Pandora Hearts Chapter 74 Discussion
MyAnimeList.net Forum »» Manga Discussion »»
Series Discussion »»
Pandora Hearts »» Pandora Hearts Chapter 74 Discussion
View Poll Results: Pandora Hearts Chapter 74 Discussion
| 5 out of 5: Loved it! | 86 | 90.53% | |
| 4 out of 5: Liked it | 5 | 5.26% | |
| 3 out of 5: It was OK | 1 | 1.05% | |
| 2 out of 5: Disliked it | 1 | 1.05% | |
| 1 out of 5: Hated it | 2 | 2.11% |
Voters: 95
#41
06-24-12, 11:27 AM
|
|
|
Offline Joined: Dec 2007 Posts: 317 |
There's one little thing that bugs me...Glen is asked whether he used all five black-winged chains to contain the world's destruction, but he only names four of them. He doesn't name Griffin. Also, considering Jack was a traitor, how did the Vessalius receive Griffin? Or could the black-winged chains have been given out to the four dukedoms after the tragedy of Sablier? ![]() GFX made by >Valon< of Janime Community Forums |
#42
06-24-12, 12:32 PM
|
|
|
Offline Joined: Feb 2012 Posts: 50 |
OZ!!!!!! DON'T YOU DARE DIE ON ME!!!!!!!! ... TT______________TT ... Jun is such a saddist master troller, she's playing damn harsh with my feelings T~T WHY did Gil listen to Glen??? His heart should know by now who his rightful master is!! Guess that'll be cleared in the next chapter, but still...GIL YOU BAKA BAKA BAKA!!!! Wow, didn't expect alice to have killed herself...thought that would have been Vincent, since he hates her and loves to make use of his pair of scisors o.o Oh my...poor Oz...I feel so sorry for him, and this since chapter 65! He has suffered so much, ever since he was B-rabbit ...I'm gonna make Jun pay for making him agonizing >8E Gil better stay by oz's side and try to save his precious friend! I mean, he just shot him... A BREATHTAKING chapter, awesomely long and full of twisted surprises. I mean, it's the first time I have seen Jack yelling that furiously and acting this crazy...not to mention that also furious expression on mister my-face-is-made-of-ice Glen O.Ó Please, please make the next chapter less heartwrenching TTwTT ...how are we supposed to survive for one more month? |
#43
06-24-12, 2:43 PM
|
|
|
Offline Joined: Nov 2008 Posts: 538 |
animazed said: cannot hold all these feels ;~; Man, I still can't despise Jack for some reason, slap me. :( Gil shooting Oz? I expected it but didn't at the same time... :| Oz, don't die on meee~! -cries- Wait, so if he were to die (which I strongly, strongly hope doesn't happen), does he get sent to the abyss because of the whole thing with he-is-in-a-contract-with-Alice-and-Alice-is-a-chain? (That statement felt so weird to type for some reason...) I'm assuming this'll probably be cleared up later, but it doesn't hurt to ask... right? MochiJun, your skills still baffles me. ♥ Modified by Silver_ribbons, 06-24-12, 2:46 PM |
#44
06-24-12, 3:31 PM
|
|
|
Offline Joined: Aug 2011 Posts: 352 |
Why Gil?! WHHHYYYY!!!!??? Oh no Oz...we all know he's gonna come back though...probably as B-Rabbit or sumthing. |
#45
06-24-12, 3:41 PM
|
|
|
Offline Joined: Jun 2012 Posts: 187 |
I don't even know what to feel right now! That chapter was crazyyyy and I'm going to be dying to find out what happens next. Gosh, they all need to stop being so selfish...freaking Jack, all he cares about is Lacie...freaking Will of the Abyss only cares about Jack... SO MANY OTHER PEOPLE GET HURT BECAUSE OF YOUR TOMFOOLERY! |
#46
06-24-12, 10:49 PM
|
|
|
Offline Joined: Sep 2011 Posts: 654 |
ON THE FLOOR SOBBING WHY JACK ALICE OZ GIL LEO FEELS AGGRAGVEH |
#47
06-25-12, 1:23 AM
|
|
|
Offline Joined: Feb 2012 Posts: 50 |
Striderfang said: ...we all know he's gonna come back though...probably as B-Rabbit or sumthing. um, why coming back? He's not dead as far as I know, just unconscious o.ò |
#48
06-25-12, 3:02 AM
|
|
|
Offline Joined: Aug 2009 Posts: 62 |
You know, I'm actually expecting there to be more trolling to come due to this one page from a previous chapter that was NEVER EXPLAINED, OMG. Well, it could be an illusion by Jack or something, but I still want some proper answers. >: And I'm curious how they are going to fix that "chains supporting the world just got shattered again" problem. It seemed to have been overlooked just because Gil shot Oz. ^^; |
#49
06-25-12, 4:42 AM
|
|
|
Offline Joined: Sep 2009 Posts: 782 |
