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| I really liked that song. So, Koza tricked them. |
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| okay episode, not much to say |
| That hoe got what she deserved |
| خ |
| I get that Mugen is pretty dumb, but falling for the same trick twice is just too much. I got my share of Jin awesomeness though, so I'm not going to complain any further. |
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| This comment section is wild. I'm honestly wondering if I missed something. Just watching this show, it's clear to me that none of these characters are saints. Not Jin and not Mugen either. So to have this girl be called a whore and a bitch and how ''well-deserved'' it supposedly is that she lost her chance at freedom is wild to me. The moment she heard about Mukuro’s plan, she went to tell Mugen’s friends about it. During all of the episodes (ep13 and 14) she’s shown that she does truly care about Mugen and I sincerely doubt, with the way she mourned his supposed death (2x) and wanted to leave with Mugen and rushed to his friends’ side so they could save him, that she wanted Mugen to die. That was Mukuro’s plan. Not hers. Ep 13 made that clear. She asked what would happen to Mugen and that Mukuro got all sly looking; think it's save to say that killing Mugen was not her plan or in her plans. So since she rushed to save Mugen when she found out about the plan, the only thing she did ‘wrong’ in Mugen’s eyes is manipulating Jin to have Mukuro killed. Mugen got angry when Jin told him that Mukuro was dead. But, correct me if I'm wrong, didn't this girl say that Mukuro killed her mother? This was not debunked during the episode, was it? Presuming then that what she said is true--sounds to me that she has every good reason to have Mukuro killed just on that basis alone. Then there's the fact that Mukoro told her that ‘Shiren was waiting inside’ when she was about to enter the room of the guy who turned out to be her lover. So that sounds to me that Mukoro was going to prostitute her out for his own end goals (since he wasn't aware of her relationship with that guy, means that Mukuro was acting on the basis of letting her use her body so he could achieve his goals). She also made it clear that her life was hell, so it's fair to assume she went through hell and that Mukuro had a part in that. She’s so villainized to a ridiculous amount by all of you when her entire arc shows just how 'gray' her situation is. Then Mugen strips her from her only means of survival (when she hadn’t done anything nearly as bad to him) and everyone praises him for being angry that she had Mukuro… her tormenter… killed? For using whatever means she had, in this case manipulation, so a piece of shit could die and she could live on? So she’s called a bitch, because she had the killer of her mom killed? She’s called a bitch when she tried to save Mugen? She’s called a whore when she was probably being whored out? Why should she spare Mukuro so Mugen could do whatever he wants to do to Mukuro when she has every reason to have Mukuro killed? Hell, at this point she didn’t even know that Mugen was alive. She thought he died during the blast. You know, the blast she tried to prevent when she rushed to Mugen’s friends so they could save him? Why is Mugen's desire for a face-off with Mukuro, or even have revenge, more valid than her desire for vengeance and/or freedom? Mugen had made it clear that he wasn't open to leaving with her, so sounds to me that it was pretty understandable if she's like ''well fuck your feelings then, Mugen’’. I’m honestly frustrated at the fact that she lost her means to survival and all she really did was get a piece of shit killed. The men who died on the boat that Mugen was on didn’t even die because of her plan, but because of Mukuro’s plan. |
StarisametaphorOct 13, 2020 12:22 PM
...At least let me finish.   |
| it was a perfect revenge n all but really tho...I'm getting kinda sick of sudden deaths and abrupt endings, without enough details as to how things came to be the way they did and what this guy said : Starisametaphor said: This comment section is wild. I'm honestly wondering if I missed something. Just watching this show, it's clear to me that none of these characters are saints. Not Jin and not Mugen either. So to have this girl be called a whore and a bitch and how ''well-deserved'' it supposedly is that she lost her chance at freedom is wild to me. The moment she heard about Mukuro’s plan, she went to tell Mugen’s friends about it. During all of the episodes (ep13 and 14) she’s shown that she does truly care about Mugen and I sincerely doubt, with the way she mourned his supposed death (2x) and wanted to leave with Mugen and rushed to his friends’ side so they could save him, that she wanted Mugen