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Shakugan no Shana III (Final) Episode 21 Discussion
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Poll: Shakugan no Shana III (Final) Episode 21 Discussion


03-02-12, 10:53 PM

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Ok, Shana's plan makes sense, she doesn't trust the denizens not to eat humans despite not having a reason to do so anymore, so she's pacing a restriction (though I think she could have negotiated with Yuuji instead of explaining after the fact.)

Now, the Gods' reasoning is... just weird... it would only make sense as a warning so that the denizen don't try to cross from Xanadu into the real world just to eat humans. Of course, why the hell would they do that in the first place? Xanadu will be a far better world for them, even with the non eating restriction... I think they just want to kill the denizens, that's all. It would be better if they just said it was revenge for all the things they have already done, instead of for some warped reason. They cannot admit that they are simply blood thirty avengers, which at least regular Flame Hazes admit to be.
-FlameHaze- said:
I can't believe no one has commented on say...the last 15 seconds of the episode yet. I hope they didn't all die, and did I miss something? Where is Rebecca? and if she's not in the series anymore which was the last episode she was in o.o I don't remember her dying or anything...she has to be my 2nd fave character besides Shana.
I was slightly shocked there, until the preview that is. It completely ruined the cliffhanger... I think sometimes they simply shouldn't put a preview, but oh well...
 
03-02-12, 11:41 PM

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Yoshida is so important to the good guys; did you see how many people are needed to protect her?
Did you see how many enemies went after her?
Just goes to show that she is the best female in the show.
 
03-02-12, 11:46 PM

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I think Yuji (who's a dumbshit) should have a negotiation with Shana. Now that I know she isn't stupid like I thought she was, I believe that her idea was THE BEST IDEA EVER. Hell it's next to this one!


I didn't even think she would come up with such an awesome idea! The Denifags can have a world of their own (with unlimited existence) but with one rule stating that they can't eat humans? THAT'S AWESOME SHANA! Why would they even need to if there is unlimited existence in the first place? This would merely be enforcing peace. So what the shit is the SoF problem with that? In fact they should all try to use something called DIPLOMACY. Ever heard of it?

On the preview side: AH FUCK! Damn you Kazumi! I wanted you DEAD! When I saw that car go BOOM I
But when I saw the preview and saw Kazumi perfectly fine I
Modified by Golden_Darknezz, 03-02-12, 11:50 PM
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03-03-12, 12:13 AM

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time for my weekly rant

The 3 gods need to die ASAP.

Flame Haze = Catholic Church and Templars

Episode was ok. I just keep seeing more bullshit the flame haze side pulls off.

Somebody who read the manga/novel or w/e this comes from send me a pm about the spoiler. If Flame Haze side win this series will get a 1/10 from me. LOL
 
03-03-12, 12:31 AM

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This episode felt like it dragged. It almost redeemed itself at the end, until I saw Yoshida, probably still very alive, in the preview for the next ep.
 
03-03-12, 12:42 AM

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Gah, waiting for
<3
 
03-03-12, 2:25 AM

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ciddypoo said:
It almost redeemed itself at the end, until I saw Yoshida, probably still very alive, in the preview for the next ep.


yeah that was a real downer :/
 
03-03-12, 4:58 AM

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Another stupid episode. Yuji is quite the pussy and the story in the hole isn't entertaining at all. FAIL
 
03-03-12, 9:39 AM

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Yuji is gonna troll them all, hard lol.

People are totally underestimating Snake of the Festival Yuji's extent in power.

A god is a god. All it needs is the word of god.
bla bla bla
The endless debate between fans and haters. At one point, after spending a lot of time on MAL, you just realize it's totally pointless.
Niko-kun said:
On MAL, everyone who has used the lame rating system becomes a critic and an intellectual by default, haven't you heard?
 
03-03-12, 10:30 AM

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wakka9ca said:
Yuji is gonna troll them all, hard lol.

People are totally underestimating Snake of the Festival Yuji's extent in power.

A god is a god. All it needs is the word of god.


Look forward to it then; it would shut a lot of ppl up lol
 
03-03-12, 10:30 AM

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wakka9ca said:
Yuji is gonna troll them all, hard lol.

People are totally underestimating Snake of the Festival Yuji's extent in power.

A god is a god. All it needs is the word of god.


