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Effeminate male chars
MyAnimeList.net Forum »» Anime Discussion »» Effeminate male chars

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09-02-13, 2:11 AM

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I can understand why people would call Shinji and Renton whiny, but under-developed?
 
09-02-13, 2:11 AM

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Red_Keys said:
baki502 said:
Red_Keys said:
tsudman said:
But when you have other emo characters that are exccesive with their annoying emotions ( they just have to remind you in every episode how ''miserable and sad'' their life is, just constant whining) and they are never developed properly, it's no wonder people dislike them.
Like who specifically?

Shinji from NGE, Yuki in first half of Mirai Nikki, (insert every second teenager that faces problems here).

I came up with 3 of the top of my head and I am bad with remembering characters...
And those are horrible examples (Never seen Eureka Seven), because they experience incredibly traumatic events.

Sorry, but evading murder and having expectations of unfair and monstrous proportion put onto you ≠ "normal problems teenagers face".

You still dont whine all the time. There is a point where you have to man up and face it. I am sorry but what exactly is traumatic for Shinji? He gets the chance to pilot a fucking giant robot, I would never miss that chance and I dont even care if I died doing so. Renton is a prime example tough since he is in a kind of similar position as Shinji but does not whine about having ot pilot a mech (he enjoys it actuallly) but whines all the time because of his socialization failures with humans and how dumb he was he said or didnt say that just to fuck up again next time.
Yuki from Mirai Nikki is I guess the only one that has legit big problems and he mans up later on but he still whines a whole lot till he does. And since when did whining save your life? What use is there to whining if you fear for your life? If it werent for the power of the mc most characters would die pretty fast cause instead of fighting or trying to change something they whine and expect others to do stuff for them.
 
09-02-13, 2:12 AM

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agaffe said:
I can understand why people would call Shinji and Renton whiny, but under-developed?

No one said that.
 
09-02-13, 2:13 AM

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baki502 said:
I am sorry but what exactly is traumatic for Shinji? He gets the chance to pilot a fucking giant robot
Hahaha, grow up.
 
09-02-13, 2:14 AM

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baki502 said:
Red_Keys said:
tsudman said:
But when you have other emo characters that are exccesive with their annoying emotions ( they just have to remind you in every episode how ''miserable and sad'' their life is, just constant whining) and they are never developed properly, it's no wonder people dislike them.
Like who specifically?

Shinji from NGE, Renton from Eureka Seven, Yuki in first half of Mirai Nikki, (insert every second teenager that faces problems here).

I came up with 3 of the top of my head and I am bad with remembering characters...

baki502 said:
No one said that.
 
09-02-13, 2:15 AM

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Red_Keys said:
baki502 said:
I am sorry but what exactly is traumatic for Shinji? He gets the chance to pilot a fucking giant robot
Hahaha, grow up.

Id rather die young and had the chance to pilot that thing ;).

Edit: And i am not even a fan of mecha shows but mechs themselves are pretty damn cool if they were real.
 
09-02-13, 2:15 AM

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Moe boys are my guilty pleasure.
This topic has not been locked and is still available for discussion.
 
09-02-13, 2:16 AM

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I also with I rather lived in the 1910's and got drafted in WW1, so I could fight in the trenches, because guns are so kewl!!
 
09-02-13, 2:18 AM

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baki502 said:
agaffe said:
I can understand why people would call Shinji and Renton whiny, but under-developed?

No one said that.


This thread isn't about how developed characters are. Infact I agree that showing characters reacting this way usually give them more depth and make them easier to relate to and more "human". The problem is these traits are seen as more feminine traits and the characters are male. While objectively theres nothing wrong with this, in the context of this thread, they're acting in a more feminine way, as opposed to how a male would stereotypically handle a situation.
 
09-02-13, 2:19 AM

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Red_Keys said:
I also with I rather lived in the 1910's and got drafted in WW1, so I could fight in the trenches, because guns are so kewl!!

If you write in Sarcasm please make it less obvious cause it kind of looses its effect when its so obvious.

And i am sorry for not having the same mindset as you and being different. What a horrible thing to do right?
 
