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Jun 23, 2016 7:21 AM
#1
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Feb 2015
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THIS IS A MANGA ONLY DISCUSSION POST. DO NOT DISCUSS ANYTHING BEYOND THIS CHAPTER.
----------------------------------------
Summary:

Flashback:
- Osamu collected information about the expedition from Rindou.
- Rindou wouldn't be of much help to Osamu during the appeal, but Osamu had some request for him...

Still flashback:
- Hyuse told Jin that if this failed, Jin better came up with alternative method.
- Jin told him it'll be ok, don't underestimate glasses-kun

Meeting:
- Osamu requests approval for Hyuse joining T-2.
- Rejected by Netsuki. Hyuse was a neighbor who attacked Mikado city during large scale expedition
- Osamu rebuts that Hyuse's situation has changed.
- Hyuse explains that he needs to return to the motherland ASAP, which the higher ups might have guessed. Joining Border's expedition is the fastest way.
- Kinuta remembers Enedorad saying that returning to his lord isthe dog's instinct.
- Does Hyuse change his mind and is willing to provide information on Aftokrator now? Kido asks.
- Hyuse still refuses to give any information that may put his country into disadvantage.
- Then, it's useless
- Osamu appeals by saying that it means all other type of cooperation is fair game. He has heard that Hyuse attacked an enemy soldier the day before.
- The higher ups have seen the video...
- ... but it merely raises a question of why a prisoner could escape Tamakoma HQ. Kido adds that he can't make a decision based on that one action.
- Osamu argues that it's just an example to show Hyuse's battle prowess
- Karasawa dismisses that argument. Sure Hyuse will be a big firepower for T-2, but that doesn't show the benefit for Border.

- Shinoda asks Rindou's opinion
- Rindou says if he's the expedition leader, he will be reluctant to take Hyuse, shocking Chika and Yuuma. (but not Osamu, according to the spoiler, so perhaps Rindou has told Osamu his opinion)
- For the upcoming expedition, the ship has to get trion resupply in many countries. There's high risk that Hyuse might slip off somewhere during the long trip. Isn't that so, current expedition leader? (referring to Shinoda)
- Netsuki is surprised that Rindou is making sense
- Osamu thinks that it's the opposite. To have expedition to the neighborhood, a neighbor is needed because it's an unknown territory. It'll be safer to have a guide.
- Kinuta thinks Enedorad will be sufficient. Plus with Enedorad and Replica's information, the route is being examined now.
- Osamu thinks it's not enough. Enedorad can guide the route, but not give guidance in the country. Kinuta should know this already.
- Flashback to Enedorad saying that foreign affairs was not his job.
- Just to be sure, Osamu confirmed to him personally just now.
- Hyuse is suspicious about Osamu meeting Enedora "personally"

- Hyuse tells the higher ups that as long as it's not remote areas, he can provide guidance
- Osamu adds that it's nice to have a "living guide" in areas without information of culture or lifestyle. This will add the success rate of the expedition. And Hyuse has promised to cooperate for this.
- Shinoda summarizes that because Hyuse wants to go back, he will be forced to cooperate during the way there.
- Correct. So Hyuse will help on the way there, not when Border has arrived there. Isn't it good enough reason to bring Hyuse?

- Karasawa is ok. The return is worth the risk.
- Shinoda thinks that there's merit for consideration.
- Rindou agrees.
- Osamu thinks to himself that he's done everything he can think of. If Commander Kido prioritizes his resistance against neighbors over the risk-return proposition, it's over.

- Kido ponders...

