| Genres: Sci-Fi, Fantasy, Action, Adventure On a distant sunless world, the only source of light spawns from a massive structure called The Spire, which towers over the tallest mountains. The artificial miniature sun at the summit of The Spire shines beams of light to four other much smaller spires to the north, east, south, and west, giving light to that region of the world. The side of the world not reached by the light of the spires is cast in darkness and eternal winter. No one can survive the wasteland's cold. The outward civilizations surrounding the Spire worship the light, but one man sees things differently. His name is Aaron, and he is a shadow of his former self, who was once respected as a conqueror who dared oppose those who serve the Spire, a faction known as The Observers. After a defeat that still haunts him, his time as a rebellious leader may be over, but his hatred of the Spires is still very much alive. The time is almost here, where his conquest will continue. Randall, the leader of The Observers, knows that Aaron will soon show himself again. As such, he requests the help of an old contractor, Bishop, who has had previous experience with Aaron. Bishop agrees to hunt down the fugitive under one condition, if Randall releases his old partner, Dustin Winters, (A.K.A Dust) from the Observer prison, where he has spent the last eight years. Dust and Bishop's chase will lead them to meet two other outlaws, Rook and Dice, who have a mutual goal of finding Aaron. The rag-tag team of mercenaries set out on a chase of epic proportions as they are taken to the heart of The Spire, where on the tail of the fugitive terrorist Aaron, they will discover the many hidden secrets of the world within a world. Character descriptions: Dust Bishop Aaron Neva A sci-fi-action-epic of immense proportions, all in the form of an animated TV series. Well, I can dream. I'm currently writing it. Interesting? Crap? Decent? Whatever your thoughts, let me know. This is just a very basic plot summary, and the story itself goes far deeper than what’s written here. If someone is interested, I can go into even more detail explaining the world and the characters I didn’t list here, but only if you’re interested. My apologies if TL;DR, but it's a rather complex and multi-layered setting (literally). Deep stuff, if you know what I mean. |
| Sounds interesting. Kinda curious about it. There were a few things though in the concept I not exactly understood though. I'm not an expert in astronomy at all, but doesn't planets always orbit around stars? or is it something like the star that planet orbited around turned into a white darf or something so while technically exists, doesn't gives enough light and warmth anymore? (or anything like that. I actually don't know how those work) (It also that why there is life on that planet - like if it would never have light and warmth I doubt there would be life on it to begin with, except if back in time it had, or if it was colonised by some people from another planet with technology advanced enough to create those machines that create warmth and light. Another question I not understood was who Aaron is? As for one the faction he led, who are those, and both the goal of that faction and Aaron's himself? I mean, isn't that thing (The Spire) makes it possible to live on that planet? Does he wanted to capture/destroy it? Why? I mean, if it would got destroyed, everyone on the planet would die, isn't? What's the point of that? A small side note. it's sci-fi, right? like with futuristic technology and the like, right? is it humans in the future, or is it an alternative reality? I'm no one to say you should have this or that or you shouldn't have this or that, but a tiny bit wonder about based on what you written so far it seems most of the cast are males, I just think in a sci-fi as for one, women too could have more role, it's not the medieval or something. Of course, if you want it be manly men doing manly things that's probably fine too, I just wonder, it's sci-fi (so future) afterall. |
| Had a brief read over the synopsis, is it a fantasy story or sci-fi? Gave me some Dark Tower vibes but I don't know your writing style. I know it says Sci-Fi in the title but alot of things seemed very unscientific or just not explained. Honestly when it comes to these novels logic isn't really a big thing, just the dialogue and story. I guess one thing that pops up is why do people dislike the Spire if it provides light for everyone? Seems like a great thing. Also (slightly irrelevant) but from a scientific view I have no idea how you could expect to make some giant spire which sends light to all the other parts of the earth when the earth is curved and light moves in straight lines as well as the fact that something so bright so close to the earth would be incredibly hot. |
| I've been here way too long... |
Sora_92 said: I'm not an expert in astronomy at all, but doesn't planets always orbit around stars? You are correct, while the star the planet orbited around is technically still there, its light has died. Another question I not understood was who Aaron is? Aaron is the exception. As stated, most people worship the light from the Spire, but Aaron knows more than they do. He is a very mysterious character, and the antagonist, so understanding his goals and why he is doing what he's doing is part of the main mystery that our lead characters must figure out along their journey. A small side note. it's sci-fi, right? like with futuristic technology and the like, right? is it humans in the future, or is it an alternative reality? Pretty much alternate reality. It's not set on earth, but a completely seperate planet in a different solar system, with its own history. Technology is somewhat futuristic, (particularly the Spires, but they are ancient technology, not built by modern humans) but it is not exceptionally so. Many of earth's rules still apply. it seems most of the cast are males I didn't list every character, but Neva (Aaron's sister) and Dice (The other outlaw) are both female, and play major roles. 4 males, two females. Little uneven, so I understand what your saying. Hope this information helped! I have a ton more too. |
TheConquerer said: Had a brief read over the synopsis, is it a fantasy story or sci-fi? Gave me some Dark Tower vibes but I don't know your writing style. I know it says Sci-Fi in the title but alot of things seemed very unscientific or just not explained. Honestly when it comes to these novels logic isn't really a big thing, just the dialogue and story. I guess one thing that pops up is why do people dislike the Spire if it provides light for everyone? Seems like a great thing. Also (slightly irrelevant) but from a scientific view I have no idea how you could expect to make some giant spire which sends light to all the other parts of the earth when the earth is curved and light moves in straight lines as well as the fact that something so bright so close to the earth would be incredibly hot. It has many elements of fantasy (love Dark Tower), but there is no magic or anything of the sort. I guess it's kind of similar to star wars as far as genre is concerned. Also, it's not set on earth, as stated above. Also, people do like the Spire. Many worship it, in fact. Aaron is the exception. His hatred spawns from his eventful backstory as a revolutionary, where a whole lot of stuff went down involving the Spire. The Spire doesn't send light to the entire planet, it only sends beams of light to 4 specific points on one side of the planet, which is much smaller than earth. Once the beams impact these spire points, the light is cascaded across a large region, dispersing it evenly. Thus, one half of the planet is given light, and the other half is drenched in darkness. And side note, the light is not constant. The light given by the Spires is adjusted to fit a standard Day/Night cycle, but there may be a way of controlling it manually. |
AstroNinja said: Aaron is the exception. As stated, most people worship the light from the Spire, but Aaron knows more than they do. He is a very mysterious character, and the antagonist, so understanding his goals and why he is doing what he's doing is part of the main mystery that our lead characters must figure out along their journey. I see. I still not exactly see what Aaron wants to achieve? Ok, you said it's part of the mistery sorrounding him, but still, what is it? Even if there are crimes or whatever with the Spire, (based on what you say I assume) without it, life wouldn't be possible on the planet, so not really see anyone trying to oppose it? I mean, even if it would be in the hand of a corrupt ruler or company or anything, the unit itself (the Spire) is not bad (based on how I understood) Pretty much alternate reality. It's not set on earth, but a completely seperate planet in a different solar system, with its own history. Technology is somewhat futuristic, (particularly the Spires, but they are ancient technology, not built by modern humans) but it is not exceptionally so. Many of earth's rules still apply. I see. So the Spire is like some ancient technology - are the people able to create similar things nowadays or the technology how to make them is lost? I didn't list every character, but Neva (Aaron's sister) and Dice (The other outlaw) are both female, and play major roles. 4 males, two females. Little uneven, so I understand what your saying. You didn't said Dice was female I think, and you not said much about her. As for Neva, yeah, you said that, based on what you said about her, I guess I assumed the focus of her character is that she's Aaron's sister and her outer and inner drama orbits around that fact. This alone not tells much about her character. It isn't about that a story should have 50:50 male:female ratio, it is in fact logical if a bit uneven (I mean, you have a team, what are the odds it's 50:50 gender ratio?). just it would make sense if there are more (useful) female characters too, not just men. I kinda would like to hear more about this story. |
