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Poll: Fate/Zero 2nd Season Episode 12 Discussion


Jun 26, 2012 1:51 PM

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Kurogashi said:
Wow Berserker is pretty beast. So, I guess Gil is the strongest...

What about Archer (Emiya) vs Gil?

Strange Fake (from that link) is fan made, but apparently 'approved' -- whatever that means, lol.

http://myanimelist.net/forum/?topicid=435277
here you will find some answers,although most are speculations.

At least it looks more canon than Fate/extra
 
Jun 26, 2012 2:02 PM

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Enkidu design was also used in the Sensha Otoko parody by Type Moon, so I think it can be considered canon.
Modified by Trenerka, Jun 26, 2012 2:11 PM
 
Jun 26, 2012 2:07 PM

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Trenerka said:
Enkidu design was also used in the Seishun Otoko parody by Type Moon, so I think it can be considered canon.

is it fully translated?I found it in some sites like danbooru but i think it was only partially translated
 
Jun 26, 2012 2:18 PM

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ssjokg said:
Trenerka said:
Enkidu design was also used in the Sensha Otoko parody by Type Moon, so I think it can be considered canon.

is it fully translated?I found it in some sites like danbooru but i think it was only partially translated

I honestly don't know. I only have a general idea from wiki and fanarts what it's about. And I'm not sure I want to know details since I was never too enthusiastic about the idea of Rider and Waver as a pairing, even if one of them got genderbent. I just can't see them as one.

But I haven't heard anything about it actually being written, I always assumed that they just outlined the idea and left it for fandom. The only solid thing I found were those two links:
http://tatari.byethost33.com/tmfools/09/sensya/intro.htm (third option on the right leads to character section and we can see girl!Enkidu there)
http://www.ufotable.com/tankman/ticket.html
Modified by Trenerka, Jun 26, 2012 2:47 PM
 
Jun 26, 2012 3:01 PM

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10/10 - Perfection!
 
Jun 26, 2012 3:04 PM

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Kurogashi said:
BloodRequiem said:


Btw these are obligatory ;_;




Thank you. ;_;


That pic is <3

"Have you ever encounter a wild beast that guarantees to never bite anyone?" ~ Roronoa Zoro
 
Jun 26, 2012 3:28 PM

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ssjokg said:
If I remember correctly in FSN Saber doesnt seem to recognize Ilya or at least she doesnt give info about her to Shirou for probably obvious reasons.


Well, there's this @1:21.

;_;
 
Jun 26, 2012 4:08 PM

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stAtic91 said:
ssjokg said:
If I remember correctly in FSN Saber doesnt seem to recognize Ilya or at least she doesnt give info about her to Shirou for probably obvious reasons.


Well, there's this @1:21.

;_;

oh that scene actually makes sense after seeing/reading FZ.
 
Jun 26, 2012 4:25 PM

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I will not go for a long post although this anime well deserved that, because everything was said yet.
A perfect blend of fantasy, philosophy, action, thriller and drama. All that with mindblowing animation and great voice acting.

10/10 like a planet
 
Jun 26, 2012 6:32 PM

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My only problem was there was no big fight between Gil and Saber. I gave it a 9/10, great series and tied into Fate Stay Night pretty well. I guess i'll watch that again now.
 
Jun 26, 2012 6:37 PM

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Tanta said:
My only problem was there was no big fight between Gil and Saber. I gave it a 9/10, great series and tied into Fate Stay Night pretty well. I guess i'll watch that again now.

FZ Gil vs Saber as she was after her fight with Lancelot would be even shorter than Gil vs Rider.And not spectacular at all unless you enjoy watching Saber being trashed.
 
Jun 26, 2012 6:47 PM

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ssjokg said:
Yumekichi11 said:

Actually people think now the Creator of this has this weird mentality that he loves to make characters suffer. I was like really WTF and O_O at Saber's last face. DAMN! You EVIL CREATOR! You made Saber suffer at the end like that despite you could have done just something else. I shall leave it at that.