to die. That was Mukuro’s plan. Not hers. Ep 13 made that clear. She asked what would happen to Mugen and that Mukuro got all sly looking; think it's save to say that killing Mugen was not her plan or in her plans. So since she rushed to save Mugen when she found out about the plan, the only thing she did ‘wrong’ in Mugen’s eyes is manipulating Jin to have Mukuro killed. Mugen got angry when Jin told him that Mukuro was dead. But, correct me if I'm wrong, didn't this girl say that Mukuro killed her mother? This was not debunked during the episode, was it? Presuming then that what she said is true--sounds to me that she has every good reason to have Mukuro killed just on that basis alone. Then there's the fact that Mukoro told her that ‘Shiren was waiting inside’ when she was about to enter the room of the guy who turned out to be her lover. So that sounds to me that Mukoro was going to prostitute her out for his own end goals (since he wasn't aware of her relationship with that guy, means that Mukuro was acting on the basis of letting her use her body so he could achieve his goals). She also made it clear that her life was hell, so it's fair to assume she went through hell and that Mukuro had a part in that. She’s so villainized to a ridiculous amount by all of you when her entire arc shows just how 'gray' her situation is. Then Mugen strips her from her only means of survival (when she hadn’t done anything nearly as bad to him) and everyone praises him for being angry that she had Mukuro… her tormenter… killed? For using whatever means she had, in this case manipulation, so a piece of shit could die and she could live on? So she’s called a bitch, because she had the killer of her mom killed? She’s called a bitch when she tried to save Mugen? She’s called a whore when she was probably being whored out? Why should she spare Mukuro so Mugen could do whatever he wants to do to Mukuro when she has every reason to have Mukuro killed? Hell, at this point she didn’t even know that Mugen was alive. She thought he died during the blast. You know, the blast she tried to prevent when she rushed to Mugen’s friends so they could save him? Why is Mugen's desire for a face-off with Mukuro, or even have revenge, more valid than her desire for vengeance and/or freedom? Mugen had made it clear that he wasn't open to leaving with her, so sounds to me that it was pretty understandable if she's like ''well fuck your feelings then, Mugen’’. I’m honestly frustrated at the fact that she lost her means to survival and all she really did was get a piece of shit killed. The men who died on the boat that Mugen was on didn’t even die because of her plan, but because of Mukuro’s plan. |
ZurakoDesu_Nov 20, 2020 7:14 AM
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| My favourite episode so far. |
| Mugen was like "your life is worthless". that's why he didn't even bother killing her,walked by her like she was a piece of shit. |
| Oh so that's how it is. Tbh I would've liked it more if Mugen killed her but this is ok too I guess. Bit of a softie Mugen was |
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| I had put this anime on hold for quiet some time despite having enjoyed it, I thought it was the type of anime that is supposed to be watched slowly and not binged and kept delaying it. I came back to it today, and it showed me why I loved it, and why I gave it a 10. This was such a beautiful and impactful episode with that song and those visuals, which I think is going to stick with me for a long time. |
| how is everyone so impressed? this is so boring lol |
If you don't like me, acquire some taste |
Animesthetic_Guy said: I loved the episode...But the thing that i loved the most is the soothing poem that the grandma was singing...It just gave a goosebumps🔥💜😍 i did like that music though, that was nice |
If you don't like me, acquire some taste |
| Really good episode. The song at the beginning was great. A lot of betrayal in a span of two episodes is baffling. She betrayed mugen and got what she had coming. Tbh, people here hate her very much, it's kinda undeserved. |
SPU_RR said: SpiritGT said: how is everyone so impressed? this is so boring lol you gave 10 to a dragon ball movie, no wonder that you would be bored by that that dragon ball movie was dope though, however dbz itself is meh, esp the last saga was shit |
If you don't like me, acquire some taste |
| haha.. you'll never achieve a beautiful life girl... nice ep |
| What an ep, and the BGM at the end was really good and the to KOZA was perfect her existence doesn't matter anymore to Mugen. and knowing koza leaving her alive is the best as for her the World is hell and she use other people for her advantage but well now she is all alone with nothing left, i am pretty sure she can't even free herself from the world. |
