Forum SettingsEpisode Information
Forums
Pages (4) « 1 2 [3] 4 »
Post New Reply
Poll: Ookami to Koushinryou II Episode 7 Discussion


Aug 24, 2009 3:46 PM

Offline
Joined: Jul 2007
Posts: 107
i didn't quite get the staircase scene. why exactly is lawrence a "smooth talker"?
im quite confident in my english but sometimes i just don't get it...

could someone spell it out for me please?
what was going on behind the scenes?
 
Aug 25, 2009 1:56 AM

Offline
Joined: Jun 2008
Posts: 15086
Nice cute episode. And after the developments of the first episodes Holo and Lawrence seem to be closer and more sincere with there feelings.

By the way this new character why is it blond again? Or is it that shepherd girl from season one?
Also am kind of wondering what's wrong with that town. Every one seem to be afraid of something.
Modified by Monad, Aug 25, 2009 6:15 AM
 
Aug 25, 2009 5:58 AM

Offline
Joined: Jul 2009
Posts: 79
A very nice ep :)) after all those very serious episodes there's a one which makes you LOL :D

| The void is endless |
 
Aug 26, 2009 7:33 PM

Offline
Joined: Sep 2008
Posts: 631
Aww! Such a cute episode! I'm loving the relationship development <3
 
Aug 26, 2009 10:37 PM
Offline
Joined: Dec 2008
Posts: 38
so good i just rewatched it and now im looking through the best parts of the show :)
 
Aug 27, 2009 8:34 AM

Offline
Joined: Sep 2008
Posts: 4410
Hmmm I think Horo may still be a Virgin. Even though she does have a human form she still thinks very much like a wolf and wolves usually don't have sex unless it's to produce off spring and I'm pretty sure Horo isn't a mother, she would have at least said so by now. Also Horo is a goddess of harvest. Which ties in with fertility, which is associated with the Virgin image. Also back then I'm pretty sure they had little to no contraceptives, so if she was having sex, it would be fair to say she would have kids by now. But also because of Horo's own personalty has some thing to do with it. I think Horo is way to proud to be dominated by a man like that.
It doesn't think, it doesn't feel, it doesn't laugh or cry..... All it does from dusk till dawn is make the soldiers die.
 
Aug 27, 2009 9:47 AM

Offline
Joined: Jan 2009
Posts: 4910
Jigero said:
Hmmm I think Horo may still be a Virgin. Even though she does have a human form she still thinks very much like a wolf and wolves usually don't have sex unless it's to produce off spring and I'm pretty sure Horo isn't a mother, she would have at least said so by now. Also Horo is a goddess of harvest. Which ties in with fertility, which is associated with the Virgin image. Also back then I'm pretty sure they had little to no contraceptives, so if she was having sex, it would be fair to say she would have kids by now. But also because of Horo's own personalty has some thing to do with it. I think Horo is way to proud to be dominated by a man like that.

Well I suppose that's a way to look at it too, and I'm quite sure that we just can't be sure about this, if they don't bring it up in the anime itself, which I find.. highly unlikely : p
Protip: I don't really check the forums anymore, so if you want something, take it on my profile.
Is it time for my long-awaited return to the forums? щ(゚Д゚щ) Nope™, probably not.
 
Aug 28, 2009 7:38 PM

Offline
Joined: May 2008
Posts: 5088
meh Lawrence pwns everything he sees lmao

Awesome Sig by Lailide
 
Aug 29, 2009 10:33 PM
Offline
Joined: Jul 2009
Posts: 71
OK, I promised some people that I would post this here. Some of you might recognize me as the "Novelfag" who has been explaining confusing scenes this season on /a/. Becuase of a combination of subtitle errors and things that are just plain impossible to subtitle at all, our beloved Spice and Wolf has been hard to understand lately!

So, this will focus on the whole hand-kiss scene from Ep 07. There were a lot of questions floating around about it.

Horo is flirting and says "There's something you want, isn't there?" Lawrence shrugs it off, as usual, and basically calls her a spoiled child.