Well Gen just add some details in what Nasu had created.And in FSN all ill fated characters(Ilya,Sakura,Saber,Shirou even Rider)reach a happy ending in some routes.And the villains actually pay for the shit they have done so I dont think he is that evil.
I see, well then people's misconception are bitchy sometimes is all I can think in response.

- BLOG - My Club- Easiest way to reach the rest of my thoughts!
 
Jun 26, 2012 7:10 PM

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okay

10/10
 
Jun 26, 2012 8:00 PM

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Going to go download the epic opening song, To the Beginning.
 
Jun 26, 2012 10:52 PM

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_Yasuda_ said:
Going to go download the epic opening song, To the Beginning.

Hah, I was just playing it on osu!.
 
Jun 27, 2012 1:05 AM

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Facebook is quite useful these days
 
Jun 27, 2012 1:18 AM

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ssjokg said:
Facebook is quite useful these days


The last 20 seconds are the best.
I almost cried.
As a child, I was told that society is a melting pot of talents; knowledge and experience combined to form important alloys that will contribute to mankind. When I got to highschool, however, I thought that it's more like a river in which the water represents our peers while we ourselves are the stones in the river. Constant erosion by mindless majority sheeping has made us lose our unique edge. After I hit the age of 18, I realized that I've been wrong all along. Society is no melting pot. Society is no river. Society is a person, a very skilled rapist, and he has fucked us all.
 
Jun 27, 2012 1:20 AM

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ssjokg said:
Facebook is quite useful these days

Awesome, shame on me for skipping endings.
 
Jun 27, 2012 12:12 PM

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Well, back to watching shitty anime again. This series was awesome as hell.
 
Jun 27, 2012 12:14 PM

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jpem said:
ssjokg said:
Facebook is quite useful these days

Awesome, shame on me for skipping endings.

I am pretty sure it's fanmade.
 
Jun 27, 2012 3:47 PM

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ssjokg said:
loub31 said:

About Gil... maybe it's a coincidence but for Kirei it's not ,the grail granted Kirie wish ; and this is from Wikia :
"In Kirei's last moments, the Holy Grail appeared to him; filled with hatred and envy for Kiritsugu, Kirei reached out and touched the cursed artifact. He prayed for an end to humanity; his wish was granted in the form of fire. "


I have to question the credibility of that , especially "the last moments "after being shot to the heart.If this is from character material or it was mentioned in FSN but I forgot,then it was his subconscious since he had no idea what happened when he woke up.Like Kiritsugu's true wish was to be with Iri and Ilya but he never realized it.And remember that in wiki everyone writes whatever he wants....Like Shirley being killedby Kerry.

I wonder how Gil find out that the fire was the wish of Kirie and why Kirie just believed him and convinced about this idea !!
For me I find a contradiction between fate zero and FSN
in FST kerei said that KIritsugu let him alive and didnt kill him but in Fate zero Kiritsugu didnt show any mercy toward Kirie and he just killed him
 
Jun 27, 2012 4:30 PM

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loub31 said:

I wonder how Gil find out that the fire was the wish of Kirie and why Kirie just believed him and convinced about this idea !!
For me I find a contradiction between fate zero and FSN
in FST kerei said that KIritsugu let him alive and didnt kill him but in Fate zero Kiritsugu didnt show any mercy toward Kirie and he just killed him

Geez, it was already explained. Gilgamesh realised that Kirei was a closeted evil person after five minutes of their first conversation and ever since he did everything to drag Kirei out of that closet. He told Kirei it was his wish to force him to finally confront the truth - the fact that Kirei was really and truly happy seeing the destruction and suffering caused by Grail. Kirei simply felt as if his wish was truly granted, it was the happiest moment of his life to date.

And by Kiritsugu sparring him, he meant that moment after the final conversation with Gilgamesh, when they see each other and Kiritsugu ignores him (Kirei had no way of knowing that at that time Avalons power was disappearing and Kiritsugu's attack would be suicidal, since he wouldn't have his healing factor; from Kirei's perspective Kiritsugu had advantegous situation at that time and didn't use it to finish him of).
 