Comments:
- I'm guessing Osamu's request was meeting Enedorad before the appeal. Alternatively, he might rehearsed the conversation with Rindou.
- As always, Jin telegraphed the decision.
- Shinoda will be the expedition leader. So that's one seat gone. IIRC the ship has 13 seats, so 12 seats left...
- Funny that no one in the higher up remembers that Yuuma is a neighbor and can guide the way as well. Well for this, all Osamu and Yuuma need to do is to deny Yuuma's help if T-2 is not chosen, which will show that they prioritize T-2 over Border and the kidnapped people.
- Well, to me Osamu has addressed why Hyuse is beneficial for T-2. And why Hyuse if beneficial for the expedition. But Osamu has not addressed why Hyuse has to join T-2 and what's the benefit for Border if Hyuse joins T-2. Why not just bring Hyuse as a POW or make him join a team that can better guard Hyuse and is trustworth to Kido, like Kazama's? Also, one POW costs one seat in the ship, not 5 for the whole T-2 + Hyuse.
- It remains to be seen if the above issues will be addressed next week, but as of this week, Ashihara (via Osamu) seems to be framing Kido as a racist against neighbors if he rejects Osamu. Thanks to Jin, we know Kido will approve Hyuse next chapter. It'll be funny if Hyuse is guaranteed seat in the expedition but T-2 is not.
Jun 23, 2016 8:04 AM
#2

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Dec 2015
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p-kun said:

- Well, to me Osamu has addressed why Hyuse is beneficial for T-2. And why Hyuse if beneficial for the expedition. But Osamu has not addressed why Hyuse has to join T-2 and what's the benefit for Border if Hyuse joins T-2. Why not just bring Hyuse as a POW or make him join a team that can better guard Hyuse and is trustworth to Kido, like Kazama's? Also, one POW costs one seat in the ship, not 5 for the whole T-2 + Hyuse.


It's true that Hyuse could be simply brought as a POW but I think there is a lot of reasons for going through T-2.

T-2's reasons:
-Obviously, they get to go to the neighborhood.

Border's reasons:
-Get even more info on the level of skill of neighbors by watching him fight.
-Get a sense of his cooperation skills by watching him work with T-2.

Hyuse's reasons:
-Hyuse can tell that T-2 are fundamentaly good people so he doesn't risk being betrayed by them and can count on them.
-If he was with a team under Kido's control then I think there is a 75% chance of them either killing him when they get to Afto or locking him in the ship or something shady like that.
Jun 23, 2016 8:18 AM
#3

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Mar 2014
912
A guide was one of my ideas for why Hyuse would be chosen so I'm good on that. But I am curious about why yuma wouldn't be a good guide? Granted he did spend most of his recent years in one place, so he might not be as well versed as Hyuse.

One the matter of putting Hyuse on a different squad, I don't think Hyuse would want to work with a squad he can't trust. He knows Tamakoma has no prejudice against neighbors so it would be the safest squad to work with.
Jun 23, 2016 8:52 AM
#4

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Mar 2016
139
So, (summing up) what you guys above are trying to say is that if Hyuse is left in a "comfortable position" the chances of things going wrong (he screwing things, to be more precisely), in the way, are smaller than a POW.

Also, yes, for what the manga showed to us, Yuma stayed in only one place (Calvaria) for too many years. So, even if he managed to go to other countries with his father, IMO, they were not as many as those that Hyuse knew/went. Besides, they also may have some "upgrades" since Yuma stayed in Calvaria.

Then, I'm fine with that, don't see any problem.
"[...]I have to admit I'm not a big anime fan. Most anime that makes it over here seems to be either about schoolgirls with supernatural powers who battle evil, or adolescent boys who - for some convoluted reason - wind up having to pilot big giant robots...although, today, you just need to put some boobs or harem and fantasy and it'll be 10/10."
Jun 23, 2016 9:25 AM
#5

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Dec 2015
313
p-kun said:

- Shinoda will be the expedition leader. So that's one seat gone. IIRC the ship has 13 seats, so 12 seats left...


