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Dangerr said: I honestly can't believe the amount of hate this series is getting; at first I blamed it on misplaced expectations, but this is just ridiculous. At this point, I just have to completely disagree with the "cardboard" characters analysis, as I think most of the main cast has been properly developed up to this point, and I can at least empathize with them as characters, though I'll agree the series hasn't been stellar in this regard. What I can say, however, is that I'm loving the complexity of the story and the setting that BONES has put forth with this series, and the visual splendor in the design and animation. Regarding the story, nothing about the prospective plot has seemed "hollow" or incoherent to me up to this point; conversely, this aspect seems quite meticulously and carefully executed, which I'm actually enjoying substantially. Each of these pros I've listed have certainly met their own problems with consistency (episodes 7 and 8 come to mind), but nothing that "breaks" the series for me in any way. As for these comparisons to Gen Bleu and Gekkostate, I believe they're totally asinine and detrimental to any enjoyment one may have in the series, as they're completely and fundamentally different entities with different objectives and philosophies - this does not make one conceivably "better" than the other. As for Truth, thus far I've reserved judgement on its effectiveness as a character, and place in the story, but it's obvious that there's some amount of depth to "it", and we'll just have to see where its story goes. My take is that just like the first series, Ao has plenty of flaws strewn about itself, but in no way do I see it being anything close to a "failure"; If I were to give the first series a solid "8.5", I'd give this one between a "7.8 - 8.0" up to this point - I don't think it's quite reached the heights of its predecessor just yet, but I certainly see the potential for it to do so. Shocked? We have been ragging on the show since episode 2 and you are shocked? Check out the other episode discussions to refresh your memory. We all had high expectations for this show but it didn't live up to the hype. Stop being a rabid fanboy and take the fairy dust out of your eyes. This show has not delivered and has been a mess for the last 6 episodes. The main characters are properly developed? What? In the episode 7 discussion you were telling us how the writers of the show will develop the characters in time and now you say they are properly developed? Please tell me how an annoying character like Elena who hasn't changed one bit is developed? What about Fleur? A cute little backstory isn't enough and we need to see some changes in her character. Ao is still moronic and clueless of the world.......so no for him. Naru hasn't been fleshed out at all and now has run off with the transgenderd villain. Explain to me how they are developed? Gekkostate and Gen Blu have to be compared because they are similar as the place where the protagonist lives and is taken care of. Gekkostate is what we are used to having and so the creators branched out with Gen Blu. I gotta be honest Gen Blu is watered down military version of Gekko State with many flaws. Just compare the characters in EU7 who were lovable and had true characterization compared to the generic cardboard personality of Gen Blu. Truth is a mess and I mean a disaster as a main villain. So let me get this straight, we went from a brilliant antagonist Dewey to this frilly feminine guy by the name Truth who shoots energy out of his chest. Dewey had no random ass pull power or anything like that, he was a human who used his influence to bring his idealism to the world. Not say "I am looking for the truth in the world"......the hell is that? The romance in the show is also a walking tornado of failure. So let me get this straight. Ao was originally had a girlfriend who was Naru and been with her for many years of his life. A weird feminine guy recites some generic cutsy line and she goes off with him? What about Ao? Then we are forced to have this awkward Fleur and Ao relationsip...which is unrealistic. When I was 13 I sure as hell never got a 16 year old girl to like me........why......because maybe she is interested in people her own age. "I don't think it's quite reached the heights of its predecessor just yet, but I certainly see the potential for it to do so.". That quote right there is ridiculous by all accounts. Eu 7 is a fantastic anime that has respect in the anime community and has a good score on MAL to back it up. While EU 7 the hype died down and MAL score slipping everyday shows it. This show went from a 8.13 to 7.90.....nuff said. You even mention this show has many flaws and yet you give it a 8? An 8 is an amazing series and this show doesn't fit the bill. I honestly am not a hater for this show, I was really excited for this show and had really high expectations. I thought the first two episodes were 8.7-9.3 range but from there it went down hill. |