 Thank you for the present, Santa Snowman 2 |
| Mugen was actually kinda scary at the last scene, serves Koza right for she deceived and used him. I guess I kinda feel bad cause she lost everything in her life. This arc was great, we finally got some backstory for Mugen. |
-Facktack-Sep 19, 2021 2:54 AM
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| I had no idea Koza was cheating on them. However, Mugen got revenge in a perfect way. |
asdasdsadad |
| When you bring a gun to a knife fight in anime I thought it was going to end with Mugen regretting and pouting that he was played, essentially double-played that is, and with the girl and her lover going into the sunset with their huge stash of gold. But no, Mugen hobbles up to the guy charging at him and carves him up. He hobbles toward the girl, who was probably expecting to receive the same treatment. But Mugen walks right paster and walks on, leaving her alive, leaving her with a pain worse than death. She begs him to kill her, but he doesn't even stop, he keeps going, unfazed, and his revenge served. I guess they really did have some sort of bond back then. Rather than caring more about the gold, Mugen cared more about getting even with this chick (sorry I forget her name); giving her back payment for her betrayal. And a savage one it was at that. |
  NYANPASU  5700XT |
| I gotta say... I really feel sorry for Koza. A lot of people are saying this is the "perfect revenge", but this didn't sit right with me at all. Almost everyone seems to be calling her a whore, manipulator, or villain, but all I see is a desperate, beaten down girl who knows that the life she's experiencing is not worth living. In a cruel, violent world, being moral is something only the powerful can do - those plenty in either riches or in strength. And if you're not one of these people, it's a dog-eat-dog world. Just think about it from her perspective. She was raised on an island full of criminals - something she described as hell itself. Constantly witnessing the killing, treachery, and despair around her, she probably came to view the world as an utterly bleak, pointless existence. And in order to survive in such a harsh world, she had no choice but to stick with Mugen and her brother. She has no survival skills. She is not strong. If she were alone, she would most definitely die. But keep in mind that her lifestyle is something she loathes entirely. She hates her brother, who abuses and controls her. She hates his crew, who find pleasure in killing and plundering. She longs for freedom - something she has never had. Instead, she's trapped into her brother's gang and forced to do his bidding. The only happiness she's probably experienced in her life are her moments with Mugen, who she develops feelings for. Unfortunately for her, Mugen is cold and never pays her much attention. And then, he supposedly dies. Now, can you imagine just how miserable her life is? And who knows how many times her brother beats her. But then, everything changes. Muroko comes up with a plan to steal some gold and plans to double-cross his entire crew in the process. And please remember, this is all Muroko. He is the mastermind behind all this killing. Can Koza do anything about it? No. Can she run away? Not at all, for the reasons described above. But when Shiren falls in love with her, an opportunity arises. They could betray and kill Muroko and run away together with the gold. And to Koza, this is her only option. To make my point clear, let me lay her options out: Option A: keep being abused and controlled by Muroko and his crew for the rest of her life (and who knows how long she'll be able to stay alive like that, anyway?) Option B: Kill Muroko(who she hates), steal the gold, and run away with Shiren, who will take care of her. Option C: Suicide. Tell me, are there really any other options than these? If so, enlighten me. Anyway, which option would you pick if you were her? Still, Mugen arriving does add another option, so let me add that below. Option D: Run away with Mugen, who she loves. And she actually does ask him to run away with her, remember? What does Mugen do? He rejects her coldly... what a guy. And accepting that Mugen will never care about her, she dismisses this option. And... now we're back to the first three options! And looking at them carefully, it's no wonder she would pick Option B! The deaths of Muroko's crew as well as the people guarding the gold were inevitable; Muroko's plan was already laid out. The only person she truly betrays in her plan is her brother. And what about Mugen? Well, she only finds out that Muroko is planning to betray him on the the night before the heist. And what does she do? She immediately runs to Fuu and Jin and tells them to rescue Mugen. Why? Because she still cares about him