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Darklight0303 said: Feer19 said: my question how long has been dead the general,i mean his head felt down wich mean bones were dehydrated if i remember bones took 40 -50 years to be like that if im wrong edit:It takes one year to the corpse to be bones ,and position of the body made felt down the head,anyways we cant se how much dehydrated the body This is a good point. Something tells me Chamber might have lied about how much time has passed. That corpse was not 6 months old. Actually, it makes sense. A corpse even under the best conditions will probably take about a year to become practically a skeleton, maybe a little longer in a sterile environment. Red has been on Earth for about a year, so he and Kugel probably arrived on time but Kugel died either before arrival or on impact. In an airtight environment his body kept it's shape, but with exposure to air, it became what it should have looked like. |
| I'd just like to mention now Ledo has a little chipmunk pet to hookup with Amy's chipmunk, awww. I bet there will be little chipmunk babies for the ending. |
Irenesharda said: Darklight0303 said: Feer19 said: my question how long has been dead the general,i mean his head felt down wich mean bones were dehydrated if i remember bones took 40 -50 years to be like that if im wrong edit:It takes one year to the corpse to be bones ,and position of the body made felt down the head,anyways we cant se how much dehydrated the body This is a good point. Something tells me Chamber might have lied about how much time has passed. That corpse was not 6 months old. Actually, it makes sense. A corpse even under the best conditions will probably take about a year to become practically a skeleton, maybe a little longer in a sterile environment. Red has been on Earth for about a year, so he and Kugel probably arrived on time but Kugel died either before arrival or on impact. In an airtight environment his body kept it's shape, but with exposure to air, it became what it should have looked like. Except not. It takes around 50 years for a body to become skeleton. If you dug out a year old grave it would still be "a bit" meaty" - even when factoring in the bacteria and bugs. |
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Takuan_Soho said: You raise some interesting points, so I am just arguing for the fun of it (and I hope it is fun for you as well!), but you are assuming that all the clones are from the same "master" copy. That is not necessarily true. There could be multiple root stock, the AI may be randomly pairing this multiple roots either to find a particular mutation, or still be in the midst of winnowing down human genes to the "best" one. The first one I think would be the more likely. People often get evolution backwards. The goal isn't to have a single perfect gene, but rather to have the largest possible pool to draw from because we never know what the future has in store. Sure, I don't mind a friendly argument. :) I fully admit I had not considered the possibility multiple gene pools/stock. Like most people when I hear the word "clone" I think of a single source of genetic material. Like the same chromosomes being used over and over again. So if I reapply my thoughts, then the word "clone" becomes a little more flexible. So basically we have clones coming from multiple genetic sources instead of a single source. Given what Darkmatterx76 said about soldiers having genetic material taken from them by the AI, his (her?) theory makes more sense to me. I'm just having a hard time getting past the term "clone." It feels more like eugenics (as I understand the definition of the term) then anything else. It's selective breeding from the best pool of humans in order to preserve those traits, while defective material is rejected. Maybe the small pool of genetic material being mixed and matched by the AI resulted in silver hair and purple eye as dominant traits. But yeah, I'll agree with you about the evolution aspects. Having a single source of genetic material, opposed to an entire pool, wouldn't make much sense. Genetic diversity helps protect against defects and the like. |
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| I saw it coming last week... Considering of urobuchi's usual ways, I was expecting the commander was already dead or he was not a real person. |
| OK this episode was pretty interesting. The BGM/OST during the battle between Striker and Ledo fit the mood quite well, imo. |
Please learn about cel animation and its technical process. Learn how special effects and backlighting were done without computers. |