GovJun 15, 2012 9:30 AM
Darkdrone said: Dangerr said: I honestly can't believe the amount of hate this series is getting; at first I blamed it on misplaced expectations, but this is just ridiculous. At this point, I just have to completely disagree with the "cardboard" characters analysis, as I think most of the main cast has been properly developed up to this point, and I can at least empathize with them as characters, though I'll agree the series hasn't been stellar in this regard. What I can say, however, is that I'm loving the complexity of the story and the setting that BONES has put forth with this series, and the visual splendor in the design and animation. Regarding the story, nothing about the prospective plot has seemed "hollow" or incoherent to me up to this point; conversely, this aspect seems quite meticulously and carefully executed, which I'm actually enjoying substantially. Each of these pros I've listed have certainly met their own problems with consistency (episodes 7 and 8 come to mind), but nothing that "breaks" the series for me in any way. As for these comparisons to Gen Bleu and Gekkostate, I believe they're totally asinine and detrimental to any enjoyment one may have in the series, as they're completely and fundamentally different entities with different objectives and philosophies - this does not make one conceivably "better" than the other. As for Truth, thus far I've reserved judgement on its effectiveness as a character, and place in the story, but it's obvious that there's some amount of depth to "it", and we'll just have to see where its story goes. My take is that just like the first series, Ao has plenty of flaws strewn about itself, but in no way do I see it being anything close to a "failure"; If I were to give the first series a solid "8.5", I'd give this one between a "7.8 - 8.0" up to this point - I don't think it's quite reached the heights of its predecessor just yet, but I certainly see the potential for it to do so. Address all the issues that you don't like. Do Dangerr said: I honestly can't believe the amount of hate this series is getting; at first I blamed it on misplaced expectations, but this is just ridiculous. At this point, I just have to completely disagree with the "cardboard" characters analysis, as I think most of the main cast has been properly developed up to this point, and I can at least empathize with them as characters, though I'll agree the series hasn't been stellar in this regard. What I can say, however, is that I'm loving the complexity of the story and the setting that BONES has put forth with this series, and the visual splendor in the design and animation. Regarding the story, nothing about the prospective plot has seemed "hollow" or incoherent to me up to this point; conversely, this aspect seems quite meticulously and carefully executed, which I'm actually enjoying substantially. Each of these pros I've listed have certainly met their own problems with consistency (episodes 7 and 8 come to mind), but nothing that "breaks" the series for me in any way. As for these comparisons to Gen Bleu and Gekkostate, I believe they're totally asinine and detrimental to any enjoyment one may have in the series, as they're completely and fundamentally different entities with different objectives and philosophies - this does not make one conceivably "better" than the other. As for Truth, thus far I've reserved judgement on its effectiveness as a character, and place in the story, but it's obvious that there's some amount of depth to "it", and we'll just have to see where its story goes. My take is that just like the first series, Ao has plenty of flaws strewn about itself, but in no way do I see it being anything close to a "failure"; If I were to give the first series a solid "8.5", I'd give this one between a "7.8 - 8.0" up to this point - I don't think it's quite reached the heights of its predecessor just yet, but I certainly see the potential for it to do so. Shocked? We have been ragging on the show since episode 2 and you are shocked? Check out the other episode discussions to refresh your memory. We all had high expectations for this show but it didn't live up to the hype. Stop being a rabid fanboy and take the fairy dust out of your eyes. This show has not delivered and has been a mess for the last 6 episodes. The main characters are properly developed? What? In the episode 7 discussion you were telling us how the writers of the show will develop the characters in time and now you say they are properly developed? Please tell me how an annoying character like Elena who hasn't changed one bit is developed? What about Fleur? A cute little backstory isn't