Forum Settings
Forums
New
How would you rate this character?
Oct 8, 2010 7:51 AM
#1

Offline
Feb 2008
2484
Spotlight Character: Holo (Spice and Wolf)



MAL Character Information Page: Holo "Horo, Wise Wolf of Yoitsu"


MAL Favorites: 3435


Old Spotlight: Horo (Spice & Wolf)


For the next two weeks I would like to have everyone familiar with this character discuss what they think makes it an exceptional character. What attributes make it stand out in the ocean of interesting characters that exist in the realms of anime and manga.

Unlike the other two subjects I will not force this conversation to fall into any set structure. Characters that are nominated typically get here because they are adept at breaking the existing character moulds and defying definition.

Because of this freedom I encourage everyone to do their very best to stay on topic and keep any and all debate civil. Have fun and I look forward to seeing what everyone has to say about this character.


RESULTS OF THE RESURRECTION POLL

Holo is PERMANENTLY barred from induction into the club Character list:
25 Yes - 37.3%
42 No - 62.6%

12 Don't know this character - 14.6% of the total number polled
3 Abstained - 3.6% of the total number polled
santetjanOct 26, 2010 6:00 AM
You do not beg the sun for mercy.
Reply Disabled for Non-Club Members
Oct 8, 2010 10:05 AM
#2

Offline
May 2010
8122
Both character and series resurrected huh? I nominated her for a re-vote and this is what I have to say.

If season two never happened, this gets a yes from me. But now, I am going for an abstain (probably), something about season two just changed the Holo in season one for me.

Maybe because I wasn't used to her Japanese girly voice without the English Accent.
Even when I was in crowd, I was always alone
Oct 11, 2010 12:26 AM
#3

Offline
Jan 2009
737
That Horo is hated because she is a really annoying tsundere is all very good and all...

But she is a complex developed character that really emphasises the seemingly forgotten fact that the tsundere is in fact not a readable two-bit character. There is much below the surface of this very old furry.
Oct 11, 2010 10:49 AM
#4

Offline
May 2010
8122
ridojiri said:
That Horo is hated because she is a really annoying tsundere is all very good and all...

But she is a complex developed character that really emphasises the seemingly forgotten fact that the tsundere is in fact not a readable two-bit character. There is much below the surface of this very old furry.


I thought Lawrence was the tsundere!!! Oh my god lol
Even when I was in crowd, I was always alone
Oct 11, 2010 11:34 AM
#5

Offline
Dec 2007
9219
noteDhero asked me if I'd like to act Eva's character in the spotlight. I feel like wanting to act a character means that such character is really interesting.

Guess what!

Horo is on my cosplay list.

I'll be voting yes. She's one of the most interesting characters to act out that I've ever found. The series itself may have a lot of holes that don't allow me to vote yes for it, but this character is just... Delicious.
Waratte Oemashou Sore ha Chiisana Inori
Oct 11, 2010 1:07 PM
#6

Offline
May 2010
8122
ladyxzeus said:
noteDhero asked me if I'd like to act Eva's character in the spotlight. I feel like wanting to act a character means that such character is really interesting.

Guess what!

Horo is on my cosplay list.

I'll be voting yes. She's one of the most interesting characters to act out that I've ever found. The series itself may have a lot of holes that don't allow me to vote yes for it, but this character is just... Delicious.


Now that we are talking about the character, we can comment on season two. I thought season two turned her into a moe-blob.

But if she was such an interesting character (in season one), can't you give her an edge in the Anime. Most inducted Animes here have its characters inducted as well.
Even when I was in crowd, I was always alone
Oct 12, 2010 4:30 PM
#7

Offline
Feb 2008
2484
From my review on the first series:

Holo is what, to many, makes the show memorable.
First of all, there's her concept. She's a 'Roggenwolf', a wolf-spirit from folk legend who was a protector of the rye fields and the harvest; the legend depicted in the anime, including the idea that the wolf hides in the last sheaf of rye, comes directly from the actual legend (although the anime most likely speaks about barley, not rye - it's hard to tell, with 'mugi' meaning barley as well as rye and wheat). But Spice and Wolf adds to this simple notion, mentioning how she agreed to be present in the fields in days when the success of the harvest depended on the whims of nature and the supernatural, only to be forgotten when progress and developing technology made her antiquated, until she roused herself from her placidity, longing to return to her old home, a semi-mythical place where everything was bathed in a brilliant silver.
A being who is not human, Holo is shown to enjoy the marvels of the human world with all the lack of solicitude of a child. Seeing herself as better than humans, she is a trickster, toying with whatever interests her, shown to like mind-games, wittiness and swiftness in conversation, all the while seemingly thoroughly enjoying being pampered, being treated to large amounts of alcoholic beverages and socialising.
While this might make her likable, perhaps even charming, it doesn't make her stand out as a character. What does manage to do so is the fact that, every now and again, without too much attention being piled on it, she, and the audience with her, is reminded of the fact that she is, in truth and not only in word, different, a spirit. At such times realisation creeps through that she is, in fact, hundreds of years old and wise in the ways of the world - but in the ways of the world that was and now is gone. She is a stranger in a strange land, having awoken from slumber only to find that what she once knew is lost. It infuses her with a sense of loneliness that might not always be the most convincing, but at least appears to be sincere.