earthfairys said: You know, I'm actually expecting there to be more trolling to come due to this one page from a previous chapter that was NEVER EXPLAINED, OMG. Well, it could be an illusion by Jack or something, but I still want some proper answers. >: There are no illusions by Jack... What about that page do you want to see explained? My theory is that Glen wanted to use Alice's connection to Alyss to destroy or appropriate the Will of the Abyss somehow, just like Leo said the Baskervilles were trying to do. |
#50
06-25-12, 5:12 AM
|
|
|
Offline Joined: Aug 2009 Posts: 62 |
Neiru2012 said: There are no illusions by Jack... What about that page do you want to see explained? My theory is that Glen wanted to use Alice's connection to Alyss to destroy or appropriate the Will of the Abyss somehow, just like Leo said the Baskervilles were trying to do. Well, the owning of the Intention of Abyss was pretty much explained by Leo already. ^^; What I don't understand is how the entire scene fits in with the Tragedy of Sablier. It could be that the event happened at a different time from the Tragedy, but Oz was clearly shown to be walking amongst the corpses present at the Tragedy before meeting Glen in this scene. Then there was also the part of Jack saying "...you want to use Alice?!", which either means that he is not yet in yandere mode or is referring to Alyss. But the latter would not make sense since Glen is trying to get Alyss, so why use Alyss to get Alyss? XDDD Then again, this scene could just be a distortion left behind in Sablier... Though I highly doubt so. There were many instances around this chapter that are linked to the events 100 years ago (such as Jack's first meeting with Lacie and his devotion towards her, and Oz's distress over killing people), so I'm really curious how this fits in with the past; just when exactly did this conversation take place between Jack and Glen? In fact, this was the scene that originally convinced me that Glen was the antagonist because of his slightly yandere attitude here. =/ |
#51
06-25-12, 8:12 AM
|
|
|
Offline Joined: Apr 2012 Posts: 29 |
With that scene that was linked above: don't think that the text and the images are in alignment with each other. What I mean by that is, there have been plenty (tons, actually) of times when Mochizuki-sensei has shown a flashback and there was text floating around (or even appearing to have been said during) the flashback, but most of the time the words were said by someone else or at a different point in time than the flashback that was shown. It is possible that something like that was/is happening there too. I believe this is her way of showing just how faulty the human is when it comes to memories and recollections. Our memories can get muddled up, our memories can be locked away and forgotten, they can be remembered always but viewed through rose colored glasses, and they can also be easily manipulated (not even on purpose). In order to manipulate a memory all a person really needs to do is say, "Hey remember when such and such happened, there was so and so there, and..." etc., etc. If a person repeats it enough time (believing it to be true) then the other person, even if they don't believe it, will start to and then eventually believe it to be true as well. So, it probably fits in somewhere, we just haven't seen it yet (though the reason why they want to own the Will of the Abyss was already explained by Leo). There are a lot of possibilities, and for this, I am content to just wait and see. |
#52
06-25-12, 8:39 AM
|
|
|
Offline Joined: Dec 2009 Posts: 2071 |
I always thought that the "you want to use Alice" was Glen referring to Jack, just like many of us thought that the one who had been saved "that night" by Lacie was Glen, but in the end it turned out to be Jack's thoughts. ![]() I will turn you into junk. |
#53
06-25-12, 12:51 PM
|
|
|
Offline Joined: Sep 2009 Posts: 782 |
Ah yes, it's true, "...you want to use Alice?" could've been said by either Glen or Jack, or anyone really. But I dunno, for now it makes the most sense to me that Jack would say it, especially if it was said during the same scene as Glen's explanation of the Will (though it theoretically could've been from another scene). I mean, that whole explanation by Glen was about the necessity of gaining control of the Will by the Baskervilles, and their only tangible link to it is Alice, so why wouldn't they try to use her somehow? That's what Revis was trying to do in the first place when he impregnated Lacie. There's also Vincent saying that Jack wanted to save Alice. Of