Fai said: Irenesharda said: Darklight0303 said: Feer19 said: my question how long has been dead the general,i mean his head felt down wich mean bones were dehydrated if i remember bones took 40 -50 years to be like that if im wrong edit:It takes one year to the corpse to be bones ,and position of the body made felt down the head,anyways we cant se how much dehydrated the body This is a good point. Something tells me Chamber might have lied about how much time has passed. That corpse was not 6 months old. Actually, it makes sense. A corpse even under the best conditions will probably take about a year to become practically a skeleton, maybe a little longer in a sterile environment. Red has been on Earth for about a year, so he and Kugel probably arrived on time but Kugel died either before arrival or on impact. In an airtight environment his body kept it's shape, but with exposure to air, it became what it should have looked like. Except not. It takes around 50 years for a body to become skeleton. If you dug out a year old grave it would still be "a bit" meaty" - even when factoring in the bacteria and bugs. Umm, it doesn't take that long. Even Feer19 edited her answer. If I was to factor in bugs, elements, and animals, that body wouldn't have even lasted a year. Maybe you're referring to embalmed or mummified bodies? An even then, those are under certain conditions. You could also be referring to decomp in a coffin, with the embalming procedures done, which slows the process considerably. And also that's taking into account how dry you want your bones. For a small article on it, try here: http://www.wereyouwondering.com/how-long-does-it-take-for-a-body-to-decompose |
IreneshardaJun 23, 2013 9:39 PM
| I really love the title cards before going to commercials that show each character's gear and/or workplace. Nice attention to detail: (spoilered for image size) |
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| People predicting that Colonel Kugel is dead were right. I also expected him to be dead but holy shit I did not expect his head to fall off LOL. Damn that was pretty creepy. The whole Striker VS Chamber fight was animated beautifully. I enjoyed it so much that I start shouting lmao. The OST/BGM that played during the fight fit so well. It made me even more hyped and started rooting for Chamber. Really liked how Pinion helped out Ledo. :) The best episode of Suisei no Gargantia by far. 5/5 |
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| Kugel's head falling off made me think of a scene from the movie dumb & dumber. Lmao http://www.youtube.com/watch?v=Vic2zt4yTxQ |
| What a mess of a story. They are mixing valid points with total bullshit all the time. Score down to 6/10 again. |
Takuan_Soho said: Let me put it into" layman" terms for you. Just because someone says something you don't agree with doesn't make it "illogical". I know this point is wasted on you now, just file it until you enter graduate school. Oh the hypocrisy. And dearie, I graduated school more than decade ago. Clearly you never even finished it. Takuan_Soho said: You are the one assuming all over the place, if your assumptions were vomit we would all have drowned by now. More bullshit~ I am not the one getting proven wrong every single week. How is that "fuck yea, alliance" stance you had, working out for you? or the whole "MC AIs will never be self aware" shit you spewed last week? So far I am only one here using actual arguments while you just simply base EVERYTHING on the basis that it has no point. Takuan_Soho said: What state has survived? Your argument is specious. I am thankful they did not. ANd you don't even have an argument. Takuan_Soho said: The longest surviving regimes have been authoritarian. Democracies have barely scratched 220 years, whereas empires have lasted 500, 1000, or in the case of the Eastern Roman Empire 1500 years. If one were to use history as a guide, then your argument is self defeating. Oh I see, a republican. I have to laugh that you mention stuff like Roman empire, considering all the atrocities that were committed in it overall. If one were to use a history as a guide, Alliance is the version of authoritarian regime that ran unchecked for hundreds if not thousands of years. Takuan_Soho said: Feel free to point out my "bullshitting". The funny thing is that I can bullshit all I want because you can't tell the difference between that and facts. Already did. Feel free to continue ignoring it because it does not fit your elitism. Takuan_Soho said: Pagan without paganism makes about as much sense as christianity without being christian. Say that to thousands of new age sects. Takuan_Soho said: As for it being an "inspiration" for Nazism, not so much. The German Communists tried to co-opt the Volk movement as well. That's the problem with being a "populist" movement, all would be dictatorships try to co-opt you. <implying nazi germany was not built upon populist promises during economical crisis. Oh how you make me laugh. Takuan_Soho said: te] I have never challenged anyone who has said they liked the show, because tastes differ, and are opinions. I have challenged people who have made claims that cannot be supported or who have pretended that there is depth to this show. As Nietzsche once said: "People think that it is deep because no bottom has been discovered, it isn't even shallow." No you just whined week after week about how the show did not fit your narrow-minded standards. And yes, you have challenged. Here's a cookie. Next time if you have actual arguments for your laughable challenge, you might even get two~ Takuan_Soho said: They you might as well say that there is no difference between Nazism and Communism. There's none. Takuan_Soho said: It might be too late to point this out, but all you are doing is mouthing what Stalin thought. Though he included Liberal Democracies into the "fascist" definition. This is why I suggest it might serve you to learn what these differing terms mean, otherwise you