AstroNinja said: TheConquerer said: Had a brief read over the synopsis, is it a fantasy story or sci-fi? Gave me some Dark Tower vibes but I don't know your writing style. I know it says Sci-Fi in the title but alot of things seemed very unscientific or just not explained. Honestly when it comes to these novels logic isn't really a big thing, just the dialogue and story. I guess one thing that pops up is why do people dislike the Spire if it provides light for everyone? Seems like a great thing. Also (slightly irrelevant) but from a scientific view I have no idea how you could expect to make some giant spire which sends light to all the other parts of the earth when the earth is curved and light moves in straight lines as well as the fact that something so bright so close to the earth would be incredibly hot. It has many elements of fantasy (love Dark Tower), but there is no magic or anything of the sort. I guess it's kind of similar to star wars as far as genre is concerned. Also, it's not set on earth, as stated above. Also, people do like the Spire. Many worship it, in fact. Aaron is the exception. His hatred spawns from his eventful backstory as a revolutionary, where a whole lot of stuff went down involving the Spire. The Spire doesn't send light to the entire planet, it only sends beams of light to 4 specific points on one side of the planet, which is much smaller than earth. Once the beams impact these spire points, the light is cascaded across a large region, dispersing it evenly. Thus, one half of the planet is given light, and the other half is drenched in darkness. And side note, the light is not constant. The light given by the Spires is adjusted to fit a standard Day/Night cycle, but there may be a way of controlling it manually. Yeah no I understood that it send light to these four specific points, I just don't know how since light doesn't curve around what is probably a distance of hundreds of miles. Also is the other half that is in darkness a wasteland? Because it seems like after all this time it would have evolved to meet the darkness. Also wouldn't the light be incredibly bright before it reaches the dispersing thingy? Just food for thought. |
| I've been here way too long... |
TheConquerer said: Yeah no I understood that it send light to these four specific points, I just don't know how since light doesn't curve around what is probably a distance of hundreds of miles. Also is the other half that is in darkness a wasteland? Because it seems like after all this time it would have evolved to meet the darkness. Also wouldn't the light be incredibly bright before it reaches the dispersing thingy? Just food for thought. Comparatively, the planet is very small (moon sized, if that) and the Spire is absolutely enormous, so rather than the light needing to curve, it shines downward to meet the other spires, which are much smaller. Even so, you probably have a point about that. Suspension of dis-belief? :) Now that I think about it, it's probably a lot more than half the planet that's in darkness. As you can tell, I don't have the story fully laid out quite yet. It is a wasteland, as the temperatures would be extremely low due to a lack of a large sun. Their may be creatures that have evolved to survive in it, though. Could be interesting. And the light beams are so concentrated that they don't effect the surrounding area until they hit the spires. Seems unrealistic, but there is an explanation. (haven't fully got it yet though.) Thanks for your feedback! |
| I agree that since its a scifi story you can have a bit of disbelief. I trust you know what you want to write of course, just make sure you keep to the logic the world you create goes by. |
| I've been here way too long... |
Sora_92 said: without it, life wouldn't be possible on the planet, so not really see anyone trying to oppose it? I mean, even if it would be in the hand of a corrupt ruler or company or anything, the unit itself (the Spire) is not bad (based on how I understood) Well, that's exactly it. Aaron's opposition toward the Spire is what leads him to be considered such a villain by the rest of the cast, and The Observers. His true intentions are related to plot points that wouldn't be revealed directly until a good ways into the story, so trying to explain them without that context would just be more confusing. But at the beginning, he appears to be a terrorist who would threaten humanity, and that's why everyone's goal is to stop him. But later on, as the secrets of The Spire become apparent, it would be less about the characters stopping him, and more about understanding him. are the people able to create similar things nowadays or the technology how to make them is lost? There are still remnants of the ancient technology, but they are sparse. These remnants would actually play a major role in the story. I'll elaborate a little more about The Spire itself. It is structured like a circular temple, or an upside down ice cream cone (horrible analogy), being very wide at the bottom layer and condensing at the top. There are 4 layers, each stacked on top of each other, and each smaller than the last as you move upwards toward the top, where the miniature sun is sitting (heat protected, of course). Inside the Spire is a world of its own, or technically worlds. Artificial environments and light sources, capable of inhabiting life. Each layer of the Spire is a different world housing a different society of people, separate from the others. For example, the first layer is a huge desert, with a primitive society that lives underground. The second layer is made up entirely of a large, technologically advanced city, with buildings stacked up on top of one another that just keeps going up. There is only one means of travelling up the layers, and it is unknown to the public, and our characters. Each layer also has a different travelling method, so it's sort of like a puzzle that our cast would have to figure out each time they discovered the solution to advance upward. It would eventually become apparent that these puzzles were designed by someone who knew that the events of the story would some day take place. Also, the people living within the layers are unaware that they are actually inside a massive tower, with an entire world outside of the one they know. (With the exception of The Observers, of course) Even the people outside the Spire don't know what lies inside. I know it's a lot to understand, and appears very confusing without extensive knowledge of how it all works. This being a WIP, I'm still not 100% sure myself. The last thing I want is for the world to all feel disjointed and convoluted, so feel free to ask me about anything you don't understand, every comment helps me to improve. |
AstroNinjaMay 5, 2016 2:08 PM
AstroNinja said: Well, that's exactly it. Aaron's opposition toward the Spire is what leads him to be considered such a villain by the rest of the cast, and The Observers. His true intentions are related to plot points that wouldn't be revealed directly until a good ways into the story, so trying to explain them without that context would just be more confusing. But at the beginning, he appears to be a terrorist who would threaten humanity, and that's why everyone's goal is to stop him. But later on, as the secrets of The Spire become apparent, it would be less about the characters stopping him, and more about understanding him. I see. Well, I guess he must have some reason, but I guess it's just that I don't know what is it, because you not told. of course it will get revealed later in the story. I guess I'm just curious. There are still remnants of the ancient technology, but they are sparse. These remnants would actually play a major role in the story. I'll elaborate a little more about The Spire itself. It is structured like a circular temple, or an upside down ice cream cone (horrible analogy), being very wide at the bottom layer and condensing at the top. There are 4 layers, each stacked on top of each other, and each smaller than the last as you move upwards toward the top, where the miniature sun is sitting (heat protected, of course). Inside the Spire is a world of its own, or technically worlds. Artificial environments and light sources, capable of inhabiting life. Each layer of the Spire is a different world housing a different society of people, separate from the others. For example, the first layer is a huge desert, with a primitive society that lives underground. The second layer is made up entirely of a large, technologically advanced city, with buildings stacked up on top of one another that just keeps going up. There is only one means of travelling up the layers, and it is unknown to the public, and our characters. Each layer also has a different travelling method, so it's sort of like a puzzle that our cast would have to figure out each time they discovered the solution to advance upward. It would eventually become apparent that these puzzles were designed by someone who knew that the events of the story would some day take place. Also, the people living within the layers are unaware that they are actually inside a massive tower, with an entire world outside of the one they know. (With the exception of The Observers, of course) Even the people outside the Spire don't know what lies inside. I know it's a lot to understand, and appears very confusing without extensive knowledge of how it all works. This being a WIP, I'm still not 100% sure myself. The last thing I want is for the world to all feel disjointed and convoluted, so feel free to ask me about anything you don't understand, every comment helps me to improve. Some of this a tiny bit reminded me of Golden Sun - Dark Dawn. As for one the massive amount of light (that could be at the top of the Spire, I assume?) reminds me of Apollo Sanctum which has so strong and harsh sunlight that could kill people who not wear special equpment. And these ancient craftsmen reminds me of the Exathi, who are also ancient craftsmen and their present age descendants. (I not see the similarities as anything big (so possible problematic) though) Actually how big the Spire is? How is it possible the people on the different levels of the Spire and the people outside doesn't know about each other? and like, wouldn't anyone living in that stuff would be aware they live inside something? like even if there is arifical light, there are walls around and floor under and celing upper. Not to mention how can they get the necessary stuff to live? assuming they can produce food, but what about water? and breathable air? and if there would be ventilation and stuff to get fresh air from outside then it probably would be possible that people can go in and out through those. maybe. (thus learning about other people inside/outside the Spire.) so how does that work? And the puzzle thing sounds interesting. but how?, and especially why? would someone know all these things will happen in the future? was it some Nostradamus-like prophet? |