Jun 27, 2012 4:32 PM

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loub31 said:
ssjokg said:
loub31 said:

About Gil... maybe it's a coincidence but for Kirei it's not ,the grail granted Kirie wish ; and this is from Wikia :
"In Kirei's last moments, the Holy Grail appeared to him; filled with hatred and envy for Kiritsugu, Kirei reached out and touched the cursed artifact. He prayed for an end to humanity; his wish was granted in the form of fire. "


I have to question the credibility of that , especially "the last moments "after being shot to the heart.If this is from character material or it was mentioned in FSN but I forgot,then it was his subconscious since he had no idea what happened when he woke up.Like Kiritsugu's true wish was to be with Iri and Ilya but he never realized it.And remember that in wiki everyone writes whatever he wants....Like Shirley being killedby Kerry.

I wonder how Gil find out that the fire was the wish of Kirie and why Kirie just believed him and convinced about this idea !!
For me I find a contradiction between fate zero and FSN
in FST kerei said that KIritsugu let him alive and didnt kill him but in Fate zero Kiritsugu didnt show any mercy toward Kirie and he just killed him


Right because" people die when they are killed" obviously works in Fate.Do you believe that Kirei would tell everyone that the grail revived him?Might as well show them Gil AND reveal the command seals he stole from Bazett .Kirei doesnt have a real heart in all of FSN.

It doesnt matter if the fire was a result of the wish or not.Gil knew what Kirei wanted all along.Kirei really enjoyed it and has no reason to not believe Gilgamesh.

Trenerka said:

And by Kiritsugu sparring him, he meant that moment after the final conversation with Gilgamesh, when they see each other and Kiritsugu ignores him (Kirei had no way of knowing that at that time Avalons power was disappearing and Kiritsugu's attack would be suicidal, since he wouldn't have his healing factor; from Kirei's perspective Kiritsugu had advantegous situation at that time and didn't use it to finish him of).

he mentioned that in FSN?If yes I have to play the VN again.I keep forgetting stuff
Modified by Othi-tan, Jun 27, 2012 4:39 PM
 
Jun 27, 2012 4:48 PM

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ssjokg said:
Trenerka said:

And by Kiritsugu sparring him, he meant that moment after the final conversation with Gilgamesh, when they see each other and Kiritsugu ignores him (Kirei had no way of knowing that at that time Avalons power was disappearing and Kiritsugu's attack would be suicidal, since he wouldn't have his healing factor; from Kirei's perspective Kiritsugu had advantegous situation at that time and didn't use it to finish him of).

he mentioned that in FSN?If yes I have to play the VN again.I keep forgetting stuff

No. I must admit I haven't played HF yet (I will need to clear it, since I finally have free time), but I found it logical, since Stay Night established that he was killed at the end of Zero. Therefore there must have been another opportunity at which he was sparred and this scene fits it really well if you think about it. Kirei doesn't have viewers knowledge and could wrongly interpret it as being sparred, since he doesn't know anything about Avalon.
Modified by Trenerka, Jun 27, 2012 4:55 PM
 
Jun 27, 2012 4:56 PM

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Trenerka said:
ssjokg said:
Trenerka said:

And by Kiritsugu sparring him, he meant that moment after the final conversation with Gilgamesh, when they see each other and Kiritsugu ignores him (Kirei had no way of knowing that at that time Avalons power was disappearing and Kiritsugu's attack would be suicidal, since he wouldn't have his healing factor; from Kirei's perspective Kiritsugu had advantegous situation at that time and didn't use it to finish him of).

he mentioned that in FSN?If yes I have to play the VN again.I keep forgetting stuff

No. I must admit I haven't played HF yet (I will need to clear it, since I finally have free time), but I found it logical, since Stay Night already established that he was killed at the end of Zero. Therefore there must have been another opportunity at which he was sparred and this scene fits it really well if you think about it. Kirei doesn't have viewers knowledge and could wrongly interpret it as being sparred, since he doesn't know anything about Avalon.


Well it's not like he never lied to Shirou and the rest.He could also have figured out that Kerry wasnt his former self anymore when he left.Telling a lie to the adopted son of his old enemy seems like a very Kirei-thing to do.
 