deeply. Tell me, if she were a coldhearted manipulator, why would she have ran to them in the first place and risk putting her plan in jeopardy? Of course not. She's just a desperate girl who longs to be free of her abusive life, yet cares about Mugen (who clearly doesn't care about her in the slightest). In the end, she gets Jin to kill Muroko, which enables her to finally live, for once in her life. And sadly, Mugen ruins it all due to his narrow-minded revenge. It's so sad... honestly. But I'm not critiquing the show here; I'm only critiquing everyone who's saying that Koza got what she deserved. Samurai Champloo is great for including a bleak episode like this, and I laud it for doing so. So what's left for Koza? It's a no-brainer. Death is what awaits her, either by suicide or the world trampling on her yet again. Likely the former. |
| @Anata_no_kotei exactly my thoughts. I don't know what the people calling Koza whore were expecting. Maybe to live her life in sorrow regardless of Mugen being alive or not after the boat explosion? It's a good character development because even if she chose to betray her brother she took actions. Koza probably won't be in the following episodes but if she appears I hope she is doing well. |
| I wasn't expecting any of the plot twists, let the girl live seems like the perfect revenge, now she doesn't have anyone or anything. 5/5 |
| Koza is horrible, period. But it's perfectly alright to have sympathy for someone like her while also acknowledging this. Just as we can acknowledge Mugen was once horrible, too. Good people don't hack away at innocent sailors and tacitly overlook the death of those who are supposedly like family to them to get their needs met. I don't know who needs to hear this, but acts of evil are NOT a result of mental health (unless it's like, psychosis), broken homes, miserable childhoods, etc. They are a conscious and deliberate decision. And to be evil is a second nature every human is capable of taking on in its own attempts to overcome evil. Doesn't make it less so. Be consistent and extend this infantilization, deflection, and minimization to other criminals and you'll find yourself excusing some horrible stuff/enabling their behavior. There is the excuse of her being a minority and woman in the Edo period, but I don't think Watanabe took that into account much, considering how there's a track called "Koza's deception". Moreover, she's contrasted to Fuu, a character who puts her life on the line for mere STRANGERS and a woman who values her independence heavily (as evidenced in the finale). These things are done in order to illustrate morals and principles. And considering how this is a spiritual successor to Bebop, I can't help but notice the similarities in the way it does so. Julia leaves Spike for dead. She knew his plans to fake his death and knew nobody was aware of their meeting spot. She had time to run away without leading anyone anywhere. She chose not to risk her life to try to be with the person she "loves". Koza leaves him for dead three times, the two other instances being on the sugar ship and when when he's about to be executed. Koza chose not to risk her life to try to save the person she might love. Both women (rather pathetically) plead and beg seemingly unresponsive men to run away in order to fulfill their own urgent needs eg. just before a big heist or right when a hit is ordered out on them. (This parallel leads me to believe Mugen once loved Koza, actually. Especially considering how images of her dominated his near death experience). Ultimately, Fuu and Faye risking their lives to save these men would turn into a minor detail if not for these kinds of betrayals and revelations. It's in this way that I actually prefer Vicious and Mukuro to the both of them. A hypocrite is always worse than a clear enemy. Anyone who embraces their evil and deceit has more of my respect than someone who pretends otherwise. |
horrorcoresJun 6, 2022 1:16 AM
| Another open ending. Mugen looked totally different at the end. |
| With the exception of the scene when Jin killed Muroku this was very boring. |
SafrichhAug 31, 2022 9:33 PM
| 3/4 of the episode was this show's version of Ballad of the Fallen Angels, i know it is supposed to take inspiration from Cowboy Bebop, but i thought that was a bit too much. The last quarter though.... holy shit that was good. It bamboozled me completely. I don't know what to say about Koza. I know her living environment is horrible, but what's the point of keep living if she had to carry with her memories of such betrayal to Mugen? |
| Mugen doesnt deserve this man. When they show us his backstory when he was drowning and on top of that he gets played by the girl he liked over some npc. Not cool one bit :( |
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