Sora_92 said: Some of this a tiny bit reminded me of Golden Sun - Dark Dawn. As for one the massive amount of light (that could be at the top of the Spire, I assume?) reminds me of Apollo Sanctum which has so strong and harsh sunlight that could kill people who not wear special equpment. And these ancient craftsmen reminds me of the Exathi, who are also ancient craftsmen and their present age descendants. (I not see the similarities as anything big (so possible problematic) though) Actually how big the Spire is? How is it possible the people on the different levels of the Spire and the people outside doesn't know about each other? and like, wouldn't anyone living in that stuff would be aware they live inside something? like even if there is arifical light, there are walls around and floor under and celing upper. Not to mention how can they get the necessary stuff to live? assuming they can produce food, but what about water? and breathable air? and if there would be ventilation and stuff to get fresh air from outside then it probably would be possible that people can go in and out through those. maybe. (thus learning about other people inside/outside the Spire.) so how does that work? And the puzzle thing sounds interesting. but how?, and especially why? would someone know all these things will happen in the future? was it some Nostradamus-like prophet? Very interesting questions. The Spire is huge, probably hundreds of miles at its widest point, and towering well above the clouds. The faction that serves the Spire, The Observers, basically run the whole system. They lie to the people, hide information and practically control them. They're not necessarily an evil corporation of dictators, but they govern the people and systems of the Spire and keep it running exactly how they want it. Since everyone living inside the Spire (except The Observers) were born in their respective layers and have never seen or been told of anything else, it is all normal to them. It is the same case outside of the Spire. Don't forget that the Spire is basically a world itself, having its own weather and life cycles. It would rain, life would grow, animals would run about. These normal world conditions would probably be controlled by something even higher on the food chain than The Observers, that they may not even understand. It's an entire world that behaves like you'd expect, just on a much smaller scale and under an outward influence. As for the last question, I can't say I'm exactly sure as of now. I know the Spires were created by an ancient group of people called the Architects with an extremely advanced technology that allowed them to harness the power of light itself and literally create matter from nothing. The purpose of their creation probably related to an attempt at keeping the planet, or at least its inhabitants, alive when the sun was dying, but something went wrong during their creation (possibly a betrayal, or a unexpected discovery by one of the architects.) and this left the system disorganized, and their purpose unfulfilled. I think that's what Aaron knows, or at least knows of, is whatever major event took place during the Spire's construction, and he wants to find the real truth behind their existence. I haven't yet decided whether I want Aaron to be a direct descendant of the Architects or not, but it could be interesting. |
I kinda not understand how could a structure that huge and tall exist if it's hollow inside? I mean shouldn't it have columns and stuff the inside that support the upper level's floor? And if you would have such columns they probably are very noticeable structures, why the people would notice them, (although might not know what exactly those are). Or it could be the Spire is smaller and the inside worlds are smaller too, maybe has holographs or something at the ends so it looks like it continues but that's just an illusion. although that way the people would realise that after some time (even if the areas near the walls would been heavily guarded. - or at least speculate so or something) Actually why they are world and people living in them, inside the Spire? I mean, what's the point of it? do the people living there operate the Spire? (not necerrarily aware they do it). Because I kinda not see the point of them living there just because why not? Actually who are the Observers? Are they're normal human beings like everyone else? How can one became an Observer? Can other people became that? Or is it so that an Observer's child will be an Observer too? or is it both? or is it some other way? And how many of them there are? And how could they deceive so many people? I mean, as for one the other people (so not the Observers) doesn't have a hive mind either and probably not live in a such artifical society that can perfectly and completely brainwash everyone. I mean, there is curiousity, individuality, and other things, people (at least some) could realise the truth or at least parts of it. And not just that. If the Observers are normal humans too, and there are many of them it could happen some accidentally would told about stuff, or things like people forced them to talk via blackmailing, kidnapping, or whatever other method. Not to mention stuff like if they can travel among layers and stuff that certainly could been suspicious too (or well, depends on how that traveling is actually like.) As for the Architects, I could see some talented and intelligent craftsmen and scientists create such a structure to save the planet's life (it's sci-fi afterall) Although not exactly see them creating matter from nothing (but I could imagine the Spire having serious machinery and stuff inside that generates the artifical sunlight and things and it is operated maybe by the people living inside the Spire (maybe they're not even aware they operate it) What went wrong though? (this actually kinda reminds me of Golden Sun - Dark Dawn again, how Luna Tower was constructed but then they realised how terribly dangerous effect it has, and so after forced it to stop, sealed it away. although that never meant to save the planet I think, they built it for other reasons) But this does reminds me we put much focus on the inside worlds of the Spire, while not talked much about how the otside is (for a moment I considered even that, what if the otside world isn't even exist or uninhabitable alltogether?) But also, an other question, why is there only one (- is there only one?) Spire? I mean, it could be related to that whatever things that was wrong with it after they constructed it why either they not wanted to build more (because it posess hidden dangers or something - even though regardless those, without the Spire, life wouldn't even be possible on the planet) - or planned, but couldn't build more for some reason, like running out of time before their Sun died or the people with the key ideas died and took certain key information to the grave with them, or something. The things you said at the end though (or the way how you said them) suggest that you're not sure about every info either? (It's fine, I just wonder about it.) |
Sora_92 said: I kinda not understand how could a structure that huge and tall exist if it's hollow inside? Well, that's a case of the Architects technology. It's on a level that is almost incomprehensible by our standards, so its logic may seem bizarre. I know that sounds like a cop out, but it is sci-fi/fantasy at the end of the day. Actually why they are world and people living in them, inside the Spire? I mean, what's the point of it? The people living there today are descended from thousands of years ago, and have never left as they've always been monitored by the Observers and kept inside, living the way they do. The Observers are normal humans, and they are again passed down from lineage. They were formed long ago. They are a very large group, as they operate both within and outside of the Spire. They believe they are fulfilling what the Architects had failed at. So, they keep life stable and continuous inside until they can accomplish their goals, which would mean discovering the truth of the Spires and the Architects before them. it could happen some accidentally would told about stuff, or things like people forced them to talk via blackmailing, kidnapping, or whatever other method. Exactly. While they may have been able to keep this system going for a while, they can't do so forever. Eventually, people would get suspicious, and there would be riots and rebellions and the such, just as the one Aaron was involved with years ago, and his recent resurgence will only increase tensions between the Spire's people and The Observers. What went wrong though? I don't know. It's a mystery! :) But also, an other question, why is there only one Even with the Architects technology, it still took a very long time to construct the Spire, due to how complicated it is. They're building a world after all, not just a tower. There may very well have had plans to construct another Spire on the other side of the planet, but weren't able. That could make an interesting plot point; the characters discover the ruins of an incomplete Spire in the wasteland. I have refrained from mentioning what is probably a major story point, mainly because it is the part I have the least knowledge of myself, so take nothing I say at face value. Basically, not all the humans living on this planet are actually from this planet. Years ago, a great fleet of ships left their own planet and stumbled upon this one. Relations didn't work out, and there was a massive war between these new arrivals and the Observers, and the Observers won. Those survivors who came from the fleet are the ones who live outside of the Spire, where it kind of sucks. Life inside the Spire is a lot more comfortable than outside (unless you live in Layer 1, which has been abandoned). Like you said, I don't have everything figured out 100% yet, but I'm making progress. |