Shhhhhh lol, your vague spoilers are too accurate! I knew the rings wouldn't destroy the new world being created because of what you said last week! xD
 
03-03-12, 10:32 AM

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everbody how whants to know how shakugan no shana will end
can look at my profile
onder the yuji and shana picture is a spoiler button
with the detailed story how its gonna happen
if you whant it from the start where the last episode end
just send me a comment ;P ( tell me what do you think of the end)
Modified by Black-Flash, 03-03-12, 11:30 AM
 
03-03-12, 10:37 AM

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HawthorneKitty said:
Yoshida is so important to the good guys; did you see how many people are needed to protect her?
Did you see how many enemies went after her?
Just goes to show that she is the best female in the show.
LOGIC.....this makes none

i seriously do hope you were joking with this
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03-03-12, 10:56 AM

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DJIzzyIzzyHitler said:
HawthorneKitty said:
Yoshida is so important to the good guys; did you see how many people are needed to protect her?
Did you see how many enemies went after her?
Just goes to show that she is the best female in the show.
LOGIC.....this makes none

i seriously do hope you were joking with this


Same here.....She is NOT important >_>.....She should've been incinerated in that fiery car of doom.
 
03-03-12, 7:47 PM

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How is Dantalion still alive? He should have been killed a season and a half ago, he really bugs me. Hopefully Chiara will do it.
I'm thinking the ending might be rushed considering the amount of characters still left with 3 eps.
I knew the preview would ruin the suspense but watched it anyway. Anime previews always do.
I'm waiting for Centrehill returning and trolling everyone.
 
03-04-12, 9:45 AM

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Am I the only one who doesn't really pay much attention unless it comes down to Shana and Yuuji and Kazumi and the main cast getting screentime?

Everyone else just bores me.
Dont touch me I'm in despair.
 
03-05-12, 7:15 AM

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so why yuji is angered by shana action ? doesn't it make his job easier that the tomogara won't eat anymore ?

the 4 gods need to die ASAP. their reason in killing tomogara is pathetic. Why would they(4 gods) need to make example of them when tomogaras cannot eat humans anymore in the new world ?
 
03-05-12, 1:11 PM

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I was quite confused about what was going on with Johan and Pheles, and what they were going to do. I don't know if my memory is fuzzy from the last episode, or what. But, Pheles and Johan are in a dream-world? And Johan's going to disappear? And they're going to alter something in the plan for Xanadu on top of what Shana did? Anyone mind explaining? xD
 
03-05-12, 3:00 PM

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Been busy all week but I finally watched the episode, and i LOVED it. I will never understand why other people here dont think the same. Am I the only one who actually finds every other confrontation outside of Shana/Yuji enjoyable?

Anyways Shana finally announced her plan for Xanadu, at this point destroying it is pointless so might as well try to make it as safe as possible to prevent any future disasters. People wondering why the Snake is mad at such a change have to remember that his sole purpose is to grant the wish denizens have prayed to him for years. Their wish is to live in an identical world to the one we have now, only with free flowing PoE to avoid pointless human eating. However just because there is PoE to use that doesn't mean that eating humans is now impossible, the process still exists and there WILL be people that will use it regardless. Shana's new rule pretty much made it so eating humans is impossible, it would be like trying to defy basic laws of how the universe works. However this alters the original wish of Tomogaras and as the God who lives to grant that wish, such an action is unforgivable. How would you feel if you put huge amount of time and effort into creating something only for someone from the outside suddenly come and change it for you?

As for the Gods of the Motherland...I have no face right now...I could understand and explain the views for Sophie, and most of the other flame hazes, but these guys right here are beyond reason. I dont think I've yet to see someone as bloodthirsty them even amongst the craziest of the Tomogaras on both seasons. I understand what they are doing, they are pretty much giving all the denizens their "punishment" for having eaten humans for all of these years, they will slaughter them just so in the future those that were here to witness it can say how their old lifestyle was wrong, or at least thats the message they want to send them. But the message is writen in blood.

As for Pheles and Yohan and Yoshida. You could consider them the third variable in this war. Much like Shana altered the laws of Xanadu to prevent humans from being devoured permanently, Yohan as well has something to add to it it seems and that item Pheles build reluctantly is what will make it a reality. Its already apparent that he is going to die after fulfulling that goal, but as he said he plan to "leave something behind" and that "its a method by which a king once overcame death". If those were not enough hints as to guess what his plan is, then I have no hope for you lol

The ending is almost here, the story is about to climax and all the battles are heating up, those that say how "nothing really happened" this episode are beyond hope...I dont know about you but Im loving this season more every week.
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03-05-12, 7:57 PM

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Lol the 4 Gods' logic is pretty shitty. "Oh, let's go mass murder a bunch of guys, so then the future inhabitants for the new world will forever hate their elders/leaders for taking the pussy path and not fighting the Flame Hazes." So Yuji will never have control over them because they'll just be on a riot.