She responds by bringing up that time when he slapped her hand, and claps her hands to "break the [romance] spell," a playful way of saying "Well, it was fun while it lasted!" Lawrence plays along, "waking up" from the spell and going into merchant mode, with "What am I doing here? Oh, right, furs and lumber! Serious business!" It’s nice to see them treating a breakup as an impossible joke to laugh about :)

Horo brings the teasing back to niceness with "Will you recast the spell, then?" An open invitation to flirt at her. He drops to one knee and gives the deep-voice, eye-contact kiss on her hand. He didn't think it would be a big deal, since Horo is usually bulletproof, but she gets wet and pushes him against the wall.

Despite the good atmosphere, he freezes. She asks "When are you going to loosen up?" He responds, "When you stop doing this to tease me" (better translations).

His words imply that what he truly wants, is for Horo to be lovey-dovey with him, for real.

Horo is shocked at how openly he said it, and asks if he was "smooth-talking." He still doesn't understand, and says that it just popped out.

Horo goes "D'awwwww! That makes me so happy!" Lawrence finally realizes what he siad, and blushes because he hadn’t meant to reveal those feelings.


One problem with animating these novels is that the book narrative makes it very clear that Horo’s feelings for Lawrence are serious. In Lawrence’s private thoughts, he is very insecure and doubts her. He thinks most of her advances are just mind games, and he always deflects them because he refuses to be a sucker. To Horo, however, their romance is 100% real and her way of seducing him is just playful. In the anime, we are restricted only to Lawrence’s thoughts, which makes many viewers misunderstand Horo.

“Couldn’t she just TALK TO HIM?” you ask? Rather than directly tell Lawrence that his assumptions are wrong, Horo’s approach regarding his deflections is to wait patiently until he accepts that she really is serious about him. When he trusts her and understands her true feelings, his resistance will naturally end. To confront him about his insecurities would be ungraceful, and would force things before Lawrence is truly ready.
Modified by jacketboy, Aug 29, 2009 10:47 PM
 
Aug 29, 2009 10:40 PM
Offline
Joined: Jul 2009
Posts: 71
Neither of them is a virgin. Horo talks about at least one lover she's had before, the guy she made the original wheat contract with, in the first village. The way she speaks about him makes it seem like that guy wasn't her first, either. She probably had another before that during her travels, or even a wolf man before she left Yoitsu. 600 years is a long time.

Lawrence's "father figure" guy in Book 2/Bankruptcy Arc mentions how Teenage Lawrence and his friends stole money from the guild to go buy hookers and lose their virginity. And hell, look at him talking with the ladies in Ep 08! I'm sure he did very well for himself when he was single.
Modified by jacketboy, Aug 29, 2009 10:45 PM
 
Aug 30, 2009 3:59 AM

Offline
Joined: May 2008
Posts: 1459
Well anyway, their bond is growing stronger each episode it comes by, I can tell by the way they both sometimes blush out of nowhere, the stair scene was just lovely; I can't use another word except that one, maybe it was really a spell? Joking of course. I can't really say what is Lawrence thinking since he had that random thought on the wagon, I don't even know who was with that Idea. Maybe they both? Horo wasn't blushing by then, so it was probably Lawrence.
 
Aug 30, 2009 4:34 AM

Offline
Joined: Jun 2009
Posts: 93
israfel070 said:
OK, I promised some people that I would post this here. Some of you might recognize me as the "Novelfag" who has been explaining confusing scenes this season on /a/. Becuase of a combination of subtitle errors and things that are just plain impossible to subtitle at all, our beloved Spice and Wolf has been hard to understand lately!

So, this will focus on the whole hand-kiss scene from Ep 07. There were a lot of questions floating around about it.

Horo is flirting and says "There's something you want, isn't there?" Lawrence shrugs it off, as usual, and basically calls her a spoiled child.