09-02-13, 2:19 AM

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battosai-01 said:

Satoshi (NHK)- Same as above, this makes for a more relatable character though and works better considering the genre.

What. I don't think he fits.
Red_Keys said:
tsudman said:
Red_Keys said:
tsudman said:
But when you have other emo characters that are exccesive with their annoying emotions ( they just have to remind you in every episode how ''miserable and sad'' their life is, just constant whining) and they are never developed properly, it's no wonder people dislike them.
Like who specifically?

Shu, Renton, Yuki, Shinji and other Shinji clones. I guess compared to the others, Renton had decent development but that doesn't say much.
How many terrorist organizations have you been forced to become the main pawn of?

How is this relevant? you speak as if that was the only time where he acted like that. I don't really remember Shu that much since I didn't really care for him but he was constantly whining or being depressed with a sad look on his face whenever he faced even the tiniest of problems. He wasn't only ''emo'' when he was confronted with danger ( i.e Inori and that blonde dude, his friend, his everyday life, his talk with Haru when she slapped him ?, etc) he was melancholic before the terrorist thing happened. I think the only time that I empathized with him is when a certain character died.

His character development is hilarious though, emo > hitler > Jesus. Now that's quality writing.
 
09-02-13, 2:21 AM

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tsudman said:
battosai-01 said:

Satoshi (NHK)- Same as above, this makes for a more relatable character though and works better considering the genre.

What. I don't think he fits.
Red_Keys said:
tsudman said:
Red_Keys said:
tsudman said:
But when you have other emo characters that are exccesive with their annoying emotions ( they just have to remind you in every episode how ''miserable and sad'' their life is, just constant whining) and they are never developed properly, it's no wonder people dislike them.
Like who specifically?

Shu, Renton, Yuki, Shinji and other Shinji clones. I guess compared to the others, Renton had decent development but that doesn't say much.
How many terrorist organizations have you been forced to become the main pawn of?

How is this relevant? you speak as if that was the only time where he acted like that. I don't really remember Shu that much since I didn't really care for him but he was constantly whining or being depressed with a sad look on his face whenever he faced even the tiniest of problems. He wasn't only ''emo'' when he was confronted with danger ( i.e Inori and that blonde dude, his friend, his everyday life, his talk with Haru when she slapped him ?, etc) he was melancholic before the terrorist thing happened. I think the only time that I empathized with him is when a certain character died.

His character development is hilarious though, emo > hitler > Jesus. Now that's quality writing.
You should pay closer attention to the shows you watch :/

There is a reason for his antisocial behavior. A reason that is crucial to the story, actually. Like, impossible to miss.
 
09-02-13, 2:24 AM

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battosai-01 said:


The idea that we can gauge how a male would stereotypically handle a situation is what I disagree with, though. They may be not handling the situation in a way that society deems manly, but I haven't seen any indicator that being manly is the stereotypical male response.

Maybe I'm just surrounded by bitches.
 
09-02-13, 2:25 AM

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Red_Keys said:

There is a reason for his antisocial behavior.

Reasons dont make them less whiny. As I mentioned before crying does not change anything and it does not help. So there is not a "real" reason to be whiny ever, and it depends on the character how they act. Some would act and do something instead of whining, other would go into silent desperation aka they dont give a fuck what happens anymore and just give up and then there is the group that constantly has to bitch out loud about it. And these are the kind of character we are talking about now. Bad situation or big problem does not mean you HAVE to bitch or that it is a logical consequence. If the character is not bitchy or whiny he wouldnt be whiny trough hardships either.
Modified by baki502, 09-02-13, 2:34 AM
 
09-02-13, 2:34 AM

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baki502 said:

Reasons dont make them less whiny. As I mentioned before crying does not change anything and it does not help. So there is not a "real" reason to be whiny ever, and it depends on the character how they act. Some would act and do something instead of whining, other would go into silent desperation aka they dont give a fuck what happens anymore and just give up and then there is the group that constantly has to bitch out loud about it. And these are the kind of character we are talking about now. Bad situation or big problem does not mean you HAVE to bitch or that it is a logical consequence. If the character is not bitchy or whiny he wouldnt be trough hardships either.