At least that's what I think there reason is.

Either way, summary of the episode: "Don't hold back..." Then 19minutes of filler. Sigh.
 
03-05-12, 11:26 PM

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the episode was pretty fine, just didn't had much awesome (except for the last few seconds, oh god ;_; ) as the previous episodes did.

also dat preview. ಠ_ಠ
 
03-06-12, 3:04 PM

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Shana revealed one of her card in this episode and I think I should expect Yuji reveal one of his card too in the next episode :D


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03-08-12, 6:12 PM

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Yeah, the preview killed the "cliffhanger". Good episode, just 3 episodes to go.

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03-08-12, 6:47 PM

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1) Is it me or Shana didn't make it clear if the new rule makes it explicitly IMPOSSIBLE for the Denziens to eat humans or not. Because, even if a new law is created, it doesn't necessarily mean that one cannot break the law (i.e. murder is forbidden by law, but it doesn't stop anyone from doing it). Of course, nor Shana, nor Yuuji can't predict the outcome of the new world. The new law may be added, but a loophole may appear. Note that Shana is aiming for long-term solution.

2) If the law doesn't make it entirely IMPOSSIBLE for Denziens to eat humans, then here comes the 4 Gods' role: To make it a trauma for the Denziens such that they won't even try it in the new world. It may be evil, but that's for the "good". This is what they call as necessary evil, and I can understand them for it. Though I agree with Ribersal that it is somewhat a ridiculous idea, and that it doesn't justify the gods for a massacre.

3) I think that the desires of SoF and Yuuji doesn't completely overlap. If it was Yuuji, he should stop. Why hurt Shana more when she gave a better solution? Didn't he join Bal Masque because of the fact that he himself had a first-hand experience of seeing someone being eaten by the Denziens (Yukari Hirai), and if he fights against that law, he will appear as a hypocrite. If it was Snake of the Festival, then I can understand why he will disagree with Shana. The Denziens were used to eating humans, and banning them to do so will frustrate them. But it doesn't mean that they should be allowed to do so. A bad tradition is bad. This may be a necessary suffering for them, in order to maintain the harmony between the three worlds.
 
03-08-12, 7:51 PM

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Lol, the tomagara's will never catch a break will they? Killing them so they will not eat humans? Wouldn't that just provoke them in starting new wars?
 
03-08-12, 7:53 PM

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I'm guessing the law is like a law of nature not a legal law, so the denziens will actual lbe incapable of eating humans, but only in the new world, so that is where the attempt to create a taboo against eating humans comes in, without it some of them would just come to earth and eat humans
 
03-08-12, 9:19 PM

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stupid_name said:
I'm guessing the law is like a law of nature not a legal law, so the denziens will actual lbe incapable of eating humans, but only in the new world, so that is where the attempt to create a taboo against eating humans comes in, without it some of them would just come to earth and eat humans
Congratulations in getting it. Crimson Denizens already know ways to sidestep from their world to the human world by using power of existence. In a world where Power of Existence is abundant, do you really think rebellious or particularly amoral ones won't try to invade Earth to eat that which is denied to them in their new world? Sure, the 4 Gods (one of them especially) just seem to be grasping at straws for an excuse to kill them en-masse but it's also a necessary evil in ensuring they fear the protectors of Earth. By carving the absolute terror of Flame Hazes in history they'll be reluctlant to ever attempt to return to Earth. Would this plan work? Who knows, fear has never been the most ever lasting way of prevention, but the alternative (nothing) will really just leave humans at the mercy of the Denizens if they ever deicded they wanted a tasy human meal.

If you put it eloquently it's easy to grasp the motivations, but the show has been really bad at explaining itself properly. Probably because one or two of the good guys just can't seem to shut up about killing killing and killing.

 
03-09-12, 2:41 PM

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imo if this rule is applied "can't eat humans" many of the tomogara will not want to go to the paradise at all. Kind of ruins Yuji's plans of stopping the fighting as it will still continue unless everyone leaves for the new world.

I think Yuji is only trying to save the humans of this world anyway.
 