She responds by bringing up that time when he slapped her hand, and claps her hands to "break the [romance] spell," a playful way of saying "Well, it was fun while it lasted!" Lawrence plays along, "waking up" from the spell and going into merchant mode, with "What am I doing here? Oh, right, furs and lumber! Serious business!" It’s nice to see them treating a breakup as an impossible joke to laugh about :)

Horo brings the teasing back to niceness with "Will you recast the spell, then?" An open invitation to flirt at her. He drops to one knee and gives the deep-voice, eye-contact kiss on her hand. He didn't think it would be a big deal, since Horo is usually bulletproof, but she gets wet and pushes him against the wall.

Despite the good atmosphere, he freezes. She asks "When are you going to loosen up?" He responds, "When you stop doing this to tease me" (better translations).

His words imply that what he truly wants, is for Horo to be lovey-dovey with him, for real.

Horo is shocked at how openly he said it, and asks if he was "smooth-talking." He still doesn't understand, and says that it just popped out.

Horo goes "D'awwwww! That makes me so happy!" Lawrence finally realizes what he siad, and blushes because he hadn’t meant to reveal those feelings.


One problem with animating these novels is that the book narrative makes it very clear that Horo’s feelings for Lawrence are serious. In Lawrence’s private thoughts, he is very insecure and doubts her. He thinks most of her advances are just mind games, and he always deflects them because he refuses to be a sucker. To Horo, however, their romance is 100% real and her way of seducing him is just playful. In the anime, we are restricted only to Lawrence’s thoughts, which makes many viewers misunderstand Horo.

“Couldn’t she just TALK TO HIM?” you ask? Rather than directly tell Lawrence that his assumptions are wrong, Horo’s approach regarding his deflections is to wait patiently until he accepts that she really is serious about him. When he trusts her and understands her true feelings, his resistance will naturally end. To confront him about his insecurities would be ungraceful, and would force things before Lawrence is truly ready.
Thanks a lot for the detailed explanation, that was very helpful :)
 
Aug 30, 2009 5:09 AM

Offline
Joined: Jul 2008
Posts: 3409
sarahwest said:
israfel070 said:
Thanks a lot for the detailed explanation, that was very helpful :)
I have to agree, it was very elucidating.
 
Aug 30, 2009 6:40 AM
Offline
Joined: Aug 2009
Posts: 190
Defiance said:
sarahwest said:
israfel070 said:
Thanks a lot for the detailed explanation, that was very helpful :)
I have to agree, it was very elucidating.


Thanks israfel070. That does make a lot more sense than the translation. Are you implying that Lawrence is just missing the point entirely, or that at this point he knows how Horo feels and is just hiding his own feelings for some reason?
 
Aug 30, 2009 11:59 PM
Offline
Joined: Jul 2009
Posts: 71
@Bash Lawrence knows she likes him now.

In season 1, his main problem was that her emotional intelligence is vastly better than his, and he feared that she was just trolling him. If he made a move on her and she laughed and said "HAHA, GOT YOU!" and all the tension had been a trick, he would have been crushed.

Book 3/Amarti Arc was entirely about him deciding that she is very important to him, and accepting the same feelings from her. The most important scene was the conversation in ep 6 where he realized that she had been working on his side the entire time, trying to reconcile, and she didn't even really care about the merchant's duel ("You couldn't just walk away from that stupid bet with that boy!"). After that, things drastically improved, as we can see in ep 7.

So to fully answer you, he is not missing the point anymore. I would say that there's a grey area between knowing it mentally, and having real trust in it, and Lawrence has made a biiig move to the lighter side of grey. They even talked about it in ep 7; Horo mentions "You don't trust my flirting because you judge me by your own standard."

He is also trying to hold back his feelings somewhat. He REALLY doesn't want to completely become lovers and then part ways after Yoitsu. In the not-animated Book 4, they meet a lovey-dovey teenage couple, and Lawrence admits that he's envious of how carefree they are, mentioning how the lifespan problem is a serious impediment for him. I can understand; it must be hard to be in love, when you know your lover will live and (probably) love again, long after you're gone. Horo is stung by that- she can't control her lifespan any more than he can, and his feelings imply that HER feelings for him are shallow and temporary.