enough and we need to see some changes in her charater. Ao is still moronic and clueless of the world.......so no for him. Naru hasn't been fleshed out at all and now has run off with the transgenderd villain. Explain to me how they are developed? Gekkostate and Gen Blu have to be compared because they are similar as the place where the protagonist lives and is taken care of. Just compare the characters in EU7 who were lovable and had true characterization compared to the generic cardboard personality of Gen Blu. Truth is a mess and I mean a disaster as a main villain. So let me get this straight, we went from a brilliant antagonist Dewey to this frilly feminine guy by the name Truth who shoots energy out of his chest. Dewey had no random ass pull power or anything like that, he was a human who used his influence to bring his idealism to the world. Not say "I am looking for the truth in the world"......the hell is that? The romance in the show is also a walking tornado of failure. So let me get this straight. Ao was originally had a girlfriend who was Naru and been with her for many years of his life. A weird feminine guy recites some generic cutsy line and she goes off with him? What about Ao? Then are forced to have this awkward Fleur and Ao relationsip...which is unrealistic. When I was 13 I sure as hell never got a 16 year old girl to like me........why......because maybe she is interested in people her own age. "I don't think it's quite reached the heights of its predecessor just yet, but I certainly see the potential for it to do so.". That quote right there is ridiculous by all accounts. Eu 7 is a fantastic anime that has respect in the anime community and has a good score on MAL to back it up. While EU 7 the hype died down and MAL score slipping everyday shows it. This show went from a 8.13 to 7.90.....nuff said. You even mention this show has many flaws and yet you give it a 8? An 8 is an amazing series and this show doesn't fit the bill. I honestly am not a hater for this show, I was really excited for this show and had really high expectations. I thought the first two episodes were 8.7-9.3 range but from there it went down hill. Except I never said I was "shocked", just that I don't believe for a second it should be receiving the demerits its been getting. Also, if I were a rabid-fanboy, I would be nigh-terrified to admit any amount of failures and shortcomings that this series has displayed, which I absolutely haven't been afraid to do (I could recite plenty of complaints from even the best episodes of this series). What I'm trying to say, however, is that it's better than the sum of its parts; that the developing story and solidarity in its setting (convoluted as it may be, at times) has been gracefully executed enough that it can make up for the relatively standard-fare characterization (which I don't think is "bad"). Regarding character development, I think there has been an adequate amount up to this point to serve the story, and just enough that I can form a meaningful attachment to the characters, though I never thought it was *as* good as Eureka Seven's. In the last two episodes, rather than cut through swaths of character-driven flashbacks, the show developed the characters in the ways that I prefer, which is through conversation, situational expression, and actions; Fleur and Ao haven't disappointed me on this front yet, though Elena seems to remain blissfully aloof in this regard. Regarding Ao being "moronic", I think that's too harsh of a judgement for a headstrong 12 year-old - his ignorance of the world I think has been adequately depicted, and is a flaw of his character, though it comes largely from being just so young; we shouldn't expect him to be a prodigal child in every respect. Again, I think it's too early to judge Truth as a character, though there's nothing I can do to change your first impressions of him. It's certainly a more direct approach than the nuanced and complex villain that Dewey is (nor will I ever likely say that he's half as good an antagonist), but have relatively high hopes for him nonetheless; within the context of the universe, I don't feel his powers are out of place at all, and wouldn't be surprised to see if there's some greater malevolent forces at work here aside from (seemingly) Truth. To reiterate your point: Darkdrone said: The romance in the show is also a walking tornado of failure. So let me get this straight. Ao was originally had a girlfriend who was Naru and been with her for many years of his life. A weird feminine guy recites some generic cutsy line and she goes off with him? What about Ao? Then are forced to have this awkward Fleur and Ao relationsip...which is unrealistic. When I was 13 I sure as hell never got a 16 year old girl to like me........why......because maybe she is interested in people her own age. You see, I think a