03-10-12, 1:42 AM

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yuji was like don't hold back to his wolf frand then done. ??????? then bus explodes.
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03-10-12, 1:58 AM

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At the end I was like yeah Yoshida died!
Preview showed her and I was like oh damn.

Action scenes were nice, and I think the new world won't be created at all.
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03-11-12, 3:22 PM

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whoever thought that the preview was a good idea need to get his head check.... completely killed every suspense there is.

Not like I'd believe Kazumi will die, I mean, she still need to pass on the message, so she technically can't die. But without the preview, I'll at least be sad over the possible death of old man Khamshin.
 
03-12-12, 8:32 PM

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this ep bored me. ADD was in full effect for the majority of these 23 mins =/
2/5
 
03-17-12, 2:08 PM

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Finally Shana reveals her true objective and the reason behind her actions. I am definintely on the Flame Haze's side, they're not trying to destroy the paradise, they just want the Denizens to leave the humans alone forever. I actually love the reason and the way the Three Gods are working to do this. Sure its a bit extreme but I really like the idea of instilling fear into all Denizens and make consuming humans a complete taboo of death. The fights/ action that they have whenever they appear is just made so epic to me with dat music.

I am really curious as to who 'she' is, the one that Johan is referencing about accepting her offer. Also not sure as to who they're trying to pass the message to. Still wondering what their place is in this war and that mysterious item. :o Something about overcoming death? And did I must've missed something, I haven't seen Pheles and Johan in the car and they mention something about being in a place that Pheles is dreaming. :o Wonder if everyone will be alright @ the last minute of the episode.

Sale's background is very interesting.
 
03-17-12, 2:14 PM

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I've been a little disappointed with this season overall. Even though I like it's all toward one main objective plot, I'm slowly losing interest. If I didn't know that there are only 3 more episodes left I don't know if I would have stuck around for so long. Wars can only be interesting for so long. I hate it when anime's are totally based in war. Nonetheless, great episode to see that Shanatachi finally pulled an ace card
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03-17-12, 2:54 PM

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ZeroZx said:

I am really curious as to who 'she' is, the one that Johan is referencing about accepting her offer. Also not sure as to who they're trying to pass the message to. Still wondering what their place is in this war and that mysterious item. :o Something about overcoming death? And did I must've missed something, I haven't seen Pheles and Johan in the car and they mention something about being in a place that Pheles is dreaming. :o Wonder if everyone will be alright @ the last minute of the episode



Johan was talking about Wilhelmina. Pheles and Johan are in the car, they're in the glass vial Yoshida was carrying.
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03-17-12, 3:50 PM

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Starbuck11 said:
Johan was talking about Wilhelmina. Pheles and Johan are in the car, they're in the glass vial Yoshida was carrying.
Oh so that's how it is. Thanks for clearing this up for me.
 
03-24-12, 11:02 PM

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Shana finally reveals the essentials of her plan. Not to stop or destroy the creation of the new world, but to alter it, and forever end the era of Tomogara abusing humans as a source of power of existence. While it is true that the new world has free-flowing power of existence, it is also true that it won't stop some Tomogara from eating humans.

Riptos said:
The best example I can give is relating it to us, we need Water to survive however we prefer something with flavour in it do we not? Perhaps the existence of humans is something similar in that regard. What Shana has done in essence has said "You cant drink anything but water!"


The quote above is a good example of why free-flowing power of existence wouldn't necessarily stop the Tomogara from hunting humans again. Eating humans has become something like an acquired taste, or an old habit for them. Old habits die hard.

Evil cliffhanger averted/spoiled by the preview.
 
03-25-12, 12:21 PM

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At first I thought this episode was alright, but needed more Shana and Yuuji but that ending... wow...
 
03-30-12, 5:15 AM

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This was painful to watch. I'm going to have trouble forcing in the last 3 episodes.
 
04-07-12, 2:18 PM

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The hate against the earth gods is stupid. They are following Shana's plan so why the hell are being amused for continuing to kill or for the reasoning and Shana isn't? They agreed to go along with Shana's request.