AstroNinja said: Well, that's a case of the Architects technology. It's on a level that is almost incomprehensible by our standards, so its logic may seem bizarre. I know that sounds like a cop out, but it is sci-fi/fantasy at the end of the day. Well, I mean, in a fantasy story, I could imagine stuff like it's actually not that big but somehow enhanced by magic or magic keeps the ceiling as it is, but since there is no magic, it must be some other way. of course, thinking more on it they could have special materials that can bear the weight of all of it... The people living there today are descended from thousands of years ago, and have never left as they've always been monitored by the Observers and kept inside, living the way they do. The Observers are normal humans, and they are again passed down from lineage. They were formed long ago. They are a very large group, as they operate both within and outside of the Spire. They believe they are fulfilling what the Architects had failed at. So, they keep life stable and continuous inside until they can accomplish their goals, which would mean discovering the truth of the Spires and the Architects before them. As for humans, I mean, what would be the purpose of them living inside? because I would dobt the Observers would maintain the status quo just L'art pour L'art. (on the other hand, you said something else too after, I'll note on that scenario too at that part) And as for the Observers, they also not have a hive mind, why it can be some of them or them as an unit has that goal, but if it's a group based on bloodline, then it's rather possible there are some among them who never had any interest in all of that and just live their everyday life. Exactly. While they may have been able to keep this system going for a while, they can't do so forever. Eventually, people would get suspicious, and there would be riots and rebellions and the such, just as the one Aaron was involved with years ago, and his recent resurgence will only increase tensions between the Spire's people and The Observers. Not just "eventually", as for one, how it started? the ancestors of todays common people living inside the Spire once had to move inside it. So then, what? And it's not just that. Thinking about, you probably wouldn't rebel against something "suspicious". I mean, as long as you have no exact idea what exactly you're facing... against exactly what you would rebel against? I don't know. It's a mystery! :) You should find that out, because I assume it's a center importance thing in the story. If you would like, I could help you brainstorming about that too. Even with the Architects technology, it still took a very long time to construct the Spire, due to how complicated it is. They're building a world after all, not just a tower. There may very well have had plans to construct another Spire on the other side of the planet, but weren't able. That could make an interesting plot point; the characters discover the ruins of an incomplete Spire in the wasteland. I have refrained from mentioning what is probably a major story point, mainly because it is the part I have the least knowledge of myself, so take nothing I say at face value. Basically, not all the humans living on this planet are actually from this planet. Years ago, a great fleet of ships left their own planet and stumbled upon this one. Relations didn't work out, and there was a massive war between these new arrivals and the Observers, and the Observers won. Those survivors who came from the fleet are the ones who live outside of the Spire, where it kind of sucks. Life inside the Spire is a lot more comfortable than outside (unless you live in Layer 1, which has been abandoned). Like you said, I don't have everything figured out 100% yet, but I'm making progress. Well, that can be. - though regarding the discovery of an other, incomplete Spire makes me wonder why the characters ever would visit the wasteland itself? Then another possibility if there are other Spires too, but relatively far and so they're not known. (that brings up the question though what trasportation methods are availible, as there could be fast methods of traveling large distances too) As for the "newcommers" from that other planet... they left their own planet. why? they stumbled upon a planet orbiting around a star that not gives any warmth and light anymore, and life wouldn't even be possible without that artifical light-and-warmth-source (the Spire). they decide to settle there, then diplomacy fails and start a war agains the locals. why? they are the newcommers and they could just hop into their spaceships and look for another planet if they don't like this one. not to mention the most controversial thing with this whole theory; if the descendants of those who lived on the planet since long and built the Spire too, all settled inside the Spire they wouldn't even use the outside world anymore so it would have no point of the Spire give light and warmth of the ouside world to begin with. since no onle lived there anyway. so the newcommers would just stumbled upon an unfriendly planet and leave, or if settle then deal with the lack of light and stuff with their own technology in some way. you wouldn't waste a lot of energy producing light for places no one lives on anyway, and they wouldn't knew about random newcommers will arrive either, and even if would know, why would they waste a lot of their own energy upon random newcommers they not even know. and they the newcommers even would wage a war on them? for what? without the light and warmth the Spire produces they couldn't even live. sounds rather... ungrateful from those newcommers... And why, not just why would they light the areas they not live anyway, but if they light them up, then when the newcommers would attack them they would just turn off the Spire's outside light function (if it's possible) so the newcommers would just die from cold or starve to death since crops won't grow anymore. (or rather than waiting for that, just hop into their spaceships and look for another planet. So, how is it exactly? Well, that's ok. but should deal with serious plotholes and controversies. If you want, can help brainstorming. Also, another thing; this is just the background. The story is the center, why you might should figure that out first and deal with the background after (because it happens you gather a bunch of cool background info, but then the story goes on a way that some of the info are irrelevant regarding the plot of the story and has no point to even got mentioned - while on the other hand there could be other stuff, relevant to the plot but you weren't thinking about before. So, how the story of the characters look like? Ok, the center is that they're after Aaron they believe a terrorist or something (but actually not that or something) how exactly this investigation/chase etc. go? How exactly the story is? |
Sora_92 said: As for the "newcommers" from that other planet... they left their own planet. why? they stumbled upon a planet orbiting around a star that not gives any warmth and light anymore, and life wouldn't even be possible without that artifical light-and-warmth-source (the Spire). they decide to settle there, then diplomacy fails and start a war agains the locals. why? they are the newcommers and they could just hop into their spaceships and look for another planet if they don't like this one. not to mention the most controversial thing with this whole theory; if the descendants of those who lived on the planet since long and built the Spire too, all settled inside the Spire they wouldn't even use the outside world anymore so it would have no point of the Spire give light and warmth of the ouside world to begin with. since no onle lived there anyway. so the newcommers would just stumbled upon an unfriendly planet and leave, or if settle then deal with the lack of light and stuff with their own technology in some way. The people who came from The Grand Fleet most likely left their planet because its sun was also dying, much like this planet (From now on, since I don't have a name yet, I'm going to refer to The Spire's planet as PLANET X). It wasn't quite as simple as that; the fleet had been travelling through space for a good while when they came upon Planet X. They most likely detected a beacon signalling for the ships, and they followed it to the planet. Who sent this signal, you ask? Probably Aaron. He wanted the fleet to come there. He needed them to come. I think Aaron has a history with the people of the fleet. As in, he was originally from their planet, and he along with several others were exiled from the fleet before