are no better than a fascist or a communist or any other type of authoritarian. So we ran out of arguments and started sprouting bullshit again. Bitch please. Takuan_Soho said: Actually I suggest you listen to the episode again. Who said "the strong and the weak support each other through rationality"? Oh wow, you must have ADD - the whole last episode was about that shit. Takuan_Soho said: LOL, you were the one who first accused me of "assuming". Go back and watch the episode, did those people look afraid? How else do you interpret the fact that most of them are smiling as their hoods were raised? How else do you explain that during the prior episode when they were tied up and covered many people in the cult were genuflecting towards them. Strain you bias and actually WATCH something for a change. I am done with this bullshit because its clear that logic can't be applied when talking with you. Unless you start making sense and stop sprouting crap, enjoy your clearly superior girls und panzer moeblobs. |
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eminagnam said: What was the point of the religious sacrifice? I expected something like Logan's Run though. Also wonder what happened to him. It wasn't explained. They were probably the untouchables of the society. It is consistent with the Alliance's view on the weak whom contribute little to nothing to society. It was implied that the Alliance also got rid of these people. I wonder what is going to happen to Gargantia? Seems like the revolt is succeeding but Gargantia also has a secret weapon? :O I think many people had the hutch that the commander was dead but what will it do next! dun dun dun........ |
| Decent fight, though I know this is a story show with a bit o' mecha and not a mecha show (besides the "yunboros" that don't really count there hasn't been more than 1 mech since first episode until the last 2)... All I want to know is, WTF is "Heaven's Ladder"? I assume something old and bad-ass.... |
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A little disappointed that we don't get a focus on human on human conflict and ideology, and that HAL makes an appearance in another show, but I was still entertained. I still got a little bit of the mecha action I've been craving. And I'm really interested to see WTF Heaven's Ladder is. An orbital satellite laser? Some old bad ass war machine? Something that makes the Hideauze crazy horny and violent... I don't know how that's a weapon, but it SOUNDS dangerous. |
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Venjur said: Decent fight, though I know this is a story show with a bit o' mecha and not a mecha show (besides the "yunboros" that don't really count there hasn't been more than 1 mech since first episode until the last 2)... All I want to know is, WTF is "Heaven's Ladder"? I assume something old and bad-ass.... maybe another advanced yunboro or some big ass laser beam o_0 |
| I guess I'm a little bit surprised that the Kugel is dead and Striker is the one controls things from behind but I was too focused on the intense battle |
MyAmyJun 23, 2013 11:15 PM
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Takuan_Soho said: Eugenics can include cloning, but not all cloning is eugenics. So the two are related, but not the same thing. Understood. Thanks for the clarification. Takuan_Soho said: The show has never addressed why people have those traits. Perhaps they developed because humanity hasn't been exposed to natural sunlight in the time they left earth, maybe they have developed because there is a inherent advantage to them, or maybe they developed because when humanity fled earth a genetic bottleneck was created and this was the result. Assuming it was selective breeding is an assumption, granted one that I agree with, but not one that has been explained. It is true issue of the silver hair and purple eyes aren't directly addressed in Gargantia. All of your theories are valid and the show leaves it up to the viewer to infer.( Unless this stuff will be explained in the light novels and upcoming OVAs.) That said, I don't feel an explanation is needed, as the shot of the soldiers served its purpose. It's to show the soldiers are mass produced (in some fashion) and are largely devoid of individuality. This is another sharp contrast to the diverse and lively people on Gargantia. Takuan_Soho said: Actually the idea that an advanced technological civilization would eliminate someone based on mere physical power is a bit idiotic. Brains, not brawn is what is important. In a space faring culture an intellect like Stephan Hawkings would be worth more than Arnold Schwarzenegger. Granted "ideology" is pretty stupid, so the Alliance policy could be as stupid, but again we don't know if it is based on ideology, economics, or some other factor. Personally, I'm going to chalk that up to the hopelessness of the situation. Once upon a time brains were probably valued over raw brawn but as resources became scarce it made no sense take care sick children. Why waste those resources on someone can't directly kill Hideauze when they can be directed to an able-bodied person? It's the ruthless efficiency of machine-like thinking. And why worry about having really intelligent humans? They only need to follow orders without question and work with their