Some people are so convinced that flame hazes must be the bad guys because they didn't like the nun from before that they ain't willing to accept that the plan to make killing humans impossible is good. Oh! then their paradise won't have flavor! WHO GIVES A FUCK! they are monsters that kill and eat other intelligent beings with feelings. Fuck their flavor. And if they don't like it then it means they can never be good and not kill people so fuck them.

stupid_name said:
I'm guessing the law is like a law of nature not a legal law, so the denziens will actual lbe incapable of eating humans, but only in the new world, so that is where the attempt to create a taboo against eating humans comes in, without it some of them would just come to earth and eat humans


Correct, and i believe they are right on creating such a fear for them. And why the hell should i see the earth gods(who btw follow Shan's plan) as bad for killings many of those monsters to create that fear when those monsters themselves give no shit on killing and eating many humans. The earth gods are bad for not giving shit about the life of those monsters(who are basically evil) and yet those monsters who do the same to human aren't! Give me a fucking break!
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05-19-12, 11:54 PM

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boring episode. Yuji didn't do anything.

and seriously the "4 Gods" are probably some of the worst characters ever. completely unlikeable. old Indian guy is worthless. annoying crying girl. that asshole guy with the dolls. seriously I HATE THEM, they are just pointlessly slaughtering them all.

Shana's declaration was also pointless.
 
06-29-12, 4:12 PM

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Ok so whats "THE TRUTH" again? lol This episode was just full of mostly just action, not much revelation that i can see. I will say alot of the action in this season makes that event with sabrac on season 2 seem like nothing. But the build up towards all these flame haze powers is very cloudy and horribly executed.

What what was with Yoshida being Johan and Phelez, did she just dream that? Of course its not explained so you have to take it with a grain of salt.

3 more episodes to go. I am still curious though as to how they are going to finish this series and what the final culumination is going to be.
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08-14-12, 4:07 PM

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Great plan!

Especially of the 4 gods, which is to punish the Tomogara that there are now by making them the outcasts of their new world!!

It'd be like if racism was to be abolished tomorrow, all the new children being born would know of people who were part of the 'old world' advocating racism and treat them as outcasts. It's a good plan.

Also - I know she won't be but I'd love it if Yoshida were to have been blown up!


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03-20-13, 5:06 PM

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ZeroZx said:
Finally Shana reveals her true objective and the reason behind her actions. I am definintely on the Flame Haze's side, they're not trying to destroy the paradise, they just want the Denizens to leave the humans alone forever. I actually love the reason and the way the Three Gods are working to do this. Sure its a bit extreme but I really like the idea of instilling fear into all Denizens and make consuming humans a complete taboo of death. The fights/ action that they have whenever they appear is just made so epic to me with dat music.

I am really curious as to who 'she' is, the one that Johan is referencing about accepting her offer. Also not sure as to who they're trying to pass the message to. Still wondering what their place is in this war and that mysterious item. :o Something about overcoming death? And did I must've missed something, I haven't seen Pheles and Johan in the car and they mention something about being in a place that Pheles is dreaming. :o Wonder if everyone will be alright @ the last minute of the episode.

Sale's background is very interesting.


if they cant eat human soul they die & if they eat human soul they die, its lose lose situation, can u live with out food? no!!! no1 can!!! so it makes no sense, if they make a change like that they first need to change their food source, replace human soul with green stuff what humans eat
 
09-09-13, 7:12 AM

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Man this is so boring and stupid, somebody kill those dam God's :( the law is good..glad that they aren't just gonna stop Xanadu..but genocide? Really =.=
 
12-06-13, 11:10 AM

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Most of the parts were boring tbh, especially with Chiare and Sale.
I found that the Flame Haze's actions to be contradictory.

As far as we knew (and Yuji ) knew the Flame Haze were going to destroy the new world. there was no mention by the Flame Haze's that they intended to change the law of the world.

Isn't this something Shana could've explained to Yuji beforehand? Sure the God of Creation might not like the idea but it's worth discussing atleast.

Also the law is pretty stupid if you think about it. In a new world full of limitless power of existence there is no need to eat humans. Plus they could simply eat animals instead!

And besides, it's not like humans are any better. Humans eat and kill animals for food (that's practically removing their existence) regardless but the Flame Haze don't give a care about that.

Anyway, like the others have said, the gods need to go, they are horrible characters that do nothing but waste screen time babbling about nonsense.
 
04-09-14, 1:25 PM

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The way the three gods explained what was the Flame Hazes plan was pretty cold. So they want to kill every Tomogara alive so the new Tomogara will not know about the fact that they were originaly getting existence from human.

Yoshida : ''Is it as dream?''. Well, it really was a dream after all xD
What does she have to protect? That weird bottle Rofocale saw?
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06-18-14, 10:32 AM

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Ähhh What?
Can't Forget You
 
10-30-14, 2:35 AM

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So how does Hyakki Yakou fit in all of this?

 
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