But they pulled through just fine, and made their way to Beaver Town for Ep 07 :)
Modified by jacketboy, Aug 31, 2009 12:03 AM
 
Aug 31, 2009 5:55 AM

Offline
Joined: Feb 2008
Posts: 712
israfel070 said:

....
Despite the good atmosphere, he freezes. She asks "When are you going to loosen up?" He responds, "When you stop doing this to tease me" (better translations).
His words imply that what he truly wants, is for Horo to be lovey-dovey with him, for real.
Horo is shocked at how openly he said it, and asks if he was "smooth-talking." He still doesn't understand, and says that it just popped out.
Horo goes "D'awwwww! That makes me so happy!" Lawrence finally realizes what he siad, and blushes because he hadn’t meant to reveal those feelings.
...
To Horo, however, their romance is 100% real and her way of seducing him is just playful. ....

0_0

Wow... thats something that makes sense. But it is way beyond everything I have expected from that conversation. I thought they would just tease each other again, and Horo would be surprised about how good Lawrence became in giving response.

Where do you get your information about Horo being 100% sure about her romance with Lawrence? Did you read Volume 5 of the novel already?
 
Aug 31, 2009 11:30 AM
Offline
Joined: Aug 2009
Posts: 190
israfel070 said:
@Bash Lawrence knows she likes him now.


Thanks.. I guess the easy answer is that I should find some more time to read the light novel translations. I was a little confused by the semi-drastic change I saw between eps 6 and 7. I guess if I'm going to read into things I might as well read the source :D

If what you've said is true, I'm expecting this to be the arc where they finally get over this roadblock. It's clear that Lawrence won't be able to resist much longer. Given that we're not even halfway through this story I suspect it won't be a happy end just yet, and that we'll see one hell of a cliffhanger at the end of this season.
 
Aug 31, 2009 10:23 PM
Offline
Joined: Jul 2009
Posts: 71
I'd say that Book 3/Amarti Arc was getting over the big roadblock. Things are already much better in book 4, and so far in eps 7-8.
 
Sep 1, 2009 6:45 AM
Offline
Joined: Aug 2009
Posts: 190
israfel070 said:
I'd say that Book 3/Amarti Arc was getting over the big roadblock. Things are already much better in book 4, and so far in eps 7-8.


Knowing each others feelings is one thing, but I figured the bigger roadblock was for Lawrence/Horo to openly admit their feelings and start figuring out whether to act on them. I get the impression that Lawrence won't be able to hold back very long now. I also get the impression that Horo won't be able to accept it (yet). But hey, I'm speculating just for fun. It's good to be wrong sometimes :)
 
Sep 5, 2009 4:40 PM

Offline
Joined: Jul 2009
Posts: 128
neverless said:
Well Lawrence is gonna stick his head too far into the towns' situation, not suprising at all lol


yeah --"
 
Sep 10, 2009 9:04 PM

Offline
Joined: Jul 2009
Posts: 338


Lawrence of the Rebellion?

Doesn't he seriously look like Lelouch? o.o
 
Sep 10, 2009 9:52 PM

Offline
Joined: Jan 2009
Posts: 4910
controlmajortom said:


Lawrence of the Rebellion?

Doesn't he seriously look like Lelouch? o.o

Sure does, although it's not really surprising at all : p
Protip: I don't really check the forums anymore, so if you want something, take it on my profile.
Is it time for my long-awaited return to the forums? щ(゚Д゚щ) Nope™, probably not.
 
Sep 26, 2009 4:35 AM

Offline
Joined: Oct 2008
Posts: 255
Voiced408 said:
I think Horo and Lawrence is the best couple in all of anime history, and this opinion is coming from the heart. Liiike seriously...I literally watch the episodes from both season over and over again just to see them talk to each other.


