critically Acclaimed means little when your work is a major flop. People don't live just of fame. Disk Sales are high, but nothing of notice for a movie, special one certainly as expensive as this one. In 2007(first release) it sold 80,485 copies. At the currently 7000 yen average of disk sales that meant 563,395,000 Yen that is around 4,95 Million dollars. So the movie did 7.23 Million dollars.
Even if the movie got profit, certainly it was so little compared with the expected. One Piece Film Z did 10 times that value and just in Theaters.

Summer Wars was the best selling movie in a long time of Madhouse, and still it didn't do much compared to what it was for. Note that the "just" is not because it wasn't a success, but because you have tons of movies doing better than it. In its year it was just the 24th best selling movie.

Also note that there wasn't only The Girl that Leapt Through Time and then Summer Wars. No, Madhouse made a ton of other movies, majority(if not all) were flops.

You have:
2006 - The Girl who leapt through Time(sold -> 2.28 Million for Box Office and 4.95 Million dollars disk sales. Around 7.23 Million dollars overall)
2006 - Paprika(sold -> 944,915 in box Office and 18,977 dollars in disks. Around 996,092 dollars overall)
---
2007 - Piano Mori(didn't even got data for Movies and Disk sales)
2007 - Cinnamoroll(didn't even got data)
2007 - Adventures of Mouse story - George and Gerald(didn't even got data)
---
2008 - Highlander(didn't even got data)
---
2009 - Hell Angel(didn't even got data)
2009 - Summer Wars(sold -> 18.4 Million for Box Office and 13.9 Million for disk Sales. 32.3 Million dollars overall)
...

Summer Wars indeed was a savior for Madhouse movie division. The problem is that after Summer War it all returned back to what it was before it. It even got worse with Redline. That movie was not only overbudget, but it was also overflop.

Hosoda even had to get away from them to get really popular series with Wolf Children, and the Boy and the Beast. :P Just kidding, or Am I?

The way Madhouse was going with their movies it was just spending money with no return.
 
Feb 10, 2016 3:59 PM

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eromangasensei said:


NTV funds tms entertainment & studio chizu movies tho, so they're definitely into it (plus they exclusively own ghibli tv broadcast license). Even before that they were funding madhouse movies you mentioned like Girl who leapt through time, summer wars, etc

Given these things I'm really hoping they do change madhouse a bit for a movie division like they had before 2011.

Since Ghibli & madhouse stopped their big movie productions the whole anime movie scene has been really desolate.


Note that TMS Entertainment movies, specially Detective Conan, and Studio Ghibli movies are way more profitable than Madhouse movies. Also nor Studio Ghibli nor TMS Entertainment provided so many movies that didn't do well like Madhouse. Also none of them filed for Bankrupcy and needed to be Bought, had to change the Business Management, that basically eradicated the Movie division, and still has contingency Liabilities in NTV.

Is way more probable that Studio Ghibli movie division to return(and there are already rumors of that) than Madhouse returning to movies, specially ones that aren't from their TV Animations.
 
Feb 12, 2016 10:36 AM

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ichii_1 said:
Bones in the red XD
Must be due to Captain Earth which bombed hard.

Toei :O
Use some of that money and animate toriko again, move it to another channel/time slot or whatever.
Even 1 year is fine, you will get your money back guaranteed, don't let the potential die :'(
And I liked that series to be very honest. Did it really do that bad? From what I checked, it did decent. There is also a game out.

Prolly must have been other stuff, you know like debt or other shit.
 
Feb 12, 2016 11:10 AM

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BGMaxie said:
ichii_1 said:
Bones in the red XD
Must be due to Captain Earth which bombed hard.

Toei :O
Use some of that money and animate toriko again, move it to another channel/time slot or whatever.
Even 1 year is fine, you will get your money back guaranteed, don't let the potential die :'(
And I liked that series to be very honest. Did it really do that bad? From what I checked, it did decent. There is also a game out.

Prolly must have been other stuff, you know like debt or other shit.


