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Poll: Fate/stay night: Unlimited Blade Works (TV) 2nd Season Episode 5 Discussion


May 2, 2015 11:59 AM

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cupc said:
HikariJake said:


That ponytail tho
Saber should always wear a ponytail while in her blue armor.


true, Saber is the biggest reason for my ponytail fetish


You got that right
Life has meaning.
 
May 2, 2015 12:00 PM

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Guilek said:
Gov said:


I don't buy it. Rin told the guy he might be fighting three servants at the same time and he wasn't much bothered by it.

Archer betrayed Rin, then betrayed Caster all to get back to Rin. This is clearly not someone to be trusted and for him to put his faith in him is pure idiocy.

This just seems like a "we could be logical or we could make Archer do something in the series and kill a character with a move he never once used in the show. Sounds legit."


Because, Archer is now masterless without a master for a long time, he will die.
So Lancer couldn't think that Archer would want to kill the two last master without a servant.


His mana was replenished by Caster remember? Also the guy doesn't have any honour, as he said in the episode itself.
 
May 2, 2015 12:00 PM

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Tonnes of action in this episode.

Caster is hot and her master is dead.

Oh well, let's see what will happen to archer next week.
Oh god who are you people?
 
May 2, 2015 12:00 PM
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Caster is one fine looking lady. Love that character design.
"Perhaps there is a universal, absolute truth. Perhaps it justifies every question. But that's beyond the reach of these small hands." Mamoru Oshii

There is a cult of ignorance (...) nurtured by the false notion that democracy means that “my ignorance is just as good as your knowledge.” Isaac Asimov

 
May 2, 2015 12:01 PM

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Gov said:
chat77 said:


Gov Lancer said himself...Archer is weird...keep on watching...he is capable of many things


Weird doesn't even begin to explain it. He could have been killed and yet he doesn't use his entire moveset.

Thats because his mana stats can be called shit tier even after Caster took him more or less if you compare to other servants.If Archer had enough mana to use everything in his arsenal..he would ROFLstomp the war.
 
May 2, 2015 12:03 PM

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Gov said:
Guilek said:


Because, Archer is now masterless without a master for a long time, he will die.
So Lancer couldn't think that Archer would want to kill the two last master without a servant.


His mana was replenished by Caster remember?

And she is dead, he is masterless and Gilgamesh and Lancer are still alive.

Lancer couldn't think that after Archer killed Caster/Kuzuki, he will attack/betray the last two master without a servant because he want to kill Shirou.

He is now masterless and there's two servant alive.
Edit: I forgot Assassin, we don't know about him now.
Modified by Guilek, May 2, 2015 12:06 PM
 
May 2, 2015 12:04 PM
something here

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Gov said:

His mana was replenished by Caster remember? Also the guy doesn't have any honour, as he said in the episode itself.

Lancer just used his NP though. He wasn't exactly operating at full power himself.
 
May 2, 2015 12:05 PM

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chat77 said:
Gov said:


Weird doesn't even begin to explain it. He could have been killed and yet he doesn't use his entire moveset.

Thats because his mana stats can be called shit tier even after Caster took him more or less if you compare to other servants.If Archer had enough mana to use everything in his arsenal..he would ROFLstomp the war.


You can say with almost any servent.

Gilgamesh still stomps everyone unless he gets a nerf. Seeing how the story is with Shirou, this wouldn't surprise me in the least.
 
May 2, 2015 12:05 PM

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Guilek said:
Gov said:


His mana was replenished by Caster remember?

And she is dead, he is masterless and Gilgamesh and Lancer are still alive.

Lancer couldn't think that after Archer killed Caster/Kuzuki, he will attack/betray the last two master without a master because he want to kill SHirou.

He is now masterless and there's two servant alive.


Also Archer killing Caster is tantamount to suicide if he doesn't reform a contract, the only mage left being Rin. Hence groveling achieved.
 
May 2, 2015 12:07 PM

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chat77 said:
Gov said:


Weird doesn't even begin to explain it. He could have been killed and yet he doesn't use his entire moveset.