arriving at Planet X. These exiles were the beginning of what would eventually become Aaron's revolution against The Observers and the Spire. But again, all this would be getting really deep into the lore and expansive backstory, and at this point the details of these origins are not extremely crucial. Also, you may think that the Observers have control over the light emitted by the Spire; they don't. That is controlled by something deep within it's layers, known only by the code name "The Superiors". It is unknown, even to the Observers, what exactly The Superiors are, as they are presumed to be at the very top layer of the Spire, where even the Observers have yet to access. Whether they are people, creatures or machines, they don't know, it is simply what they call whatever it is that controls the light. The usefulness of the outside light from the Spire relates to the fact that the Spire's purpose was altered during its construction. Don't know all the details yet, but the original intention for the Spire was to maintain the planet as habitable, but when it was seen that this would not be enough to save the planet, an attempt was made at turning The Spire into a sort of ark. If they couldn't save the outside world, then maybe they could create their own, artificial world, inside. Again, what I'm writing is awfully specific to the backstory, of which I only have the basics worked out. If you would like, I could help you brainstorming about that too. That would be great! I'm always open to ideas and suggestions. You mentioned that the story being told upfront is more important than the background origins, and this is definitely the case. This is a character driven story, and next I will have a lot of details about the cast and the adventures they embark on, which is what the story would mainly focus on. I might even have some concept drawings for what the main characters would look like. |
Well, these are difficult and here-and-there controversial. All right, it's good a reason to leave their planet when their Sun dying. But as for one if they traveled for long anyway, they could travel some more, probably, they might not must to land on Planet X. But all right, they did because Aaron signaled them. That makes Aaron not a revolutionary, or rebel, but an "enemy spy" (being the "Grand Fleet" the enemy here. If he was exiled why was he exiled? And if he was, they why would he signal the Grand Fleet? (plus it is kinda controversial regarding time, as Starts probably not start dying suddenly, why they were aware it will happen, it probably already started some times before the fleet left their home planet. In such a global chaos, I see little point exiling anyone. (And if he would been a serious criminal they either would exectute him, leave behind in the dying planet or if not so big of a criminal (or they just don't have death punishment) then simply take him with themselves closed in a prison cell.) If he wasn't exiled but directly sent by the Grand Fleet as a spy, then it makes sense how he is there. It makes him rather a bad guy though, not a misinterpret revolutionary, but an undercover enemy agent. (also, both case, whether being exiled or sent as a spy brings up the question what his sister doing there also?) The Superiors and the whole mechanic how the Spire works brings up new questions too, but for now, I guess let's actually focus on the story, rather than the background, as you said too. So, how the story is like? And yeah, if you plan creating character designs, that could help a lot too. As for helping brainstorming we can do that here (we pretty much already do), but it might faster with some real time chat such as Skype or something. Should we brainstorm here or via some other way (real time chat)? |
| I've been a little busy the last few days, so that's why I'm late. Now, time for some storytelling. My vision is for a very character driven, deep, complex and overarching story line that focuses on our small team of would-be anti-heroes, Dust (MC), Bishop (MC's friend,) Neva (Villain's sister) Dice (Companion), and Rook (Companion). Their personalities are diverse, and hopefully likable. You can see their descriptions above. The tone would be an important aspect. It's a serious and mysterious story, but also adventurous. I want to capture that sense of discovery when the crew comes upon a new place or crazy spectacle. There would be a light-hearted, humorous side to it all, but not to the point of being comedic. As the characters make their way further up into the Spire's upper levels, things would gradually get very dark. Creepy, almost-- as the world around them becomes less and less normal and more unnatural as they venture into the unknown. That underlying sense that there is something more present than what it seems is very important, and would be prevalent from the beginning. I imagine lots of action; shootouts, dogfights, brawls, chases, the works. But also a good helping of witty and meaningful character interaction, developing them deeper and fleshing out their backstory's and personalities. I want nothing to be without a point. Every event, every conversation, needs to mean something. Whether it's to help our understanding of the characters or enlighten the dark mysteries of the worlds within and without the Spire. This would mean excluding filler entirely in favor of a continuous narrative with a constant sense of pace, always moving the story forward and never coming to a standstill. Though the inner workings of the plot has a lot to it, and is filled with backstory and history, things up front need to stay relatively simple and understandable. Meaning the characters will be getting into a lot of individual situations that they have to work their way out of, whether that involves shooting, talking, running, or whatever it may be. At its core, this is a simple manhunt through a very complex world. While Dustin is the protagonist, this is Aaron's story. Aaron and Neva's, to be precise. They are the ones who have experienced the most struggles, hardships, confrontations, and general story. It is their story of trying to understand, not only the world they live in and the forces that threaten it, but also themselves. Finding the truth is the central theme that drives the whole narrative and all of its characters forward. It's also important to understand that while Aaron is may be a complex and misunderstood character, he IS the villain, and for a reason. He is not a good person. I'll see if I can't get some rough sketches of some of the major characters put together some time soon. And about the brainstorming, we can just do it here or through PM's, since I don't have Skype or anything and I'm not really interested in signing up for it. Peace. |
AstroNinja said: My vision is for a very character driven, deep, complex and overarching story line that focuses on our small team of would-be anti-heroes, Dust (MC), Bishop (MC's friend,) Neva (Villain's sister) Dice (Companion), and Rook (Companion). Their personalities are diverse, and hopefully likable. You can see their descriptions above. All right. One thing though I not understood here, you said "would-be anti-heroes", what you mean by that? I see you said Aaron is a complex and misunderstood character, but he's still the villain of the story, and the things he sems to try to do are bad. Also, what about what I asked the previous post about him? Like if exciled then how's that, or if not exciled, then what? (and why is his sister is on Planet X too?) The tone would be an important aspect. It's a serious and mysterious story, but also adventurous. I want to capture that sense of discovery when the crew comes upon a new place or crazy spectacle. There would be a light-hearted, humorous side to it all, but not to the point of being comedic. As the characters make their way further up into the Spire's upper levels, things would gradually get very dark. Creepy, almost-- as the world around them becomes less and less normal and more unnatural as they venture into the unknown. That underlying sense that there is something more present than what it seems is very important, and would be prevalent from the beginning. I imagine lots of action; shootouts, dogfights, brawls, chases, the works. But also a good helping of witty and meaningful character interaction, developing them deeper and fleshing out their backstory's and personalities. I want nothing to be without a point. Every event, every conversation, needs to mean something. Whether it's to help our understanding of the characters or enlighten the dark mysteries of the worlds within and without the Spire. This would mean excluding filler entirely in favor of a continuous narrative with a constant sense of pace, always moving the story forward and never coming to a standstill. Though the inner workings of the plot has a lot to it, and is filled with backstory and history, things up front need to stay relatively simple and understandable. Meaning the characters will be getting into a lot of individual situations that they have to work their way out of, whether that involves shooting, talking, running, or whatever it may be. At its core, this is a simple manhunt through a very complex world. All right, these sound good, I think. Nothing much to note on these. Maybe that that if you plan to have fights, do you also plan main characters to got hurt too? While Dustin is the protagonist, this is Aaron's story. Aaron and Neva's, to be precise. They are the ones who have experienced the most struggles, hardships, confrontations, and general story. It is their story of trying to understand, not only the world they live in and the forces that threaten it, but also themselves. Finding the truth is the central theme that drives the whole narrative and all of its characters forward. It's also important to understand that while Aaron is may be a complex and misunderstood character, he IS the villain, and for a reason. He is not a good person. Still what I asked about Aaron, and his sister. Could you tell more about their backstory and how they got into the present situation? I'll see if I can't get some rough sketches of some of the major characters put together some time soon. And about the brainstorming, we can just do it here or through PM's, since I don't have Skype or anything and I'm not really interested in signing up for it. Peace. All right, I look forward to see your character design sketches. And all right, I guess let's continue it here. Do you need help in something? Things you're not sure about or anything? |