large misconception people are having about this series is that romance actually plays any sort of major theme here. I'll concede, that I definitely feel that Ao and Naru may have some feelings for each other, and that in the end, may influence some major event of the story, but definitely do not feel it bears the same sort of significance that Renton and Eureka's romance drove in the first series; it was probably the greatest driving theme of the story, and don't believe that Ao's story places the same kind of emphasis on this regard. Outside of Naru, I don't think Ao is really seriously romantically invested in anyone, and that anything Fleur feels for Ao is nothing more than puppy-love, or a simple crush. Viewing this series as a romance in any way I think is a mistake. Also: I seriously doubt Naru's investment in Truth is anything romantic. I was also hoping I wouldn't have to do this, but let me explain the way I rate things: "10" is obviously a masterwork in my book, and is only reserved for a series which I can conceivably deem as artistically, thematically, technically, and in general, structurally flawless; what the series was aiming to accomplish, and how I personally (subjectively) received it also plays into the way I rate something. To go on, I view "9" as something truly great, and must be technically competent in everything it accomplishes, while bringing something unique or exemplary to the table in terms of entertainment. Conversely, I may give an "8" to something which I deem technically competent, but suffers from certain flaws that fail to substantiate, or achieve the inherent potential it possessed, but is in no way close to anything bad or mediocre. Coming down to "7", I still feel a series is good, but there are a number of noticeable flaws and / or technical problems that keep it from being a thoroughly entertaining experience like "8-10" can provide. Still, however, such a score to me means that it's at the very least palatable, and worth at least some cheap entertainment (most technical aspects must at least be sound). Anything from the "1-6" range for me is just varying levels of badness to plain mediocrity; you won't see me rating much in this range, as most of the time I won't even bother with such titles. Finally, anything below a "10" I view with a certain degree of subjectivity, and can go so far as to influence my score by as much as a point (both up and down). For example, I objectively might be able to rate "Death Note" a 9 in terms of technical mertis all-around, but find enough personal distaste in some aspects to lower it to an "8". Conversely, I see a title such as "Tiger and Bunny" having plenty of noticeable flaws and technical problems, and from an objective standpoint, would probably rate it an "8". However, the incredible script, characterization, and perseverance that the producers in a moe-saturated industry managed to accomplish with the barest of bones and funding is enough I feel to bump it up to a "9". To conclude, my score of "7.8-8.0" I don't think is as stellar as you're probably thinking: I think it's a good deal flawed in many ways, but is pulled up by its many exemplary qualities, such as the aforementioned art, animation, audio quality, and the complexity of its storytelling. While the characterization certainly needs work, I think it's getting the job done, at least, enough to the point where any of these other qualities actually matter. |
DangerrJun 15, 2012 10:29 AM
| Aren't you people forgetting its only been 9 episodes. As much as I love wall of text and debates keep in mind this anime still has potential to flourish. So far the only thing I dislike about the show is Truth, he basically came out of nowhere and it still hasn't been reveled what his true intentions are. As for the character development, its probably too early to say, I hope Naru gets more screen time since she hasn't been contributing to the story recently. |
| Truth isn't making the show any better. He's a character who the writers put across as mysterious in the wrong kind of way. He's too camp in character design and quite bland in motivation (whatever the hell it is at this point; 'finding the truth of the world' is a tad vague). I don't feel a sense of danger whenever Truth's around the other characters, and as someone mentioned earlier, I'll agree that he is a boring antagonist. I wish the writers would have instead made antagonists out of each person Truth was shapeshifting as in the beginning and had all of them pitted against Ao and friends, instead of this badly designed and poorly written character. |
| I know Kung-Food! |
| The exaggerated fanservice doesn't make it any easier... |
| Where was this weeks episode? |
| This was a very well done episode. I guess Ao wants to play Mr.Hero now. |
 |