Jun 27, 2012 5:12 PM

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ssjokg said:
Trenerka said:
ssjokg said:
Trenerka said:

And by Kiritsugu sparring him, he meant that moment after the final conversation with Gilgamesh, when they see each other and Kiritsugu ignores him (Kirei had no way of knowing that at that time Avalons power was disappearing and Kiritsugu's attack would be suicidal, since he wouldn't have his healing factor; from Kirei's perspective Kiritsugu had advantegous situation at that time and didn't use it to finish him of).

he mentioned that in FSN?If yes I have to play the VN again.I keep forgetting stuff

No. I must admit I haven't played HF yet (I will need to clear it, since I finally have free time), but I found it logical, since Stay Night already established that he was killed at the end of Zero. Therefore there must have been another opportunity at which he was sparred and this scene fits it really well if you think about it. Kirei doesn't have viewers knowledge and could wrongly interpret it as being sparred, since he doesn't know anything about Avalon.


Well it's not like he never lied to Shirou and the rest.He could also have figured out that Kerry wasnt his former self anymore when he left.Telling a lie to the adopted son of his old enemy seems like a very Kirei-thing to do.

Even if he was emotionally broken it doesn't change the fact that from Kirei's point of view at that moment he wasted a perfect chance to finish him off. Kirei was still badly hurt from the fight, had no black keys and Gilgamesh didn't probably have enough mana after being incarnated to use GoB. Meanwhile, Kiritsugu supposedly still possessed unknow healing factor that healed even the most lethal wounds and thanks to that was physically unharmed. It was the best chance he would ever get to finish Kirei off, but instead he ignores him. So I find it plausible that Kirei interpreted "not using the chance when I was the weakest to kill me" as "I was sparred".

Then again, Kirei should have realized later that Kiritsugu couldn't have killed him, since he didn't have any magical means.... unless he somehow learned about contenders, but we don't know if they would work on his heart...

Damn, trying to connect prequel with sequel with multiply routes is confusing.
 
Jun 27, 2012 5:18 PM

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Trenerka said:

Damn, trying to connect prequel with sequel with multiply routes is confusing.

that's the magic of multi routes stories of Typemoon. Especially Fate since it has a prequel.Now imagine FZ having multiple routes that still lead to the beginning of FSN...
 
Jun 27, 2012 5:41 PM

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ssjokg said:
Trenerka said:

Damn, trying to connect prequel with sequel with multiply routes is confusing.

that's the magic of multi routes stories of Typemoon. Especially Fate since it has a prequel.Now imagine FZ having multiple routes that still lead to the beginning of FSN...

Indeed, magic. Magic of the universe being screwed about 80% of the time, while people still feel happy about the five positive ends without taking notice of how rare they actually are. If that isn't magic, I don't know what is.

While I always wanted to see just how bad would it be for universe if Saber actually managed to make her wish on Grail... Why, oh why, are most of the bad ends so short?
 
Jun 27, 2012 5:47 PM

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Trenerka said:
ssjokg said:
Trenerka said:

Damn, trying to connect prequel with sequel with multiply routes is confusing.

that's the magic of multi routes stories of Typemoon. Especially Fate since it has a prequel.Now imagine FZ having multiple routes that still lead to the beginning of FSN...

Indeed, magic. Magic of the universe being screwed about 80% of the time, while people still feel happy about the five positive ends without taking notice of how rare they actually are. If that isn't magic, I don't know what is.

While I always wanted to see just how bad would it be for universe if Saber actually managed to make her wish on Grail... Why, oh why, are most of the bad ends so short?


Not rare at all if you use a walkthrough.XDXDXD

Instead of bad ends being long or even exist I would prefer an Ilya route.
Well Tsukihime remake is already planned.Why not make a FSN remake too.
 
Jun 27, 2012 6:52 PM

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BTW yeah, I don't think Gilgamesh had much power at all after being stripped of his spiritual body. The fact Kirei used altternate methods to power up his NP's for the 5th War is proof enough.

 
Jun 28, 2012 8:26 PM

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Great show on the whole, I stick by my 9/10 for the first season and probably will give this season a 9 as well.

High points: Kiritsugu was a great protagonist, and Waver/Rider made the best master-servant duo. Gilgamesh was also a great character (and complemented Rider well). Great fight scenes.