The series did well, but unfortunately it did nothing compared with Dragon Ball. Toei basically chose between Toriko, a series that was doing 382 Million Yen Tops the year it ended and was in a downward tred; and Dragon Ball, a series that was doing 1.17 Billion Yen and in an upward Tred.
Because they chose Dragon Ball and invested in it, Dragon Ball after 9 months of this year(financial year), already sold 3.94 Billion Yen, a 3.37 times more than what it had during the Year Toriko ended.
Modified by bigivelfhq, Feb 12, 2016 3:21 PM
 
Feb 12, 2016 3:42 PM

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@bigivelfhq when 2015 fnancial data usually pop up on internet? most of data in here is 2014 or older.
"If taking responsibility for a mistake that cannot be undone means death, it's not that hard to die. At least, not as hard as to live on."
 
Feb 12, 2016 4:06 PM

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Kuma said:
@bigivelfhq when 2015 fnancial data usually pop up on internet? most of data in here is 2014 or older.


Most of the data here is leaks of private info, so there is not really a date when more info will be available to us, if at all.

Also note that 2014 financial year goes until March 2015. If we assume that the companies have to provide that info to the country 1-2 months after the date, and we get the info as soon as they release, then next time will be in April or May of this year.

Toei Animation that is the only current animation studio in the public stock market(Gonzo also was in the past), releases each Quarter info around 1 month later. The latest one they released was in the end of January. I already posted about the info. I will put it in the 1st post, for people to not miss it.

I also got my hands in Aja 2015 summary report, that talks about the general situation of the anime industry in 2014. Maybe later I will put something about that.
Here is the site if you want to look at it: http://aja.gr.jp/jigyou/chousa/sangyo_toukei
 
Feb 13, 2016 2:04 PM
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Toei is kicking alot of ass

thank you
 
Feb 13, 2016 2:17 PM

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A-1 has less Net income than Kyoani, I guess that disasterpiece they call Cinderella Girls made them lose a ton of money and then there's Trainwreck.Zero, that had to take a toll on them.


 
Feb 13, 2016 3:08 PM

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Hoppy said:
A-1 has less Net income than Kyoani, I guess that disasterpiece they call Cinderella Girls made them lose a ton of money and then there's Trainwreck.Zero, that had to take a toll on them.


Didn't Cinderella Girls was popular? I had idea it was. I have still to watch it, but from the 1st episode it looked bpretty good.
 
Feb 13, 2016 3:24 PM

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bigivelfhq said:
Hoppy said:
A-1 has less Net income than Kyoani, I guess that disasterpiece they call Cinderella Girls made them lose a ton of money and then there's Trainwreck.Zero, that had to take a toll on them.


Didn't Cinderella Girls was popular? I had idea it was. I have still to watch it, but from the 1st episode it looked bpretty good.


The anime is a disasterpiece especially in the second season, the game is what's popular along with it's sister game Starlight Stage.


 
Feb 13, 2016 3:41 PM
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I feel bad for Bones :(
Btw, does anyone of you know how to watch a topic? Yup, I am a MAL noob.
 
Feb 13, 2016 3:56 PM
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While going through this thread I saw that many users mentioned dvd sales figure, where can I find them?
 
Feb 13, 2016 4:38 PM

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Kumarsama said:
While going through this thread I saw that many users mentioned dvd sales figure, where can I find them?


Here:
- http://forums.animesuki.com/showthread.php?t=109699

and Here:
- http://www.someanithing.com/

Kumarsama said:
I feel bad for Bones :(
Btw, does anyone of you know how to watch a topic? Yup, I am a MAL noob.


In the top of the thread you have 3 buttons. Toggle Watching is the one you're looking for.

I believe that Bones is doing a good work to paving for the future. They have to become a little more stable, and My Hero Academia and Kekkai Sensen(I hope they continue the series) is just the thing they need.
Modified by bigivelfhq, Feb 13, 2016 4:43 PM
 
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