Thats because his mana stats can be called shit tier even after Caster took him more or less if you compare to other servants.If Archer had enough mana to use everything in his arsenal..he would ROFLstomp the war.


So could everyone else.

Have you seen Laida?

And this is before we take in account Gil and fairy magic.
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May 2, 2015 12:07 PM

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Guilek said:
Gov said:


His mana was replenished by Caster remember?

And she is dead, he is masterless and Gilgamesh and Lancer are still alive.

Lancer couldn't think that after Archer killed Caster/Kuzuki, he will attack/betray the last two master without a servant because he want to kill Shirou.

He is now masterless and there's two servant alive.
Edit: I forgot Assassin, we don't know about him now.


Still doesn't answer why Lancer couldn't have checked up on them. Your argument is based on Lancer making assumptions and then hoping they come true.
 
May 2, 2015 12:08 PM

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Gov said:
chat77 said:

Thats because his mana stats can be called shit tier even after Caster took him more or less if you compare to other servants.If Archer had enough mana to use everything in his arsenal..he would ROFLstomp the war.


You can say with almost any servent.

Gilgamesh still stomps everyone unless he gets a nerf. Seeing how the story is with Shirou, this wouldn't surprise me in the least.


Uhhh no....Archer is a special case.... and yeah even Gil would have to be serious to beat Archer otherwise he is screwed.FSN has more of a rock paper scissor system.....there are 8 eps left Gov..you will hopefully get your answers by then ..because otherwise I have to go to spoilers.
 
May 2, 2015 12:09 PM

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Gov said:
Guilek said:

And she is dead, he is masterless and Gilgamesh and Lancer are still alive.

Lancer couldn't think that after Archer killed Caster/Kuzuki, he will attack/betray the last two master without a servant because he want to kill Shirou.

He is now masterless and there's two servant alive.
Edit: I forgot Assassin, we don't know about him now.


Your argument is based on Lancer making assumptions and then hoping they come true.

Because it's exactly what he did.
 
May 2, 2015 12:10 PM

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mira-nyan said:
chat77 said:

Thats because his mana stats can be called shit tier even after Caster took him more or less if you compare to other servants.If Archer had enough mana to use everything in his arsenal..he would ROFLstomp the war.


So could everyone else.

Have you seen Laida?

And this is before we take in account Gil and fairy magic.


You have to admit with the weaponry he has,if he has enough mana he would do it without doubt.
 
May 2, 2015 12:10 PM

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Guilek said:
Gov said:

Your argument is based on Lancer making assumptions and then hoping they come true.

Because it's exactly what he did.


This is what everyone does.

Even Archer makes a retarded assumption here and there. We just happen to be seeing an alternate universe in which their assumption comes true/doesn't.
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May 2, 2015 12:10 PM

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Well that was a very nice Gae Bolg Rho Aias clash
Added Kuzuki flashback visuals, doesn't really serve much purpose.
Archer the ultimate tsundere misses Shirou again, get your thoughts straight dammit, you fucking janitor.
Good episode overall, I hope they don't fuck up the first part of Archer's confession next episode.
 
May 2, 2015 12:11 PM

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Well I guess that ends the argument huh? Lancer risked Shirou and Rin's life based on one assumption.

I gotta go but it was fun arguing.
 
May 2, 2015 12:13 PM

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chat77 said:
mira-nyan said:


So could everyone else.

Have you seen Laida?

And this is before we take in account Gil and fairy magic.


You have to admit with the weaponry he has,if he has enough mana he would do it without doubt.


Probably, but I don't see why he'd kill his waifu.

Plus there are ways around flying swords. If a certain some one had enough prana, they could do tyrant clamp, which can easily destroy/deflect the swords. Another has a dagger chain that can do the same. Another has super agility and can dodge them easily, etc
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May 2, 2015 12:13 PM

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Did anyone notice that the flashbacks to Archer vs Caster during Shirou's monologue weren't in the original episode?
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May 2, 2015 12:13 PM

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Nice Engrish, Archer.
 
May 2, 2015 12:14 PM

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Gov said:
Well I guess that ends the argument huh? Lancer risked Shirou and Rin's life based on one assumption.