Low points: The revelation about Berserker's identity was underwhelming. Saber (although focused on heavily) is still an underwhelming character who was largely overshadowed by some of the other servants. Not a bad character, but for the amount of screen time she gets I would have hoped she'd be more interesting.

Here's hoping for a full-length anime of FSN UBW route.
 
Jun 28, 2012 10:43 PM

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Leon-Gun said:
BTW yeah, I don't think Gilgamesh had much power at all after being stripped of his spiritual body. The fact Kirei used altternate methods to power up his NP's for the 5th War is proof enough.


Remember he also had Lancer as Servant in the 5th War.
 
Jun 29, 2012 12:06 AM

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Thess said:
Leon-Gun said:
BTW yeah, I don't think Gilgamesh had much power at all after being stripped of his spiritual body. The fact Kirei used altternate methods to power up his NP's for the 5th War is proof enough.


Remember he also had Lancer as Servant in the 5th War.
True although that doesn't accounts for the years in between, or the fact Lancer was very mana efficient.

 
Jun 29, 2012 2:32 AM

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By the way, why Gilgamesh look too young on his face in FSN ?
 
Jun 29, 2012 4:12 AM

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loub31 said:
By the way, why Gilgamesh look too young on his face in FSN ?

He used a potion of temporary youth from his treasury.Now the Gilgamesh in the cover of Fate/zero LN isnt that different from the Gilgamesh of FSN VN.So probably it was Deen's design been different from Ufotable's.Even Saber looks more mature in FZ.
 
Jun 29, 2012 6:49 AM

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Ah .. ok
Yes .. maybe it's because FST need a shounen design unlike FZ is seinen anime
 
Jun 29, 2012 9:26 AM

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I liked that they did a little follow-up on Lancelots motivations, which the last episode was missing.

All in all i guess i give it a 8/10. It wasn't perfect, but i enjoyed the journey and it beat Fate/Stay Night by far.
Now that i have more background knowledge i need to rewatch Stay Night though, has been years since i watched it anyways. :P
 
Jun 29, 2012 10:01 AM
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Poor Rin i thought her mother was death but she turned out insane must be hard on Rin growing up with a mother like that.
Still why wasn't her mother death or was that just a illusion of some sort?

And Emiya being like that was a bit weird as well all his previous actions where all pretty much without emotion that why did he get so emotional here.
He didn't even show emotion when he killed of his family in that wish.
 
Jun 29, 2012 10:13 AM

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Aversa said:

He didn't even show emotion when he killed of his family in that wish.


Did we watch the same scene?
 
Jun 29, 2012 10:17 AM

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ssjokg said:
Aversa said:

He didn't even show emotion when he killed of his family in that wish.


Did we watch the same scene?

Yeah. He was crying his eyes out...
The Art of Eight
 
Jun 29, 2012 10:37 AM

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Aversa said:
Poor Rin i thought her mother was death but she turned out insane must be hard on Rin growing up with a mother like that.
Still why wasn't her mother death or was that just a illusion of some sort?

And Emiya being like that was a bit weird as well all his previous actions where all pretty much without emotion that why did he get so emotional here.


Rin was lucky growing alone or at least with Kirei as her guardian.If she was with her parents she would be a real bitch in FSN.
It wasnt an illusion.She suffered brain damage due to lack of oxygen when Kariya was strangling her.

You mean why he was desperate to save someone in the fire?Or why he gave up being a "hero of justice" to live with Shirou?
You probably didnt understand his character if you question both scenes.
He wanted to save people.Thinking that the Fire was his fault he was searching the ruins for survivors.Of course he would be emotional there.
Later he never reunited with Ilya but he finally found people he could be together without being afraid that he will lose them because of his "justice".
 
Jun 29, 2012 11:30 AM

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ssjokg said:
Aversa said:
Poor Rin i thought her mother was death but she turned out insane must be hard on Rin growing up with a mother like that.
Still why wasn't her mother death or was that just a illusion of some sort?

And Emiya being like that was a bit weird as well all his previous actions where all pretty much without emotion that why did he get so emotional here.