You've seen 600+ series (including every single series that I've watched) so I think it's fair to say that your opinion is one that I can value quite highly. Doubt that any couples in anime will surpass the chemistry between Horo and Lawrence.. Good episode once again! Series keeps getting better and better.

S2>S1

Also, in reply to above post: It kinda fits that Lawrence and Lelouch look similar since the same VA is being used.
 
Oct 11, 2009 7:35 AM

Offline
Joined: Jul 2009
Posts: 810
Lawrence is a bit of a dick isn't he?





Slave trade Necessary business
Signature removed. Please follow the signature rules, as defined in the General Forum Guidelines!
 
Oct 11, 2009 9:11 AM
Offline
Joined: Aug 2009
Posts: 190
unellmay said:
Lawrence is a bit of a dick isn't he?

Slave trade Necessary business


Yeah, slave trading was a very conflicted issue in medieval times. Even the Church was wishy-washy about it, and various interpretations of the Bible were used by various sects and ruling bodies to condone it for centuries. It might be easier interpreted in Lawrence's case by remembering that he accepted his fate of being sold into slavery when he lost everything in that armor fiasco, despite it being a death sentence. It is easier to ignore when the laws of the time condone it, especially for a guy like Lawrence who is usually strict about playing within the rules.
 
Oct 14, 2009 7:07 AM

Offline
Joined: Jul 2009
Posts: 6620
That's quite entertaining episode..sit back and lay low, slowing pacing..good for me
 
Oct 15, 2009 3:49 AM

Offline
Joined: Aug 2009
Posts: 706
Really nice, cute, "lovey-dovey" episode xD
I hope they will become a couple at the end of the season!
 
Oct 17, 2009 12:19 PM

Offline
Joined: Aug 2009
Posts: 1658
Horo you teaser! :D

Omg, this episode is full of flirts. Loved how their relationship starts to evolve into a different level. Come on Lawrence, mate with Horo and make wolf babies already!

Wonder who was that mysterious girl in the cloak.
 
Nov 6, 2009 2:58 PM

Offline
Joined: Dec 2007
Posts: 2003
It was so lovely, cute episode plus it was filled of flirts. The progression of their relationship is very wonderful, and their bond is growing stronger each episode. I loved how they blush each other, and Lawrence is a lucky guy to have her.
 
Nov 10, 2009 12:11 PM
Offline
Joined: Nov 2009
Posts: 24
I should be enjoying the flirting more than I am, but this is turning into a stock "will they won't they" anime. At least Lawrence has powerleveled, making the flirting bearable. But I'm confused by it. If he's too dense to realize that the flirts aren't a game anymore, why isn't Horo changing strategies? She's clearly getting frustrated.

Does Horo intend to make Lawrence do everything in the relationship? She used to be assertive and confident, so why is she such a puppy all of a sudden? I mean all she has to do is grab him like in episode 1-4. My guess is that she has lost her nerve, and can only be that forward when she's too hammered to be of interest to Lawrence :S

Regardless, it seems that Lawrence is dangerously close to caving in. I'm guessing it's confession time in this arc.
 
Feb 8, 2010 11:46 AM

Offline
Joined: Jul 2009
Posts: 152
I think Lawrence finally felt in love. So episode is a lot of flirting. But I have a strange feeling about this. Isn't it to fast?

In the other hand I'm glad that Lawrence and Horo relationship has levelup ^^
 
Feb 8, 2010 4:17 PM
Offline
Joined: Nov 2009
Posts: 24
Lawrence more or less figured out his feelings in episodes 4-6. It might be a little tougher to tell what's going on between them if you haven't read volume 4 of the light novels (which would go between episodes 6 and 7). I'm not really "spoiling" anything, but I'll use spoiler tags regardless:

 
May 27, 2010 7:39 PM

Offline
Joined: May 2010
Posts: 278
Horo is SO kawaii.

What did she really think about Lawrence's first kiss on her hand?

And yes, I'm sure Lawrence will dig in too deep here.
 