That sounds right but the life of me I can't remember where that info came from! Does someone know?
Jun 23, 2016 9:25 AM
#6

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Nov 2013
22765
Dues-aj said:
A guide was one of my ideas for why Hyuse would be chosen so I'm good on that. But I am curious about why yuma wouldn't be a good guide? Granted he did spend most of his recent years in one place, so he might not be as well versed as Hyuse.
It's the other way around. Yuma probably has more knowledge on the Neighborhood.
The difference between them tho is Yuma has general knowledge while Hyuse has information specifically related to getting back to Aftokrator. Yuma visited that country at least 7 years ago so it's obvious who will be the better guide for an Afto-focused mission.
Jun 23, 2016 9:33 AM
#7

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Dec 2015
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Botato said:
Dues-aj said:
A guide was one of my ideas for why Hyuse would be chosen so I'm good on that. But I am curious about why yuma wouldn't be a good guide? Granted he did spend most of his recent years in one place, so he might not be as well versed as Hyuse.
It's the other way around. Yuma probably has more knowledge on the Neighborhood.
The difference between them tho is Yuma has general knowledge while Hyuse has information specifically related to getting back to Aftokrator. Yuma visited that country at least 7 years ago so it's obvious who will be the better guide for an Afto-focused mission.


Why in the world would Yuma know more about neighborhood than Hyuse? Replica was always the one in charge of knowledge not Yuma. I'm sure he learned a few things but he was basically a drifter whereas Hyuse was raised in a distinguished familly in the one of the prominent country in the universe so I would guess he is more versed in poilitical knowledge than our favorite albino orphan.
Jun 23, 2016 9:43 AM
#8

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LuzNight said:
Botato said:
It's the other way around. Yuma probably has more knowledge on the Neighborhood.
The difference between them tho is Yuma has general knowledge while Hyuse has information specifically related to getting back to Aftokrator. Yuma visited that country at least 7 years ago so it's obvious who will be the better guide for an Afto-focused mission.


Why in the world would Yuma know more about neighborhood than Hyuse? Replica was always the one in charge of knowledge not Yuma. I'm sure he learned a few things but he was basically a drifter whereas Hyuse was raised in a distinguished familly in the one of the prominent country in the universe so I would guess he is more versed in poilitical knowledge than our favorite albino orphan.
Yuma is a traveler and actually visited those countries. But I guess you're right and that Replica has all the info.
No one said anything about political knowledge. Hyuse is the better bus guide because the target is Afto, that's all I said.
Jun 23, 2016 10:10 AM
#9

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Dec 2015
313
Botato said:
LuzNight said:


Why in the world would Yuma know more about neighborhood than Hyuse? Replica was always the one in charge of knowledge not Yuma. I'm sure he learned a few things but he was basically a drifter whereas Hyuse was raised in a distinguished familly in the one of the prominent country in the universe so I would guess he is more versed in poilitical knowledge than our favorite albino orphan.
Yuma is a traveler and actually visited those countries. But I guess you're right and that Replica has all the info.
No one said anything about political knowledge. Hyuse is the better bus guide because the target is Afto, that's all I said.


Well we really have no idea if Yuma ever visited those places. And yes they need political and cultural knowledge. They already have the directions from Enedoradd and Replica. What they need is to know if those country are hostile, how to behave, etc.
Jun 23, 2016 11:44 AM

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Mar 2014
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I guess the difference would pertain to the type of information Yuma and Hyuse have. Being a member of one of the elite expedition forces he must have acquired some knowledge of each world they would be traveling to and how to interact with the residents there. That and Hyuse would know how to deal with neighbor ship culture where I don't think Yuma and Yugo ever traveled by ship.
Jun 23, 2016 12:56 PM

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Sep 2015
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If I was Kido I would probably say no, unless I had a backup plan to suppress Hyuse.

So would only Hyuse and Yuma go on the expedition from T-2?
Jun 23, 2016 12:57 PM
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Jun 23, 2016 5:41 PM

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nathan6666 said:
If I was Kido I would probably say no, unless I had a backup plan to suppress Hyuse.