Rin was lucky growing alone or at least with Kirei as her guardian.If she was with her parents she would be a real bitch in FSN.
It wasnt an illusion.She suffered brain damage due to lack of oxygen when Kariya was strangling her.

You mean why he was desperate to save someone in the fire?Or why he gave up being a "hero of justice" to live with Shirou?
You probably didnt understand his character if you question both scenes.
He wanted to save people.Thinking that the Fire was his fault he was searching the ruins for survivors.Of course he would be emotional there.
Later he never reunited with Ilya but he finally found people he could be together without being afraid that he will lose them because of his "justice".
He did got the Grail equivalent of AIDS though.

As for Rin being lucky being taken care of by Kirei? I think it was plenty hinted in STay Night that Kirei went to great lenghts to annoy RIn in passive-aggresive ways (like forcing her to wear schoolgirl outfits), he just was never too overt about it since he did need her to keep an amount of trust in order to use her in the war. Also, he sold a lot of Rin's posessions or outright took them out of her hands (since Rin was too engulfed on just magic training to notice) so one could say he stole her money during that interim 10 years. Although then again, with both Tokiomi and Aoi (eventually) gone Rin managed to sort of be alllowed to develop a human onscience rather than just be a complete magus machine like her dad.

 
Jun 29, 2012 12:54 PM

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That was beautiful.

If Fate/Stay Night was really misrepresented... I dearly wish the amazing staffs here pick it up.
 
Jun 29, 2012 1:22 PM

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I have not seen Fate/stay night but I had assumed the ending would be sad. What a tragic ending. I'm confused about how the grail made Kirei's wish come true?
 
Jun 29, 2012 1:28 PM

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iNinjaMan said:
I have not seen Fate/stay night but I had assumed the ending would be sad. What a tragic ending. I'm confused about how the grail made Kirei's wish come true?


4 people have asked that question before you did.
Browsing the thread for the answer helps.
As a child, I was told that society is a melting pot of talents; knowledge and experience combined to form important alloys that will contribute to mankind. When I got to highschool, however, I thought that it's more like a river in which the water represents our peers while we ourselves are the stones in the river. Constant erosion by mindless majority sheeping has made us lose our unique edge. After I hit the age of 18, I realized that I've been wrong all along. Society is no melting pot. Society is no river. Society is a person, a very skilled rapist, and he has fucked us all.
 
Jun 29, 2012 2:30 PM

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when something is so well done, i can just say, i'll rewatch fate/sn to remember somethings, and then i'll rewatch this show, truly epic, why cant i use an 11/10 to grade it?
Being a fan is like having a penis. Its nice to be proud of it But don't pull it out in public and wave it in other's faces

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Jun 29, 2012 3:54 PM

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Leon-Gun said:
ssjokg said:
Aversa said:
Poor Rin i thought her mother was death but she turned out insane must be hard on Rin growing up with a mother like that.
Still why wasn't her mother death or was that just a illusion of some sort?

And Emiya being like that was a bit weird as well all his previous actions where all pretty much without emotion that why did he get so emotional here.


Rin was lucky growing alone or at least with Kirei as her guardian.If she was with her parents she would be a real bitch in FSN.
It wasnt an illusion.She suffered brain damage due to lack of oxygen when Kariya was strangling her.

You mean why he was desperate to save someone in the fire?Or why he gave up being a "hero of justice" to live with Shirou?
You probably didnt understand his character if you question both scenes.
He wanted to save people.Thinking that the Fire was his fault he was searching the ruins for survivors.Of course he would be emotional there.
Later he never reunited with Ilya but he finally found people he could be together without being afraid that he will lose them because of his "justice".
He did got the Grail equivalent of AIDS though.

Although then again, with both Tokiomi and Aoi (eventually) gone Rin managed to sort of be alllowed to develop a human onscience rather than just be a complete magus machine like her dad.


that's my point.Even with Kirei she became better than what she could have been with her parents.
 
Jun 29, 2012 4:01 PM

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Ufotable's response to a question asked at today's panel at Anime Expo:

"Kiritsugu killing Natalia on Mother's Day, killing Ilya on Father's Day, and Rider's death happening on Alexander the Great's actual historic date of death was entirely coincidence. We were as surprised as you were to find out about it."