I gotta go but it was fun arguing.

He didn't risk anything in his minds, a scenario where a masterless servant kill/betray the last master without a servant(= dead for this servant) is very unlikely.
 
May 2, 2015 12:15 PM

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Gov said:
Guilek said:

He understood Archer went to kill Caster.
If Caster is dead, they didn't need him.
He didn't know, Archer want to kill Shirou.


So let me get this straight.

Archer lied and betrayed Rin to go work under Castor. Him and Lancer go fight to the death. Lancer is on the verge of killing him and he says that losing Caster's watchful eye was his plan all along. Archer already hates the guy and the guy is traitor in the eyes of him, why would he take his word so easily?

Also, if the plan was to kill Caster, why not check up on Shirou and Rin to see if they are still alive? As you said, if Archer still wants to kill Shirou but this would not have happened if Lancer checked up on them. It also ensures that Archer kept his word and went after Caster.



That doesn't make sense. Why the heck would Lancer check up on Rin and Shirou? They're temporary allies for the sake of breaking up Caster's squad (Saber+Archer). When he realizes that Archer plans to take down Caster in a way that make sure Caster won't use Saber on Archer, Lancer realizes that his job is done. The Caster alliance is broken and he has no need to further help his enemies (Rin, Shirou).

Rin, Shirou and Lancer is like Iran and the US. They team up to fight ISIS on a very small occasion but there is no need to further the alliance the alliance once the foe is done. They have little in common and are opponents when it comes to goals. The analogy here is political but it's kinda the same thing. Temporary allies (with the intention of being temporary) were never meant to be friends. It's pure convenience.
 
May 2, 2015 12:17 PM

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Was an ok ep.
Altough:
-Lancer vs. Archer was too rushed.
-The Deaths, again, felt impactless (like with Illya).

It seems this anime has problems of making deaths impactfull.
 
May 2, 2015 12:18 PM

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Gov said:
Well I guess that ends the argument huh? Lancer risked Shirou and Rin's life based on one assumption.

I gotta go but it was fun arguing.


Lancer risked Shirou and Rin's life by letting them fight Caster.

Your premise that Lancer cares much about Shirou and Rin's life is silly. He is not their friend.
 
May 2, 2015 12:20 PM

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Shrimperor said:
Was an ok ep.
Altough:
-Lancer vs. Archer was too rushed.
-The Deaths, again, felt impactless (like with Illya).

It seems this anime has problems of making deaths impactfull.


Well this isn't Illya's route.
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May 2, 2015 12:20 PM

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Kolios said:
Gov said:
Well I guess that ends the argument huh? Lancer risked Shirou and Rin's life based on one assumption.

I gotta go but it was fun arguing.


Lancer risked Shirou and Rin's life by letting them fight Caster.

Your premise that Lancer cares much about Shirou and Rin's life is silly. He is not their friend.


Shirou maybe not so much

He definitely likes Rin tho
 
May 2, 2015 12:21 PM

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DamnThatsTheSpot said:
Kolios said:


Lancer risked Shirou and Rin's life by letting them fight Caster.

Your premise that Lancer cares much about Shirou and Rin's life is silly. He is not their friend.


Shirou maybe not so much

He definitely likes Rin tho


Not to the extent that he'd always look over her.
 
May 2, 2015 12:21 PM

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mira-nyan said:
Shrimperor said:
Was an ok ep.
Altough:
-Lancer vs. Archer was too rushed.
-The Deaths, again, felt impactless (like with Illya).

It seems this anime has problems of making deaths impactfull.


Well this isn't Illya's route.

What about Caster and Kuzuki tough?
It's the route they get the most attention.
And Illya's death in the vn was impactful.
 
May 2, 2015 12:22 PM

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Best episode of season 2 thus far. Lancer's VA is beastly <3

 
May 2, 2015 12:22 PM

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"Trace... on!" Still sends shivers down my spine when Archer says it for the first time, when the revelation happens.
Missing the times of Rewrite, good times.
 
May 2, 2015 12:24 PM

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Mickdrew said:
fst said:


wut

@ 6:30 in the episode, mate


oh you mean that flashback

what do you mean by "original episode" though?
 