Sora_92 said: All right. One thing though I not understood here, you said "would-be anti-heroes", what you mean by that? I see you said Aaron is a complex and misunderstood character, but he's still the villain of the story, and the things he sems to try to do are bad. By this, I mean that the characters are not quite your typical "heroes". Most of them are not out to save the world, and possess traits that would lead them to do things some might see as questionable, or un-heroic. Again, Aaron's exact origins is an area that is still very fuzzy to me, but he and his sister were both exiled at the same time, along with many others who mutinied against the grand fleet. And thus, they arrive at planet X. Maybe they weren't even exiled, they may have just left for reasons unkown. All right, these sound good, I think. Nothing much to note on these. Maybe that that if you plan to have fights, do you also plan main characters to got hurt too? If I understand you correctly, then yes, main characters would be injured in fights. They are just normal people after all, with flesh and bones, that will tear and break when pushed to their limits. Having characters that don't feel invincible would really help to make them more relatable, and the show more believable. All right, I look forward to see your character design sketches. And all right, I guess let's continue it here. Do you need help in something? Things you're not sure about or anything? Aaron and Neva's backstory, as you can tell. And the ancient history in general. Who were the architects, and why exactly did they build the Spire? Who were the people of the grand fleet before they left their planet? And maybe most importantly, who are The Superiors that control the light? These are all questions I don't really have the answer to yet. |
AstroNinja said: By this, I mean that the characters are not quite your typical "heroes". Most of them are not out to save the world, and possess traits that would lead them to do things some might see as questionable, or un-heroic. All right, I see. Something like neutral heroes I guess or something. Which makes sense, and would be interesting too, IMO. If I understand you correctly, then yes, main characters would be injured in fights. They are just normal people after all, with flesh and bones, that will tear and break when pushed to their limits. Having characters that don't feel invincible would really help to make them more relatable, and the show more believable. Yeah, agree with that, it would make them more beliveable. Aaron and Neva's backstory, as you can tell. And the ancient history in general. Who were the architects, and why exactly did they build the Spire? Who were the people of the grand fleet before they left their planet? And maybe most importantly, who are The Superiors that control the light? These are all questions I don't really have the answer to yet. All right. Here are some ideas to them after a bit of thinking on it. 1.) The Superiors and some general things about the Spire: 2.) The Architects and the building of the Spire: 3.) Homeplanet of the Grand Fleet and the Grand Fleet itself: 4.) Aaron and Neva and their backstory: All right, I had these ideas right now about those things you said you weren't sure about. Hope I could help with them a bit. How does these things sound? Any of them good? Any of them helped? |
Sora_92 said: All right. Here are some ideas to them after a bit of thinking on it. Hope I could help with them a bit. How does these things sound? Any of them good? Any of them helped? I agree with your point about the Observers. They shouldn't be just from lineage, but from people they hire and find trustworthy. I like the idea of The Superiors being one being instead of a group, but it shouldn't be a machine. I think that would be a little too classic, or just might come off as underwhelming or disappointing. I had an idea... It could be a single person (perhaps an architect who went rogue) who somehow managed to ascend his or her existence and become the very essence of the Spire itself. What I'm saying is, the Spire would basically be a life form, and this omnipotent and immortal presence is how it manages to have the necessary resources for life; oxygen, water, ect. This would also explain how the Superior can see and know everything, because it would be watching our characters from the beginning. So, what do you think about The Spire possibly being intelligent? They're ARE people and civilizations living outside of the Spire, in case you you thought their weren't. Quite a few people, actually. While there are locals, many of them were survivors that came from the grand fleet, or at least descended from them. The exact cause of the war is something I've had a lot of trouble figuring out. I don't think the fleet would just leave if they saw things not working out, since they're in the middle of a sunless solar system with limited resources, where every planet is uninhabitable, it was extremely lucky that they even came across this one planet that managed to hold light and life due to the Spire. So, of course, even if they can't find a way to peacefully live there, they aren't going to just give up what might be their only opportunity they'll ever get. They can't stay on those space ships forever, of course. So, the real question is why, if even, did Aaron signal the fleet there, and why did they start fighting. I think it would help if we developed a timeline, just to get the sequence of events laid out in an orderly fashion. So, let's try it out: I'm making this up as I go, so there's bound to be inconsistencies. We can alter these dates and times to whatever we think might be better suited, so don't hold back on giving critique. The only subject I'm really iffy on right now is the founding of the Observers... Something just isn't lining up. I think there's a lot more to their existence than I know right now, I just have to figure out what that is. Now, back to the question of The Grand Fleet's invasion of The Observers. I'll describe everything I know about the events leading up to Aaron's revolt. Lot's of information to follow: This is what I've put together considering your input. It's really helped! I'm still not %100 satisfied with it yet... There are still questions that need to be answered. So, let's see what you think. |
AstroNinjaMay 16, 2016 1:46 PM
AstroNinja said: I agree with your point about the Observers. They shouldn't be just from lineage, but from people they hire and find trustworthy. Yeah, I think so too. I don't know about "hire" though, maybe it would be rather some kind of "initiation". But it could be either way. I like the idea of The Superiors being one being instead of a group, but it shouldn't be a machine. I think that would be a little too classic, or just might come off as underwhelming or disappointing. I had an idea... It could be a single person (perhaps an architect who went rogue) who somehow managed to ascend his or her existence and become the very essence of the Spire itself. What I'm saying is, the Spire would basically be a life form, and this omnipotent and immortal presence is how it manages to have the necessary resources for life; oxygen, water, ect. This would also explain how the Superior can see and know everything, because it would be watching our characters from the beginning. So, what do you think about The Spire possibly being intelligent? The spire being a sentient and inteligent living being not crossed my mind before, but now that you say it, it sounds really interesting. It could work. and could be very-very interesting. The way it works then is the smaller question here, of course should decide what thing the Spire can and can't do, he/she totally could watch the protagonists too along the story. I would imagine this being as a kind of demi-god-like being, I guess? I mean he/she isn't omnipotent, there must be things he/she can't do, and also can't move from the place it is either. However the 1st question regarding this is, how it started? How could an Architect became such a being? Since there is no magic, you said, assuming it's with technology? - if so, what kind of technology? - Or is it some other way? Some kind of spiritual or supernatural or such way? Do you have idea about this? They're ARE people and civilizations living outside of the Spire, in case you you thought their weren't. Quite a few people, actually. While there are locals, many of them were survivors that came from the grand fleet, or at least descended from them. That makes great sense. About how is the ratio of locals - Grand Fleet survivors? I would imagine something like... 70:30 or so (70% being the locals) or would it be different? The exact cause of the war is something I've had a lot of trouble figuring out. I don't think the fleet would just leave if they saw things not working out, since they're in the middle of a sunless solar system with limited resources, where every planet is uninhabitable, it was extremely lucky that they even came across this one planet that managed to hold light and life due to the Spire. So, of course, even if they can't find a way to peacefully live there, they aren't going to just give up what might be their only opportunity they'll ever get. They can't stay on those space ships