I is disappoint...
And I thought Ufotable were masterminds...
I'm guessing Kirei reciting Psalms 23 on episode 23 was a coincidence too...
Modified by BloodRequiem, Jun 29, 2012 4:05 PM
As a child, I was told that society is a melting pot of talents; knowledge and experience combined to form important alloys that will contribute to mankind. When I got to highschool, however, I thought that it's more like a river in which the water represents our peers while we ourselves are the stones in the river. Constant erosion by mindless majority sheeping has made us lose our unique edge. After I hit the age of 18, I realized that I've been wrong all along. Society is no melting pot. Society is no river. Society is a person, a very skilled rapist, and he has fucked us all.
 
Jun 29, 2012 4:08 PM

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BloodRequiem said:
Ufotable's response to a question asked at today's panel at Anime Expo:

"Kiritsugu killing Natalia on Mother's Day, killing Ilya on Father's Day, and Rider's death happening on Alexander the Great's actual historic date of death was entirely coincidence. We were as surprised as you were to find out about it."

I is disappoint...
And I thought Ufotable were masterminds...
I'm guessing Kirei reciting Psalms 23 on episode 23 was a coincidence too...

coincidence... yeah right.
Masterminds never reveal their dark plots.
 
Jul 1, 2012 12:12 AM

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Joined: Jun 2009
Posts: 14766
I'm glad the series ended with Kiritsugu "passing the torch" to Shirou, as well as having Shirou narrate the scene where he was saved. Some really nice touches and I love how this episode tied in so much to Fate/stay night. All the major players from Fate/stay were expanded on as well, so that was interesting.

But, man, Kirei really fucked over Rin's life. Killed her dad, influenced Kariya to choke her mother until it apparently damaged brain cells and put her in a wheel chair (judging by Fate/stay she won't live long, either), and is pretty much raising her to be a possible sacrifice in another Holy Grail war (if I remember correctly anyway). Still, I've always thought he cares for her in his own twisted way, and I felt that during the scene where he gave her the Azoth dagger as well.

As far as Kariya's fate. Man, I don't really have anything to say. The guys efforts were just....futile and probably only served to put Sakura in even despair as it undoubtedly fueled some of her actions in HF. Personally, I'd like if Kariya had a bit more focus in the Blu-rays as I found him a pretty compelling character in his brief appearances. I'll be reading the LN, so hopefully it'll give me more in sight into him.

Waver survived, which was not what I was expecting. But, then again I think this was written as a sort of coming of age story for him in that he's matured a bit throughout the series. His relationship with Rider was treated as one of the few positives throughout the series, which made it all the more memorable.

As far as Saber, I'm glad that they included at least a bit of the conversation between her and Lancelot before his death. One of my favorite things is how they cut to her briefly during the scene where Shirou took over Kerry's ideal, foreshadowing their eventual team up. Her "I should have never been King!" was powerful in and of itself, but I'd like to see it given more context for added effect.

Ultimately, I found Kiritsugu and Kirei to be the most fascinating characters of this series. It's no surprise as I usually enjoy a good fucked up character if portrayed right, and these two were very interesting to watch. Kiritsugu being faced with the extremes of his actions was powerful, but what really got me is the scene with Kirei watching him as he's digging around trying to save people. I'm not exactly sure what Kirei was thinking there, but he looked like he had utter contempt and disgust for him. Which explains his words to shirou in HF regarding Kerry.

To bring my long ass comment to a close. I loved this series, and I feel I could love it even more when the Blu-rays come out just like with the first half. This series went places a lot of anime, from what I've seen, is afraid of and did a good job of analyzing the concept of an "ideal" and how it can shape a way of life. Having the characters take it to the extreme made form some pretty interesting moral questions. Add to this great music, animation, usually good pacing, and voice work and you have a winner.

Without a doubt one of my favorite series, regardless of the faults. Will be reading the novels soon. And, it feels great to have a genuinely good Fate/ adaptation.
"Yes, I have been deprived of emotion. But not completely. Whoever did it, botched the job."

- Geralt of Rivia
 
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