May 2, 2015 12:26 PM

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Shrimperor said:
Was an ok ep.
Altough:
-Lancer vs. Archer was too rushed.
-The Deaths, again, felt impactless (like with Illya).

It seems this anime has problems of making deaths impactfull.


Tbh anime lacks in atmosphere overall. They are too focused on all the fights to set up the atmosphere or how characters FEEL in situations or the tension they feel or the things they think about. It has been some of biggest pet peeves I had with the adaptation since the very start.
 
May 2, 2015 12:26 PM

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fst said:
Mickdrew said:

@ 6:30 in the episode, mate


oh you mean that flashback

what do you mean by "original episode" though?

Never mind, I just check it out. I was mistaken.
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May 2, 2015 12:27 PM

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great episode although things seemd to be moving rather quickly

lancer being cu chulainn is pretty cool. an irish mythological figure is not the first thing i would expect to see in a japanese vn/anime etc.

visually another unlimited budget works episode

seems like medea died happy

i wonder what archer's ultimate goal is

also theory time:

archer is either some sort of ancestor of shirou or an alternate timeline shirou
 
May 2, 2015 12:27 PM

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OH SHIT
RIN in kirei modo~~

yet another great episode :3
 
May 2, 2015 12:27 PM

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Shrimperor said:
mira-nyan said:


Well this isn't Illya's route.

What about Caster and Kuzuki tough?
It's the route they get the most attention.
And Illya's death in the vn was impactful.

The impact of those deaths varies from person to person. Some people were really shaken by Ilya's death.
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May 2, 2015 12:28 PM

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fuck that noble phantasm exchange by archer and lancer was hnnng
had to watch it several times lol

best respective VA performances imo

 
May 2, 2015 12:30 PM

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Shrimperor said:
mira-nyan said:


Well this isn't Illya's route.

What about Caster and Kuzuki tough?
It's the route they get the most attention.
And Illya's death in the vn was impactful.


Yes, because you just read Fate route.

And I know you didn't. But you seem to forget that one was just a heart surgery, the other had backstory. The former being the VN. What you're saying doesn't make sense.
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May 2, 2015 12:31 PM

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What I thought.

Criticism:

[*] They could've balanced the talking and action in Lancer vs Archer a little better. I was hoping for a little more diverse action and some moving around before they started talking - by that I mean, something like their previous engagement at school and Lancer vs Saber.
[*] They could've showed some of the fight in the basement before switching back to Lancer vs Archer. That would've been nice. I guess there wasn't enough time for that much action though.
[*] They barely showed Shirou vs Kuzuki and Shirou looked like shit in that fight. I mean, he does struggle at the end, but it was so short that it made him seem useless.
[*] It was nice to see Archer's swords blinking before going for Shirou, but skipping the dodge altogether and only showing the swords on the ground afterwards was pretty weird and lame.

Praise:

[*] Kuzuki's flashback was short and looked beautiful. It didn't add much at all imo, but it was short so it didn't get in the way of the action. That being said, I believe it would've been better to focus on Shirou's "warm up" before the battle and him noticing he can probably project words more reliably now.
[*] Archer showing his archery skills in the middle of the fight looked pretty awesome. A really nice touch.
[*] While this is late, it's a great thing to see monologues. There were quite a few this time. Better late than never. I hope we'll see more inner monologues in HF.
[*] Rho Aias was simply amazing. The monologue before that after Lancer began the attack felt a little too wordy though, I think they could've summed it up with 2-3 shorter sentences. But what comes next is still fantastic, so that's fine. I bet nobody was expecting that shit, Rho Aias is such a ridiculous projection! I love how they showed the 7 layers being pierced, as I expected.
[*] I don't know why Archer literally attacked the floor (lol) with some of the swords that were meant to Kuzuki, but that trace on was really cool. The attack could have been a little flashier though. And yay for swords piercing Caster.
[*] I liked Kuzuki and Caster's deaths, they were pretty nice. Caster looked really beautiful.