Jun 19, 2010 9:41 AM

Offline
Joined: Aug 2008
Posts: 2085
Love the interaction between Horo and Lawrence as usual.
 
Jun 25, 2010 11:28 AM

Offline
Joined: Dec 2009
Posts: 3338
^^' i suppose Lawrence doesn't want to have a peaceful travel with Horo after all...
 
Aug 22, 2010 10:38 AM

Offline
Joined: Apr 2009
Posts: 65
What a sweet couple they are... ^^
 
Oct 6, 2010 5:20 AM

Offline
Joined: Sep 2008
Posts: 1700
New arc makes me curious. o: I also thought that other hooded character was guy until Horo pointed out that it was a girl... She reminded me of Sheik almost. XD

All the little moments between Horo and Lawrence were adorable. :) Watching their relationship actually progress... is fun.
 
Jan 5, 2011 7:32 PM

Offline
Joined: Jul 2010
Posts: 2364
that scene at their room leading to the stairways was truely "magical" it was awesome!! best moment ever
also, this new "shiek" woman will probably make horo jealous, which will be awesome to see, tsundere girls (or just girls having tsundere moments) are truely one of the cutest things when they have those moments, lol


 
May 12, 2011 2:57 AM

Offline
Joined: Dec 2009
Posts: 2544
Nice episode~

 
Aug 7, 2011 2:09 AM

Offline
Joined: May 2011
Posts: 2422
That was a powerful spell.But was that girl Nora, hmm. >.>


 
Jan 16, 2012 12:53 AM

Offline
Joined: Dec 2010
Posts: 3892
Lawrence has really become the smooth talker. I just wonder what is Holo thinks she's doing, going all nice on him. At some point they'll have to get their paths separated and Lawrence was really doing it right, acting so tepidly with her. But Holo is really irresponsible after all, she's not surprising me about it.
 
Feb 29, 2012 11:58 PM
The Beginning

Offline
Joined: Sep 2011
Posts: 10119
That. Was. A. Cute. Episode.

Meritas said:
Lawrence has really become the smooth talker.


Agree. xD
 
May 7, 2012 5:24 PM

Offline
Joined: Feb 2012
Posts: 1924
There was a lot of "Spice" and a lot of "Wolf" in the first six episodes, but this episode really put the "and" in "Spice and Wolf."
 
Jun 6, 2012 5:15 PM

Offline
Joined: Mar 2012
Posts: 2880
Hakuromatsu said:
There was a lot of "Spice" and a lot of "Wolf" in the first six episodes, but this episode really put the "and" in "Spice and Wolf."


This. Their relationship is finally developing. Great episode.
Hold the door...
 
Aug 3, 2012 5:03 PM

Offline
Joined: Jun 2012
Posts: 6256
I loved this episode, favorite so far in the series.
 
Aug 26, 2012 7:43 PM

Offline
Joined: Nov 2011
Posts: 1977
Pretty good episode! Almost makes of up Holo missing an episode or two!

"I like to expose what people hide. I'm an intellectual rapist." - Furudo Erika
 
Sep 28, 2012 8:43 AM

Offline
Joined: May 2012
Posts: 22422
Nice and sweet episode really liked how playful they where! The story is a bit slow on the moment but knowing that it will probably change quite soon! Let's see what will happen next episode!
 
Oct 29, 2012 5:52 AM

Offline
Joined: Aug 2009
Posts: 1580
quite a bit of hnngs. I've seen enough Sheik to know where this is going.
 
May 5, 2013 4:51 PM

Offline
Joined: Jan 2013
Posts: 10722
Really cute
 
May 16, 2013 5:06 AM

Offline
Joined: Apr 2013
Posts: 2235
Nice episode. Lawrence and Horo became more closer to each other.

And Lawrence is a smooth talker indeed. And who was the woman in the cloak? I've seen her in the OP all the time.
"My girlfriend is Pururin, and Pururin only!!!"~ Kaoru Yamazaki
 
Pages (4) « 1 2 [3] 4 »