It is this latter point, her being a stranger to the world she now travels through, which, to me, is the most consistent part of this character's, eh, character. It is also because of this that I don't really see the criticism heaped on the second season: Story-wise, that is purely an 'on the road' chapter, without beginning or end, whilst the characters solidify, Holo in particular more strongly showing her longing to return to what it was she once knew.

However, all of the above mainly becomes visible through the skills of the writers and animators, and isn't so much the hallmark of good characterisation. Holo, interesting a concept though she might be, and not needing development (it would cut against her grain, so to speak, to have a spirit developing), is, as a character, very much dependent on her companion to shine. She isn't required for the story or its setting and, frankly, actually stays rather detached from it. As I mentioned in the Spice and Wolf spotlight, I believe the world portrayed to be the main focus of the show, the characters just being tools of movement to be able to show more and more of it.
Within the greater setting, Holo adds a touch of the supernatural, a poignant remark on the ravages of time - and on what will never change. But as a character on herself, she at best is interesting and charming, but not one that could stand on her own.
Like her I might, but I don't consider her exemplary enough to warrant induction here.

A final note on her design, then.
The manga and anime version of Holo stays very close to the description given in the novels, the phrasing of which make me doubt very much whether anything was at all intended to be even remotely considered in any way arousing. While I will not base my opinion about her on her portrayal in the novels, I think her design was never intended to be a service to the fans, but rather a nod to her duality as both a very old supernatural creature and one who is like a child in a world she does know nothing about.
You do not beg the sun for mercy.
Oct 12, 2010 8:13 PM
#8

Offline
Feb 2009
951
Probably whoever has read my posts in the S&W thread or the comment section on the first vote would know how I think of Horo.

Her design has moe written all over it. Over the first 5 episodes I don't remember seeing any development in her. So she just looked like a fan service package put in the middle of a show that normally wouldn't attract the average otaku. No for me.


Oct 13, 2010 4:04 AM
#9

Offline
Oct 2008
1501
@santetjan: Great Description! I guess I should have searched past posts when looking for the origins of Horo. The Roggenwolf legend seems very interesting indeed, one that I'm not familiar with. I appears that my attempt to compare her to Norse gods is better defined with this legend. Although it is unclear the Roggenwolf's story origin to as yet. I'd love some reading if know any. It still appears that there could be some Norse gods in play with her character.

santetjan said:
she is, in truth and not only in word, different, a spirit. At such times realisation creeps through that she is, in fact, hundreds of years old and wise in the ways of the world - but in the ways of the world that was and now is gone. She is a stranger in a strange land, having awoken from slumber only to find that what she once knew is lost. It infuses her with a sense of loneliness that might not always be the most convincing, but at least appears to be sincere.


This statement is exemplifies precisely why I will be voting yes for her induction.
Oct 13, 2010 7:25 AM

Offline
Feb 2008
2484
@Orion1:
Lazily copying a comment I made to Archaeon:
The Roggenwolf legend isn't very well known and what's there to find on the 'Net indeed mostly points to the being as a malevolent spirit lurking in the fields. The fact that it only lives within something as temporary as fields of grains, however, should already give some pause.
Though it's not the best of sources, as it, itself, doesn't quote any sources, Google made me aware of the fact that there is quite a bit of information on the legend to be found in chapter 48 of Frazer's The Golden Bough - which is probably where the author got the idea from in the first place.
[...]
At any rate, like almost all spirits from legend the Roggenwolf can be both benevolent and malevolent. Clearly, the anime (and the original books) needed the more benevolent side. What is an addition particular to Spice and Wolf, though, is the notion of the agreement between spirit and men, reflecting the more anthropocentric world-view.


With the risk of veering off-topic, I would advise against trying to make a Norse connection, both because much of the supernatural in the series is decidedly more central European folkloristic and because the great Norse gods themselves, with very few exceptions (*Tiwaz being the clearest one), originate in far more humble spirits, not the other way round.
You do not beg the sun for mercy.
Oct 13, 2010 10:07 AM

Offline
May 2010
8122
kokuro said:
Probably whoever has read my posts in the S&W thread or the comment section on the first vote would know how I think of Horo.

Her design has moe written all over it. Over the first 5 episodes I don't remember seeing any development in her. So she just looked like a fan service package put in the middle of a show that normally wouldn't attract the average otaku. No for me.