Despite all criticism, I think this episode was 5/5. So far, the best episode of the second cour by far, as I expected.
 
May 2, 2015 12:31 PM
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Guilek said:
Gov said:
Well I guess that ends the argument huh? Lancer risked Shirou and Rin's life based on one assumption.

I gotta go but it was fun arguing.

He didn't risk anything in his minds, a scenario where a masterless servant kill/betray the last master without a servant(= dead for this servant) is very unlikely.


Guys, let's also remember that Archer's first betrayal condition was to let Rin go alive. If Lancer knew that he betrayed them the first time, he probably also knows that Archer made sure Rin didn't die at that point. Also like someone else said, the show's not over yet.
 
May 2, 2015 12:32 PM

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Mickdrew said:
Shrimperor said:

What about Caster and Kuzuki tough?
It's the route they get the most attention.
And Illya's death in the vn was impactful.

The impact of those deaths varies from person to person. Some people were really shaken by Ilya's death.


loli death is always the hardest.
 
May 2, 2015 12:35 PM

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Raziel1991 said:
There really should be a better explanation about Rho aius. I have seen some anime only people saying its a spell lol.



anime only watcher here.
rho aius just seemed like several shields to me not like a spell, just like archer creates/summons his bow and swords.
 
May 2, 2015 12:35 PM
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Kerytugu said:
Othi-tan said:
Because he is Lancer.

Sometimes characters dont over think stuff.

Tbh I always thought this was the stupidest part of the UBW route. Didn't make any sense then, doesnt make any sense now. It's just "How do I let Archer live, even though he cant possibly defeat Lancer" Deus-Ex machina in my eyes.



Lancer thought that Archer was a double agent so he let the man go because he thought that he would help Shirou and Rin and go back to Rin as her servant and help them so because Archer was going to check on both Shirou and Rin, Lancer found that he had no need to do so
 
May 2, 2015 12:36 PM
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Time to wait for Blu-Ray for extended scenes. Oh wait...
 
May 2, 2015 12:38 PM

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Archer versus Lancer felt rushed. Lazy reuse of animation between Tohsaka and Caster. Otherwise was alright; the Noble Phantasm was animated excellently. Still none of the battles in the second season thus far have been that impressive compared to the first season. I'm hoping the plan to step it up in the second half.
kingcity20 said:
Oh for the love of
-_- nvm gotta love MAL
 
May 2, 2015 12:38 PM

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Kerytugu said:
Othi-tan said:
Because he is Lancer.

Sometimes characters dont over think stuff.

Tbh I always thought this was the stupidest part of the UBW route. Didn't make any sense then, doesnt make any sense now. It's just "How do I let Archer live, even though he cant possibly defeat Lancer" Deus-Ex machina in my eyes.


do you even know what deus ex machina is ? lol

 
May 2, 2015 12:40 PM

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UFO confirmed!!!

 
May 2, 2015 12:40 PM
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[*] They barely showed Shirou vs Kuzuki and Shirou looked like shit in that fight. I mean, he does struggle at the end, but it was so short that it made him seem useless.

If Saber can't defeat a Caster magic upgraded Kuzuki, how the fuck does Shirou stand a chance? Just saying, I mean like, Kuzuki isn't weak and if they would be close to equal, it would be ridiculous.
 
May 2, 2015 12:40 PM

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Mathias2001 said:
Kerytugu said:

Tbh I always thought this was the stupidest part of the UBW route. Didn't make any sense then, doesnt make any sense now. It's just "How do I let Archer live, even though he cant possibly defeat Lancer" Deus-Ex machina in my eyes.



Lancer thought that Archer was a double agent so he let the man go because he thought that he would help Shirou and Rin and go back to Rin as her servant and help them so because Archer was going to check on both Shirou and Rin, Lancer found that he had no need to do so


best not think about it too much, the plot armor on the two MC is actually quiet thick to be honest.
so just try to enjoy the show and remember this is probably the only anime that isnt SHIT this season.
 
May 2, 2015 12:41 PM

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mira-nyan said:

Yes, because you just read Fate route.

Wut?
I finished the VN like 6-7 weeks ago, Lala.
 
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