the AI on their mechs. Takuan_Soho said: The horrible thing about this series is that it brings up all these interesting questions, but it doesn't provide any information so we can properly judge, instead it presents situations where the answer is obvious: life inside of chamber sucking protein bars, or life having Amy or Bellows gyrate on top of you. It doesn't take "development" to understand the truism behind the expression how 'Ya Gonna Keep 'Em Down on the Farm? (After They've Seen Paree)?" I'm finding plenty of food for thought here, just by examining the world as it's presented. The plot and pacing aren't perfect but I'm satisfied with the series. I'm going at it from the angle of "finding one's own way in life." I've mentioned it before I see the GA as a strict regiment where one is told to do all of their life. Ledo's trip through the wormhole represents graduating from the institution and leaving a way of life he'll never return to. Gargantia would be the potentially endless freedom adult life brings including being separated from friends and meeting new people. That includes both intrigue and a sense of being lost if you're told to do with your life. So Ledo has to navigate this strange new world and learn to make his own decisions in life. Since this is how I latched on to the show, I'm fine with some things never being fully explained. Life can be frustrating like that. It may reek of lazy writing to some but I'm fine being free to interpret the world as I please, rather than being feed an info dump. Of course Gargantia is going to look appealing in contrast to the GA and their methods, it's the conclusion the writers want you to come to. Personally, I'd want nothing to do with the Alliance (except for their awesome technology) but they did what they had to do in order to survive. When push comes to shove, freedom is always ditched when humanity is pushed to the extreme. When it comes scare resources and endless war the needs many take precedence over individuality in an orderly society. And I apologize for any typos. I'm pretty tired at this point and words are becoming incoherent now. |
silver_huskeyJun 23, 2013 11:27 PM
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Takuan_Soho said: Fai said: JoaoZangetsu said: You don't make sense, All the episodes so far have developments, this one was most action (which is obvious that would be action). Or do you call development the Visual Key type of development ? (characters with sad past just to be enjoyable) Don't you know - in MAL, development = LASER PEW PEW BOOM, while character development and growth = filler :P Actual a laser would have been more subtle than this show has been. At least make the cult somewhat rational, give Ledo an actual choice to show his "development". The Alliance at least had the Hideauze threat to justify its actions, this cult had nothing. Ledo's choice once again was too simple, hell even Hitler could have made the right choice here. Saying that Ledo "developed" is like saying that a kid who picked an ice cream sundae over sand is "wise". Rational ? a religious cult ? serious ? They already explained and showed why the cult is attacking, i don't even need to. and you don't make sense again, what is the right choice here ? attacking what he was trying to protect ? |
| 4/5 because the twist was predictable the moment they explained why KUGEL cant leave his mech. and i really hope there will be a REAL mech vs mech battle next week because this was pretty poor sofar. |
neontaster said: I really love the title cards before going to commercials that show each character's gear and/or workplace. Nice attention to detail: (spoilered for image size) I love this cards rather than ending cards! Last episode..I wonder there will be any cards since this ep just cut off the opening song. |
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| I thought Kugel was actually a hidaazue for a minute there. Otherwise, I would've guess he was dead anyway. Though I hope that that corpse was actually some clone of him and that the real him would be still around - like maybe he fought against the AI system and fled or something. How does one's head even fall off like that? One explanation is that it is made by some artificial substance. |
| Well I must say I actually saw this coming for once. Here comes the Urobutchering! |
| Part of Refrain Subs for Little Busters!: Refrain Recently Played/Read VNS (Most Recent to Oldest): - Da Capo - Grisaia no Kajitsu - ef - a fairy tale of the two - G-senjou no Maou - Sharin no Kuni, Himawari no Shoujo & Sharin no Kuni, Yuukyuu no Shounenshoujo (Fan Disk) - Rewrite - Hoshizora no Memoria -Wish upon a shooting star- - Clannad - Little Busters EX! |
| It was nice seeing Ledo make the right choice! Can't wait for next weeks season finale! I've really enjoyed watching this anime! |