Personally, I think Holo is already a developed character from the start, her adventures with Lawrence shows how clever she is.


santetjan said:

she is, in truth and not only in word, different, a spirit. At such times realisation creeps through that she is, in fact, hundreds of years old and wise in the ways of the world - but in the ways of the world that was and now is gone. She is a stranger in a strange land, having awoken from slumber only to find that what she once knew is lost. It infuses her with a sense of loneliness that might not always be the most convincing, but at least appears to be sincere.


And to back that up, here is a quote from Spice and Wolf episode 2 that sealed the deal for me (until season two happened)

Holo said:


A trip is the most fun before one sets out on it. With dogs, the bark, and not the bite is more frightening; and women are almost always prettier when they are shrouded in mystery. I can never be as pretty as you imagine, and I would never do something like that to you, would it better to imagine?

Even when I was in crowd, I was always alone
Oct 18, 2010 3:54 PM

Offline
Nov 2008
2524
Confucius said:
Personally, I think Holo is already a developed character from the start, her adventures with Lawrence shows how clever she is.


How can a character be developed from the start, when they haven't had the necessary amount of time to develop? Your logic bears no weight at all.

By the way, just because she made a few underhanded doesn't mean that she's clever. To me, she felt more cynical than anything.
Oct 18, 2010 4:16 PM

Offline
Apr 2009
573
DetectiveDrake said:
Confucius said:
Personally, I think Holo is already a developed character from the start, her adventures with Lawrence shows how clever she is.


How can a character be developed from the start, when they haven't had the necessary amount of time to develop? Your logic bears no weight at all.

Why can't it be true?

I haven't seen this series, but I can easily imagine a character who already has all interesting characteristics, and during the course of the series they are slowly being shown. To give you other examples of such characters, there's Taichi Keaton from Master Keaton and Paul von Oberstein from LoGH.
Oct 18, 2010 5:49 PM

Offline
May 2010
8122
DetectiveDrake said:
Confucius said:
Personally, I think Holo is already a developed character from the start, her adventures with Lawrence shows how clever she is.


How can a character be developed from the start, when they haven't had the necessary amount of time to develop? Your logic bears no weight at all.

By the way, just because she made a few underhanded doesn't mean that she's clever. To me, she felt more cynical than anything.


Remember Yuuko from xxHolic? That's what I mean.
Even when I was in crowd, I was always alone
Oct 20, 2010 8:20 PM

Offline
Nov 2008
2524
whitew123 said:
DetectiveDrake said:
Confucius said:
Personally, I think Holo is already a developed character from the start, her adventures with Lawrence shows how clever she is.


How can a character be developed from the start, when they haven't had the necessary amount of time to develop? Your logic bears no weight at all.

Why can't it be true?

I haven't seen this series, but I can easily imagine a character who already has all interesting characteristics, and during the course of the series they are slowly being shown.


I get what you mean, but most of the time, characters like that only feel like mere novelty figures set in place just to make a series seem more "special" than it actually is.

To give you other examples of such characters, there's Taichi Keaton from Master Keaton and Paul von Oberstein from LoGH.


I haven't seen either one of those Anime, sorry =/
PizzaholicOct 20, 2010 8:23 PM
Oct 20, 2010 9:15 PM

Offline
Sep 2009
2972
DetectiveDrake said:
To give you other examples of such characters, there's Taichi Keaton from Master Keaton and Paul von Oberstein from LoGH.


I haven't seen either one of those Anime, sorry =/

Another great example would be Kino, a character we both have favourited.
Oct 23, 2010 8:43 PM

Offline
Oct 2007
3010
She has a kyoben accent. Which reminds me of geishas (of course). how can you not love her?

Horo was also the only good thing to come out of the show as a whole. Her character is really well done and extremely interesting--moreso than the other characters.
Reply Disabled for Non-Club Members

More topics from this board

Sticky: » The End of Critics and Connoisseurs

HiroM_ - Dec 31, 2022

31 by danz »»
Nov 10, 2023 1:08 AM

» Challenge You Decide: Neon Genesis Evangelion: The End of Evangelion (Anime) (1/1)

HiroM_ - Dec 3, 2022

44 by 25saix »»
Dec 30, 2022 3:10 PM

» You Decide: Golden Kamuy 2nd Season (Anime) (12/4)

HiroM_ - Dec 2, 2022

42 by 25saix »»
Dec 30, 2022 3:10 PM

» Resurrected You Decide: Mahou Shoujo Madoka★Magica (Anime) (12/4)

HiroM_ - Dec 2, 2022

47 by 25saix »»
Dec 30, 2022 3:09 PM

» Blue N Rescue Mission: Eikoku Koi Monogatari Emma (Anime) (12/4)

HiroM_ - Dec 3, 2022

24 by Dramaddict »»
Dec 28, 2022 6:02 PM
It’s time to ditch the text file.
Keep track of your anime easily by creating your own list.
Sign Up Login