forever, of course. So, the real question is why, if even, did Aaron signal the fleet there, and why did they start fighting. Yeah, thinking more on it, it makes sense they wouldn't risk leaving in those conditions, because it's unknown what are the odds they would find an inhabitable planet within reach (they maybe low on fuel and resources too). That makes sense then they would stay, but I still not exactly see why would a war broke out? I think it would help if we developed a timeline, just to get the sequence of events laid out in an orderly fashion. So, let's try it out: I'm making this up as I go, so there's bound to be inconsistencies. We can alter these dates and times to whatever we think might be better suited, so don't hold back on giving critique. The only subject I'm really iffy on right now is the founding of the Observers... Something just isn't lining up. I think there's a lot more to their existence than I know right now, I just have to figure out what that is. Well... there are questions regarding this like how many years it took to build the Spire - also, I guess a Sun not dies suddenly (actually don't know, I just assume) so I could imagine the Spire's building took a century or so or something. And it must been finished before their Sun died, because other way they couldn't finish it anymore, so assume it's finished some time before their Sun died. It can be they barely finished, but they must have finished it before. As for the founding of the Observers, it's likely right after that, if not even meanwhile the building of the Spire. it also brings up the question again about said country's goverment, like what kind of goverment they has? Are the Observers the goverment, or - I think more likely - they're a group not the goverment, but involved with the goverment and has big infulence on it. I'm not sure whether the Grand Fleet's departure was only 30 years ago, could be it was long time ago. And I'll note on their attack, but the thing that bother me even more is regarding Aaron's exile. You have a large fleet of spaceships, some being cariers/cargo vessels with probably many civillans (or it's possible they would had a militaristic society where everyone (between certain age probably) is a soldier, but not sure about that). Anyway, you have limited amount of ships and resources (like fuel - maybe. depends on on what their spaceships run?) in order to exile a group of people, you should give them a ship, fuel, etc. I not see the point of that in their situation. if those people were criminals they would get sentenced to prison or executed, not see them point of exiling them because it would cost a lot to the fleet they probably can't afford or wouldn't do it because it would be risky. And also not see the point exiling a 10 years old boy and his even younger sister. it could been explained the criminals were their parents, and thus they got exiled along them, but as noted, the whole exile thing sounds weird this way. it could work if they're already on Planet X since some time, but I not realy see it in the space. Now, back to the question of The Grand Fleet's invasion of The Observers. I'll describe everything I know about the events leading up to Aaron's revolt. Lot's of information to follow: All right, there are some stuff that I not exactly understand. "orbital bombardments" - so you mean the Grand Fleet started sieging Planet X or something? Not exactly see the point of it. I mean, it can be they're not aware the Spire makes life possible there at first, why they would siege, but if you think more about it, if they would know that, it's not likely they would siege, consider, destroying the Spire would lead to rendering that planet uninhabitable too, thus they destoyed their own chance of finding an inhabitable planet. All right, "The Night of Metal Rain" sounds cool, although if the battle took several weeks it would been NightS or WeekS of Metal Rain instead, I think. And all right, after it the Grand Fleet had to land, and... I not exactly see they would get integrated by the locals so easily right after they randomly laid siege on the planet? (Also, as noted before, I assume there were many civillans with the Grand Fleet. Would you just risk them in such a war? You found a planet with unknown tech level, you attack them, while you're short on resources and fuel, they could shoot out your carriers and cargo vessels too, losing lots of your unarmed civillans (and cargo) - but even if everyone would be soldier still, you're risking tons of human lives in an ATTACK (not defense) that has 50% chance to fail from the start - Russian Rulette! It seems they had no strategical sense at all. Sounds like something like pre Sun Tsu Chinese army. However there usually the key to victory was superior number - what they not have either, I assume, and they don't even know how many the population of Planet X, how is their tech level and how strong is their army. They do a head on Zerg Rush with 50% chance to win (50% because they either win or not.) - the actual percent is likely smaller, but without info, we would start assuming 50%. they likely have less than 10% to win such a war, because of all the known conditions. Why would the Grand Fleet do that?) All right, so Aaron knew the Grand Fleet's leaders were war crazy lunatics - how would he know that? or was that common knowledge among the Grand Fleet people? So, with the battle, most/all of the Grand Fleet leaders died, and they're more peaceful now? And why would it weaken the Observers? They won the battle (probably suffered loses, but they still won) and now are celebrated as the defenders of the planet, it would not weaken them, but make them even stronger. Well, it can be though they losed very important persons in the battle) And then why would Aaron want to gather soilders and attack the Spire? If he want to CAPTURE the Spire, that I might could see, although he could probably think out some other methods to do that, like becoming an Observer and grow his infulence until one day he becames infulental enough to do a coup or something. But I not see the point of an attack. They likely not want to destroy the Spire, since it would mean they all will die because the Spire makes life possible. And seriously, he gather an army and thinks he can do anything? They're probably incomparably weaker than the locals' forces. Although he was only 15 back then, I could imagine him being hot headed and without much experience to do that, though then not see why would anyone follow him. And what's his grudge on the Spire, again? I still not understand that thing. What are his motives? Why would he attack the Spire? All right, then by betrayal his attack try failed, his soilders died (actually why would Bishop and Neva kill Aaron's soilders? they were on the same side, and even if they broke into factions, I not see them kill the whole army. they could turn them against Aaron or something, and gain control over the army instead of just killing them. All right, Aaron get to know it, burned Bishop's face and went hiding in the wasteland - again, how is life even possible there? Then Dust and Bishop do stuff and end up in the Observers' prison, then later they got freed to kill Aaron, and story starts. I just not understand the Grand Fleet survivors' grudge on the locals and the Spire. Grand Fleet had to left their home planet. After decades of search, they stumble upon an inhabitable planet - in a solar sistem with a dead sun/white dwarf, something and life is only possible because the thing/being called Spire, because it gives artifical "sun"light and warmth to the planet as long as its range reaches. Grand Fleet (they might not aware this right at the start) lays siege on the planet they stumble upon - probably one of the worst start to have a good relationship with the locals. Got defeated, land on the planet, get the chance to integrate into Planet X's population (the locals seems pretty... dunno, bleeding hearts accepting the Grand Fleet survivors just like that, just after they randomly laid siege on them - all right, it were the leaders and soldiers not the civillans, but still, you see what I mean?) Grand Fleet survivors successfully left their own dying planet, found an inhabitable planet, laid side on it instead trying diplomacy, got defeated, circumstances forced them to stay, locals let them in, integrated them (or seems actually not). they have and inhabitable planet to live on. they have food, and water, air to breathe, likely places to stay (probably they built them) etc. and all of this happened just about 15 years ago. The very fact that they're alive is because the Spire and because the locals were nice to them accepting them in. WHAT THE HELL IS THEIR GRUDGE WITH THE LOCALS?! Even if they were enslaved or something and forced to do labor, I still not see them try to attack the Spire - the thing makes their life possible! In such case they might would rebel and try to free themselves from slavery and became normal citizens or something, but I not see them would attack the Spire. So how is that? |