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diabloamezon said: Maybe Heaven's Ladder was some kind of space portal? The thing is - HOW would that help? "we are in trouble, quickly lets bring in evil space squids and an entire fascist regime to us~" Its more likely to be an orbital satellite cannon. alan0w0 said: I thought Kugel was actually a hidaazue for a minute there. Otherwise, I would've guess he was dead anyway. Though I hope that that corpse was actually some clone of him and that the real him would be still around - like maybe he fought against the AI system and fled or something. How does one's head even fall off like that? One explanation is that it is made by some artificial substance. mummification and sudden exposure to outside air Zeally said: eminagnam said: What was the point of the religious sacrifice? I expected something like Logan's Run though. Also wonder what happened to him. It wasn't explained. They were probably the untouchables of the society. It is consistent with the Alliance's view on the weak whom contribute little to nothing to society. It was implied that the Alliance also got rid of these people. I wonder what is going to happen to Gargantia? Seems like the revolt is succeeding but Gargantia also has a secret weapon? :O I think many people had the hutch that the commander was dead but what will it do next! dun dun dun........ ^ this its pretty much identical in terms of a scene set up with how we have seen Ledo's presumably brother being jettisoned out of into space. |
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| Nice episode though I was bothered by the previous one greatly. Not gonna lie, when the hatch was opening, I was expecting a Hideauze in the cockpit!! Haha I hope the plot is not simply about a rouge AI wanting to be god because it's pretty underwhelming and has been used before. But with the last episode coming, I don't think this basic structure is gonna change. Btw, the story has changed from Hideauze vs. human to human vs. human on the basis of ideal society. Suddenly, the all powerful shadowy enemy turned out to be pretty squishy *pun intended* while the main antagonist AI does not seem to be strong enough to put our protagonists in any grave danger. This leads to my little beef on the rebellion. For a fight against the entire social structure at its height (preparing for war), the rebellion seemed to run so smoothly. The cult were barely putting up a fight even though they should have superior fire power. Let's hope that Urobuchi has some minimal realistic sacrifices for us in the last episode. No one needs to die, some injuries should be sufficient Chamber actually surprised me. Its character is very interesting since it is very loyal to Ledo, even going against the Alliance hierarchy of command. This also supports the idea that AIs in the series are actually more like a sentient beings than a mere computerized construct. Striker had shown to be able to go alone at will using its self-determination without the Commander's instruction. It also signaled the ability of manipulating humans using fear and superstition. I want to know more about Striker but unfortunately there is one more episode left. One twist I think Uro can pull in the end revolves around is the golden key. It might be able to unlock ancient technologies from the nations that support the "Human Evolution" program, including even real Hideauze! If you guys recall, quite a lot of countries supported and protected the "Evolvers." It can be a great twist if Gargantia were actually descendants of those people. Hideauze and Hideauze's tech might have been the reason human survived the Ice Age. Thus, I fully expect the giant Whale Squid emerges right in the middle of Gargantia's fleets with Amy controlling it. Makes it happens, Gen! |
ThangLongJun 24, 2013 2:34 AM
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| Some may say after this episode they find the series disappointing. Yet to me I think this episode is done pretty well - it goes back to earlier reference of the main theme, particularly the key scene of rain water gathering and the cross reference of the child being sacrificed with Ledo's childhood "brother" and Amy's brother. The exchanges between Chamber and Ledo is also fairly convincing and the build-up of why Pinion and Ledo decided to make the bold move is handled quite well. I still have my disappointment of how this episode went for the obvious path for the story, and I cannot say the series has met all my expectations several episodes back, but as far as this episode is concerned I would say it is a rather good watch for me. |
| So MAL finally starts locking news threads that are only a few weeks old? I wonder where was the announcement of this change? Or we are seeing yet another case of changes made that impacted users but not communicated to them? I wonder how long people would put up with this. As much as I have a bunch of information to share about anime announced recently I cannot share it in news board, and the anime series is too disorganized and chaotic to share information except with people already interested in the particular series. |
ThangLong said: Actually I would not say its social structure is at its height. Clearly it fails to subjugate the pirates and the Pinion's fleet has yet to be incorporated to any extent. The rebellion involves at least 3 forces - Ledo, Pinion's fleet and the pirates. The cult ignored Ledo because they deemed it much above their level (it is a fight between gods) and they acted to put down the rebellion on the ground, but the pirates helped a great deal in blunting the assaults. The cult may have superior firepower, but they were not even in a position to deploy it.This leads to my little beef on the rebellion. For a fight against the entire social structure at its height (preparing for war), the rebellion seemed to run so smoothly. The cult were barely putting up a fight even though they should have superior fire power. |