course, Jack was trying to use Alice to get to Alyss too, and it would've been life-threatening for Alice because her human body can't handle the Will's energy for long... So not sure yet whether Vincent was mistaken, was lied to, or whether Jack wanted to "save" Alyss... meaning The Will, from Glen from wanting to destroy her or acquire her power. And he's have a motive to save Alyss, since he needed her for his plans for Lacie. But how would Vincent know anything about Alyss? He was awfully surprised to see White Alice, so he might not have known about this aspect. But if Jack did tell Vincent about his concerns regarding the Will, and if he was honest about it, he'd probably call her Alice and not make a distinction, so Vincent would've thought Jack's talking about human Alice. This theory is kinda convoluted, I know, and probably wrong, haha. I'm just still hoping there's some kind of interesting moral conflict left and that Glen isn't some innocent victim. That he had his own plans. What I'd like to see Jun elaborate on is this page, where Jack asks Glen "What is your real objective? To restore what the Baskervilles term the 'Order of the Abyss'? Or to rule over the world by making the Intention of the Abyss yours?" (Yen Press translation). Glen asks Jack what he's trying to say, and when Jack mentions Lacie, Glen snaps and tells Jack to not involve himself in "this" any further. It makes me think Jack was trying to save Alyss from whatever Glen's plans were for the Will. Sure he was probably trying to save her in order to achieve his own plans about Lacie, but still trying to save her nonetheless. And who knows what the Baskervilles would want to do with the Will's power? I don't think any family or any one person with worldly interests can be trusted with it. So yeah, I think there's more twists to come. GLeo has a pretty creepy vibe this chapter, so maybe there's something we don't know yet. Though, of course, he had every reason to tell Gil to shoot Oz in order to cripple Jack's presence in the human world. |
#54
06-25-12, 4:44 PM
|
|
|
Offline Joined: Jun 2008 Posts: 1902 |
Neiru2012 said: This theory is kinda convoluted, I know, and probably wrong, haha. I'm just still hoping there's some kind of interesting moral conflict left and that Glen isn't some innocent victim. That he had his own plans. What I'd like to see Jun elaborate on is this page, where Jack asks Glen "What is your real objective? To restore what the Baskervilles term the 'Order of the Abyss'? Or to rule over the world by making the Intention of the Abyss yours?" (Yen Press translation). Glen asks Jack what he's trying to say, and when Jack mentions Lacie, Glen snaps and tells Jack to not involve himself in "this" any further. And plus in that same chapter you mention, after Glen saying he does not want Jack to involve himself further, he makes a creepy smile that kinda resembles the smile he did in this chapter. Definitely Glen has a secret surrounding him. I didnt like his tone when he said that he is still the only master of Gil. Also in that same page, we see Jack crying. We know from this scene in several flashbacks that the only one who cries is Jack (We never saw Glen crying), and next page we see Little Gil wounded in the floor at Jack´s side, while Jack apologizes. On next pages we see Glen calling for Lacie with a bloodied sword but the quotes are from Jack " A world without you etc". So...is it a fake memory and the one who was with Gil on the floor was Glen? But then, we never saw Glen crying and we know Gil fell at Jack´s side and Jack was on the right side while Glen was on the left, so their positions did not change. It makes sense to me that it was a memory not altered by Jack...but then why was Jack the one beside Gil and not Glen who was his master? Jack mentions Lacie to Glen and he flips out, and immediately followed by another flashback in next page about Jack vs Glen aftermath, and although we see there written Jack´s quotes about Lacie, it is Glen who calls Lacie, and it is Jack who is on the floor crying near Gil (I cannot imagine Glen crying, but then I might be wrong and probably it was Glen and that memory was faked by Jack).Anyway, I have the feeling there´s something going on between Glen x Lacie for sure. Im waiting for Glen big revelation. And certainly a final Jack x Glen moment will be great. Ƹ̴Ӂ̴Ʒ 飛ぶ |
#55
06-25-12, 9:20 PM
|
|
|
Offline Joined: Jan 2012 Posts: 572 |