| Really, Ao should have enjoyed the view from the inside of his IFO while two beautiful girls were on it in their swimsuits. What a lucky guy, who doesn't know how lucky he is! lol There seems to be some development in here but for some reason it makes a little sense to me. Especially, Truth. He is a complete mystery and the fact that he is so powerful and has a great affect on the story makes it even more uncomfortable to have so little information regarding him. |
| And slowly, you come to realize... It's all as it should be... |
| The reason Eureka 7 was really good was because of the attachment we viewers had for the characters. We didn't want any of them to die, even though we did sometimes. The real deal was the love relationship between Eureka and Renton, Dominic and Anemone, Gilland and Talho, etc. However all these took 50 episodes. In this series, Mr. Bruno (for example) dies and felt no sadness, since it was a character who was introduced in the beginning of an episode and killed in the end of it. I don't really see how everything will be explained within 24 episodes unless they decide to extend it for X or Y reasons. I will keep watching and hoping it gets better. |
| Hmmm more murder scenes Didn't expect that with this kind of art/settting |
DEWoody said: Yeah like everyone else I feel AO just doesn't have the appeal like the original did. By the ninth episode I had already been hooked by the Gekko crew. So many different personalities and it just had a nice atmosphere to kick off the series. However AO is just leaving me detached from all characters to the point where I just don't care. I'm still going to keep watching in hopes of a return of the old cast, but it's looking dim and I can't see anything in the plot that might lead to a longer series like the original. They better pull something big off quick or this might get put on hold..... I doubt the old crew will appear. As it was pointed out in these forums with screenshots and all from the last episode of the Eureka Seven. Nirvash and the old man in the gekko go are stating how they are leaving and taking half of the people with them. With the Gekko crew in one universe and the Scab Coral in another. If this is true in the end, then don't hold your hopes of seeing the old crew anytime soon. |
| Anyone else get the Aquarion Evol reference? Elena jokes if Fluer and Ao want to Gattai because of their recent closeness. |
Signature removed. Please follow the signature rules, as defined in the General Forum Guidelines! |
| hmmm i dont know whats, what anymore so many blanks |
| Reserve judgement on whether it is a good series after it's over eh? The original series didn't get really good until around halfway through when Renton was away with Charles and Ray. Like others have said before, it's only been 9 episodes so let us wait. No point in criticizing until we know how the story was handled. Btw, anyone know how long this series/season is going to be? |
| Is it wrong for a growning boy to be a sucker for a good romance? |
BXRBudda said: Reserve judgement on whether it is a good series after it's over eh? The original series didn't get really good until around halfway through when Renton was away with Charles and Ray. Like others have said before, it's only been 9 episodes so let us wait. No point in criticizing until we know how the story was handled. Btw, anyone know how long this series/season is going to be? I agree. It's only been 9 episodes. If we were told every secret of the series now, the same people would be whining that there's no mystery. And isn't it 24 episodes long? |
| Eureka's gotta come back into this somehow, same with Renton. I gotta believe that...and truth is intertwined with it. |
 |
| Tbh the truth looked badass after he blew up that car but those gloves he wears look like kitchen mittens Anyways I like Ao far more than Renton. Renton use to cry so freaking much it got old although he changed waaay into the series I'm talking 20+ for character development. Also when those two girls were sitting on nirvash I would have no problems looking at their back sides from nirvash |
| so truth is homo afterall... that's not a handshake.. that's a "i'm gonna rape you tenderly" hand touch don't ask how i know these things (no homo) |
 |
| Mediocre episode, but the next one looks pretty interesting. |
| I'm watching the series again on home video release and I am realizing that Ao's path through the story was more planned than what I initially thought. Naru saying Truth was her "Shadow Collosus" was exactly wrong. |
| Pretty nice episode once again, the development is going pretty steady however the feeling I get from this series is totally different than the prequel which is a bit sad :/ |
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| Truth has his hands deep in the Japanese military/government. |
Fortress_MaximusOct 22, 2021 1:56 PM
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