| So MAL finally starts locking news threads that are only a few weeks old? I wonder where was the announcement of this change? Or we are seeing yet another case of changes made that impacted users but not communicated to them? I wonder how long people would put up with this. As much as I have a bunch of information to share about anime announced recently I cannot share it in news board, and the anime series is too disorganized and chaotic to share information except with people already interested in the particular series. |
| I find it interesting that Chamber didn't hesitate to do what Ledo said. All around good episode, looking forward to seeing how it ends. |
| Woah that fight felt pretty dam good because of that OST, loved it! So everyone's prediction about Striker was right :O |
diabloamezon said: ThangLong said: One twist I think Uro can pull in the end revolves around is the golden key. It might be able to unlock ancient technologies from the nations that support the "Human Evolution" program, including even real Hideauze! If you guys recall, quite a lot of countries supported and protected the "Evolvers." It can be a great twist if Gargantia were actually descendants of those people. Hideauze and Hideauze's tech might have been the reason human survived the Ice Age. Thus, I fully expect the giant Whale Squid emerges right in the middle of Gargantia's fleets with Amy controlling it. Makes it happens, Gen! This spark me again of what's Heaven's Ladder be, some kind of Hideauze-metamorphosis? That's can explain why it's call Heaven's Ladder, some kind of machine for transcend human. Just some thought. If this was Hideauze-technology related it isn't gonna end well. I am actually beginning to think that Gargantia citizens are actually descendants of Evolvers who returned to the human form as the ice age ended, to live with the rest of humanity. DoctorDoom said: I find it interesting that Chamber didn't hesitate to do what Ledo said. All around good episode, looking forward to seeing how it ends. Chamber has been giving excuses to Ledo to act on his own for quite some time now. Its as if he is testing him for whatever reason. In this episode especially he was calmly waiting till Ledo finishes his thought, it almost felt parent-like. |
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| Whale Squid Riders of Gargantia! The spice, the spice... |
| So Kugel is dead. I wasn't sure If he was when I watched the previous episode so the people who guessed he is dead, were right. But I didn't expect his head to fall off. The fight between Chamber and Striker was nicely done. And I liked how Pinion changed his mind quickly and helped Ledo. Final episode next week. Let's see what UroButcher wrote about it XP |
| A lot of us had a hunch that Kugel was dead in the previous episode so kudos to everyone who felt this way :) |
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ShanaFlame said: Kudos to us but ... bad on the show for being so predictable...A lot of us had a hunch that Kugel was dead in the previous episode so kudos to everyone who felt this way :) |
| an action episode and this was awesome! |
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hpulley said: I am one who is disappointed by the predictability of the Kugel situation (and the shift of theme to rouge AI and the question of how easy the AI became sentient). I mean, Urobuchi even decided to repeat a Mami on Kugel !! LOLShanaFlame said: Kudos to us but ... bad on the show for being so predictable...A lot of us had a hunch that Kugel was dead in the previous episode so kudos to everyone who felt this way :) |
| So MAL finally starts locking news threads that are only a few weeks old? I wonder where was the announcement of this change? Or we are seeing yet another case of changes made that impacted users but not communicated to them? I wonder how long people would put up with this. As much as I have a bunch of information to share about anime announced recently I cannot share it in news board, and the anime series is too disorganized and chaotic to share information except with people already interested in the particular series. |
| Holy shit, Pinion is bishie as fuck. Just thought I'd mention that. |
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symbv said: hpulley said: I am one who is disappointed by the predictability of the Kugel situation (and the shift of theme to rouge AI and the question of how easy the AI became sentient). I mean, Urobuchi even decided to repeat a Mami on Kugel !! LOLShanaFlame said: Kudos to us but ... bad on the show for being so predictable...A lot of us had a hunch that Kugel was dead in the previous episode so kudos to everyone who felt this way :) Gotta agree with rouge AI act.... It's like they pulled a deus ex machina.... Anyway...l still an enjoyable episode..... |
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| Wow, the gundam is acting on its own? All out war!, nice. So Pinion can be likable.... The soundtrack sounds like IronMan. Lol @ the head falling off. Urobutcher ftw. |
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