I agree, the problem is that it's constant. Okay we get it, we don't need to hear and read the same monologue describing your shitty life, a 100 time in the same episode. Having reasons like you said doesn't it make it any less whiny or obnoxious. Why should I relate to a character like that? I don't think if I were in Shinji or Shu shoes I would constantly whine and be angsty and depressed for the majority of the show, at some point I would try to adapt to my terrible situation like a normal human being will eventually do. Constant crying won't improve your situation, you are better off killing yourself. And from the characters I mentioned, I believe that only Yuki's situation is that terrible.
 
09-02-13, 2:36 AM

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tsudman said:
And that is? his father? I don't remember.
Hahahaha xD

baki502 said:
Reasons dont make them less whiny. As I mentioned before crying does not change anything and it does not help. So there is not a "real" reason to be whiny ever, and it depends on the character how they act. Some would act and do something instead of whining, other would go into silent desperation aka they dont give a fuck what happens anymore and just give up and then there is the group that constantly has to bitch out loud about it. And these are the kind of character we are talking about now. Bad situation or big problem does not mean you HAVE to bitch or that it is a logical consequence. If the character is not bitchy or whiny he wouldnt be trough hardships either.
Crying is a typical human response to emotional stress. http://myanimelist.net/forum/?topicid=657859&show=0#msg24876641

And what exactly do you mean by whining? Like, complaining? Talking about their problems?
 
09-02-13, 2:40 AM

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Red_Keys said:
tsudman said:
And that is? his father? I don't remember.
Hahahaha xD

baki502 said:
Reasons dont make them less whiny. As I mentioned before crying does not change anything and it does not help. So there is not a "real" reason to be whiny ever, and it depends on the character how they act. Some would act and do something instead of whining, other would go into silent desperation aka they dont give a fuck what happens anymore and just give up and then there is the group that constantly has to bitch out loud about it. And these are the kind of character we are talking about now. Bad situation or big problem does not mean you HAVE to bitch or that it is a logical consequence. If the character is not bitchy or whiny he wouldnt be trough hardships either.
Crying is a typical human response to emotional stress. http://myanimelist.net/forum/?topicid=657859&show=0#msg24876641

And what exactly do you mean by whining? Like, complaining? Talking about their problems?


Whining = crying/complaining about their problems in an unproductive manner.

Nothing speaks against talking about your problem to someone who then gives you advice to solve your problem. But the kind that just cry and dont even want advice or anything just crying for the sake of it annoy the hell out of me. Maybe its because I am more of a logical person than an emotional and I see no logic in crying since its unproductive that I cant relate to whiny characters...
 
09-02-13, 2:43 AM

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baki502 said:
Whining = crying/complaining about their problems in an unproductive manner.
Kind of like what you're doing in this topic? :S

baki502 said:
Nothing speaks against talking about your problem to someone who then gives you advice to solve your problem.
Whining, on a psychological level, is exactly this. You are voicing, and as a result bringing attention to, your problems with the hope of getting rid of them. That's what any instance of complaining is. Ever.

baki502 said:
But the kind that just cry and dont even want advice or anything just crying for the sake of it annoy the hell out of me. Maybe its because I am more of a logical person than an emotional and I see no logic in crying since its unproductive that I cant relate to whiny characters...
http://myanimelist.net/forum/?topicid=657859&show=0#msg24876641
 
09-02-13, 2:45 AM

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Red_Keys said:
I also with I rather lived in the 1910's and got drafted in WW1, so I could fight in the trenches, because guns are so kewl!!


http://www.youtube.com/watch?v=RRv56gsqkzs

Look at these World War 1 veterans shivering and whining away from their problems like cowards. What effeminate pussies! Why cant they be like real men!!!
Do you want to build a snowman~?
 
09-02-13, 2:46 AM

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I noticed that Kaiji Yuki really does make the characters more annoying, whinny and obnoxious and somewhat more feminine ( Shu, Eren, Haru from accel world, etc)
 
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