So would only Hyuse and Yuma go on the expedition from T-2?


If Tamakoma-2 broke up for the expedition, then there was basically no purpose for Yuma to be there. His whole purpose on the team was to help Osamu and Chika on to the expedition. He might as well have joined Kako squad if the team was going to be separated. Pretty sure it is either all of Tamakoma-2 or none at all.
Jun 24, 2016 12:47 AM
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Apr 2016
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And at the same link I posted earlier, english translation is up on Mangamint.

Overall, it's a good chapter, and right along the lines of what I thought Hyuse could offer in exchange.

I also really like that:

1) Osamu came up with the plan on his own
2) Jin didn't have to use his reward or do any "My side effect told me so" type of negotiations
3) That even Hyuse participated in the conversation.

I'm really looking forward to some more character building for Hyuse. We've seen a little bit, but I want to see more reactions or dialog from him to see how he will mesh with Tamakoma-2
Jun 24, 2016 4:15 PM
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It feels like Jin could have sorted it out, or Rindo, but they deliberately wanted to develop Osamu.

Unless they pull off something crazy, like stealing the Galo ship, I'm guessing the expedition will eventually be, Shionoda, Operator *3, Hyuse, Osamu, Yuma, Tachikawa, Izami, Touma & Kazama squad
Jun 24, 2016 5:07 PM

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icecreamsnow said:
It feels like Jin could have sorted it out, or Rindo, but they deliberately wanted to develop Osamu.

Unless they pull off something crazy, like stealing the Galo ship, I'm guessing the expedition will eventually be, Shionoda, Operator *3, Hyuse, Osamu, Yuma, Tachikawa, Izami, Touma & Kazama squad

You would be leaving out Fuyushima who normally goes with Touma. The extra seat would probably best be filled by Amo.

Though from a story perspective I think aquiring a second ship would be optimal. Ashihara dosen't have to be as limited on who tags along and there is great potential for a separation storyline.
Jun 24, 2016 7:05 PM
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Apr 2016
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So, what does everyone think will happen when they get to Aftokrator?

Will Hyuse just ditch border completely to go find his master?

Will they try to forge an alliance against Hyrein to stop attacks against Miden?

Personally, I feel like the latter is more likely, but it's hard to say
Jun 24, 2016 10:26 PM

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Feb 2016
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I think the next expedition to Aftokrator will be of at least 4 A rank teams spearheaded by Shinoda Masafumi and the most likely team would be: Tachikawa unit, Kazama unit, Miwa unit, and T-2.

So we are going to enjoy another skirmish between: Yuma v Viz a, Hireyn v Miwa, Ranbarein v Yoneya, Mira v Narasaka and co., Kazama unit+Tachikawa unit v BT, and last but not the least Shinoda v New "Borboros" BT holder
Jun 26, 2016 4:59 AM
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Caeless said:
So, what does everyone think will happen when they get to Aftokrator?

Will Hyuse just ditch border completely to go find his master?

Will they try to forge an alliance against Hyrein to stop attacks against Miden?

Personally, I feel like the latter is more likely, but it's hard to say


I've always thought there'd be if not an alliance at least a collusion between Hyuse, Galopoula and Miden because they all have common objectives, well in any case they're all anti-Hyrein, although for Galopoula it's complicated. So I've thought that the way things would go is that there'd be a lot of internal tensions in Aftokrator between the 4 factions, and that in the middle of it Miden, Hyuse and maybe Galopoula would take the opportunity to fulfill their objectives by fighting together against Hyrein. Miden will most likely want to take its members back and get triggers/information/technology, Hyuse will want to save his master and change the leadership of the Hyrein faction, Galopoula, if they join, may either want Hyrein's downfall, independance or gain military power. Miden wouldn't be against Hyrein's downfall, but I don't think they'd care a lot, it's not like invasions will stop if Hyrein falls, UNLESS it's someone pro-alliance or pro-peace that takes the leadership.

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