I knew that this mindfuck will be coming for us sooner or later . The atuhor is a pro in mindraping the readers . Good job author !! And noooo Oz T____T don't kill off my favorite character . Well , but I don't think he's dead . |
#56
06-25-12, 10:07 PM
|
|
|
Offline Joined: Jun 2012 Posts: 2 |
It was moving how Gil came to Oz's aid despite remembering everything. I was expecting for Oz and Gil to have some strained relationships in between them, then they would make up. But instead Gil remained faithful to his current and true master. Until that is Gil shot Oz by Glen's command. On the other hand I was disappointed with Leo. I was hoping Leo would wake up and have all his senses returned but in the end Leo's body is being controlled by Glen's soul. Surprised on how many people didn't suspect Alice to kill herself. That was one of my suspicions of Alice's death. Overall, the chapter was exciting! Still don't know on how the pocket watch was made though. Unless there was a chapter that explained the birth of the pocket watch that I missed. Also it makes me wonder if the past memories of Glen and Jack was just an illusion. When I look at them it makes it seem like Jack isn't obsessed about Lacie, but Jack has been basically a psycho ever since Lacie died. |
#57
06-26-12, 8:24 AM
|
|
|
Offline Joined: Apr 2012 Posts: 29 |
S-Phoenix said: Surprised on how many people didn't suspect Alice to kill herself. That was one of my suspicions of Alice's death. Overall, the chapter was exciting! Still don't know on how the pocket watch was made though. Unless there was a chapter that explained the birth of the pocket watch that I missed. Also it makes me wonder if the past memories of Glen and Jack was just an illusion. When I look at them it makes it seem like Jack isn't obsessed about Lacie, but Jack has been basically a psycho ever since Lacie died. Alice killing herself had never popped into my head because I didn't like the idea of it, so I instantly dismissed it. I still don't. I am like Elliot in a way and really don't like the idea of self sacrifice. I don't find it admirable or great or "hero worthy" I just find it sad, and was kinda hoping Alice wasn't going to die in a similar way that Elliot did (aka through suicide/self sacrifice). So, I honestly wasn't fond of how she died, though the scene itself was still very powerful due to being well drawn and well executed. As for the pocket watch, it was mentioned (at some point and time in this series) that Jack and Glen (Oswald) made it together. Most likely they made it a little after Lacie died, combining Jack's clock making skills and Oswald's musical talent, to create the pocket watch in her memory. |
#58
06-26-12, 8:45 AM
|
|
|
Offline Joined: Oct 2011 Posts: 9 |
Seeker said: There's one little thing that bugs me...Glen is asked whether he used all five black-winged chains to contain the world's destruction, but he only names four of them. He doesn't name Griffin. Also, considering Jack was a traitor, how did the Vessalius receive Griffin? Or could the black-winged chains have been given out to the four dukedoms after the tragedy of Sablier? Maybe he decided to keep Gryphon close to him in case he had to defend himself against Jack. He was probably thinking that if he were to die, his chains would vanish to the Abyss and couldn't protect the chains that support the world. Still, it's a little weird that he didn't say anything when he was asked whether he released all five chains or not. Maybe he needed it for his plan to destroy the Will of the Abyss. |
#59
06-26-12, 11:38 AM
|
|
|
Offline Joined: Sep 2007 Posts: 228 |
WTF what an amazing chapter ;__; Can someone explain me how Jack disappeared after saying to Oz that stuff? I didn't get it... :X |
#60
06-26-12, 12:31 PM
|
|
|
Offline Joined: Feb 2012 Posts: 50 |
Talu said: WTF what an amazing chapter ;__; Can someone explain me how Jack disappeared after saying to Oz that stuff? I didn't get it... :X Well he did say "I knew I should have waited a little longer to come out like this. This is really very exhausting." just when he was about to break the chains holding the Abyss back (aka his 'battle' against Alice and Echo). He apparently didn't have enough strengh to keep contol over Oz's body any longer, so he retired to that "blue room" again, you know, back in Oz's mind. Just like in the past, he will remain absent for a little while, recovering. Or so I think ^^' |