Hmm... yes, it would either be of some sort of supernatural or spiritual doing or of extreme, super technology. More likely the latter, but I'm against neither. The real question is just what really went down around the time of The Spire's completion? Because whatever it was, I know it was some extreme material. Aaron's exile from The Grand Fleet... I'm pretty sure Aaron and Neva themselves had little to due with them being cast out. Maybe their parents started the trouble, and they became involved, therefore they were sent away with the others. Or instead they actually left of their own free will, rather than being kicked out. That would probably make more sense. Okay, so clearly there are two major issues that need to be worked out. 1), Why did the grand fleet attack the observers, and 2), why did Aaron lead an attack on the Spire. The answer to #1 could be a variety of things... My best guess would be that they were provoked. They didn't just arrive in planet X's orbit and start attacking immediately, they were up there for quite a while before things got hairy. I should mention that the Spire, in this case being the Superior, has a defense mechanism. This is why the Observers cannot simply fly to the top layer, because any ships that try to fly up there are instantly obliterated by a beam of concentrated, ultra-hot light from the mini-sun. As I said, this is probably The Superior's handy work. So what I'm thinking, is maybe at a certain point, the Spire shot a light beam into space and destroyed one of The Grand Fleet's ships, forcing them to retaliate. Alternatively, this could have been Aaron's doing, having somehow discovered a way to manipulate the light himself (I'm not going to get into how that's possible just yet, I need more time to think it through). And #2, Aaron and his outcast's grudge against the Spire. This is really hard to answer, because this is the question that the entire story's mystery rides on. Aaron's motivation is arguably the most important plot element, and it's not something that would be revealed over night. As such, it needs to be convincing, and meaningful, which is why I don't have a definitive answer yet, because I don't want it to be some disappointing cop out of an explanation for literally everything that will happen in the story. Though to give basic context: while the Spire may be the one reason the planet is livable, it's not exactly sunshine and rainbows living outside of the Spire. The people are watched and judged and controlled by The Observers, (thus the name, 'The Observers'), and when the light from the Spire goes into its night cycle, I imagine it would get very cold (Still livable, because the mini-sun is still there, just its light blocked off). So, life outside the Spire kind of sucks. That's still not reason enough to give Aaron proper motivation for everything he does, but it does help. Besides, they weren't attacking the Spire specifically, (as in trying to destroy it, that's not possible anyway) They were attack The Observers, who just happen to hang out in and around The Spire. Though there is something that Aaron knows about the Spire... Something deep, and serious. I just don't know what are how, yet. And as for Bishop and Neva's betrayal, I'm thinking it was less of a straight up betrayal and more of a manipulation tactic to get what they wanted out of the situation. Maybe Randall made a deal with them; something along the lines of "Screw over Aaron, and The Observers will make it worth your while". Y'know? And you make a good point of Aaron's inexperience at the time-- he was hot-headed, and anxious for his fight. This lead to his entire plan collapsing before him. Since then, during his hiding in the wasteland , He trained, and developed his skills in every regard. He most certainly nearly died during this time, on multiple occasions, but managed to pull through via sheer strength and determination. Perhaps he met someone here... A living architect, maybe? Or if that's too far fetched, maybe he discovered some remnant from years before, or a piece of technology, that could give him the knowledge that only he knows, and would give reason to his actions. Anyway, back to the Night of Metal Rain, (There is no specific nights or days on planet X, being no real sun. So it all kind of blends together, therefore, just 'night' instead of 'nights'.) Afterwords the survivors of The Grand Fleet weren't simply accepted into society immediately. This was a very long, and arduous process. There was probably some executions, as well. But think, you've got thousands upon thousands of people-- many of them innocent civilians-- on board these space cruisers, what were The Observers supposed to do with them? They may be a shady organization, but their not merciless. So, the developed the plan to let the survivors remain in the lands outside The Spire, under strict observation. |
AstroNinja said: Hmm... yes, it would either be of some sort of supernatural or spiritual doing or of extreme, super technology. More likely the latter, but I'm against neither. The real question is just what really went down around the time of The Spire's completion? Because whatever it was, I know it was some extreme material. All right. It could be some kind of technology, but then what exactly? Supernatural or spiritual also could work. Maybe we could think about what things the Superior can and can't do, that might could help deciding on this. Aaron's exile from The Grand Fleet... I'm pretty sure Aaron and Neva themselves had little to due with them being cast out. Maybe their parents started the trouble, and they became involved, therefore they were sent away with the others. Or instead they actually left of their own free will, rather than being kicked out. That would probably make more sense. Yeah, it's very likely it weren't them, considering they were just small children at that time. I still not see the point of them (or actually anyone from the Grand Fleet) being exiled, as noted before because limited number of ships, resorces (such as fuel) etc. On the other hand if they left for other reason that might could work. Either sent by the grand fleet as scouts or spies, or it could be they left on their own will. I have some ideas to that too, I'll write at Aaron's things. Also. How could that ship or something Aaron, Neva and some others traveled with found Planet X much sooner than the Grand Fleet - and why wouldn't they signaled them if they were scouts/spies? I mean, I assume the Grand Fleet moves in space with X "space knot" (or whatever) speed, if the ship Aaron traveled with moves the same speed it wouldn't find Planet X significantly sooner (except if it was so they went to some other direction, but then what about them signaling the Fleet?) or it could be different ships has different max speed and their one was of the faster kind (I would think those move with the same speed as the others in the Fleet normally to stay together, but as alone they could move faster - just need to consider the thing regarding fuel too. Okay, so clearly there are two major issues that need to be worked out. 1), Why did the grand fleet attack the observers, and 2), why did Aaron lead an attack on the Spire. The answer to #1 could be a variety of things... My best guess would be that they were provoked. They didn't just arrive in planet X's orbit and start attacking immediately, they were up there for quite a while before things got hairy. I should mention that the Spire, in this case being the Superior, has a defense mechanism. This is why the Observers cannot simply fly to the top layer, because any ships that try to fly up there are instantly obliterated by a beam of concentrated, ultra-hot light from the mini-sun. As I said, this is probably The Superior's handy work. So what I'm thinking, is maybe at a certain point, the Spire shot a light beam into space and destroyed one of The Grand Fleet's ships, forcing them to retaliate. Alternatively, this could have been Aaron's doing, having somehow discovered a way to manipulate the light himself (I'm not going to get into how that's possible just yet, I need more time to think it through). All right, so #1. Being "provoked" that way could be a Casus Belli indeed, however it's still not clear. You stumble upon a planet you not know (except if we consider Aaron and others' ship arrived there sooner and told about stuff. - in case it could make sense) IF you know little you might wouldn't try to attack in said situation (considering you not know your chances to victory, you're short on resources and with such an attack you take great risk, risking your civillans too and all) Also, if the Spire has such a defensive mechanism ("mechanism"? considering we're taking about a sentient being?) why he/she not shot at the ship Aaron and others arrived with? It could be that those not seemed harmful, but then why would the Superior also shot at Observers and such if they come too close? It could be somehow Aaron's doing, but it's questionable how exactly? And #2, Aaron and his outcast's grudge against the Spire. This is really hard to answer, because this is the question that the entire story's mystery rides on. Aaron's motivation is arguably the most important plot element, and it's not something that would be revealed over night. As such, it needs to be convincing, and meaningful, which is why I don't have a definitive answer yet, because I don't want it to be some disappointing cop out of an explanation for literally everything that will happen in the story. Though to give basic context: while the Spire may be the one reason the planet is livable, it's not exactly sunshine and rainbows living outside of the Spire. The people are watched and judged and controlled by The Observers, (thus the name, 'The Observers'), and when the light from the Spire goes into its night cycle, I imagine it would get very cold (Still livable, because the mini-sun is still there, just its light blocked off). So, life outside the Spire kind of sucks. That's still not reason enough to give Aaron proper motivation for everything he does, but it does help. Besides, they weren't attacking the Spire specifically, (as in trying to destroy it, that's not possible anyway) They were attack The Observers, who just happen to hang out in and around The Spire. Though there is something that Aaron knows about the Spire... Something deep, and serious. I just don't know what are how, yet. And as for Bishop and Neva's betrayal, I'm thinking it was less of a straight up betrayal and more of a manipulation tactic to get what they wanted out of the situation. Maybe Randall made a deal with them; something along the lines of "Screw over Aaron, and The Observers will make it worth your while". Y'know? And you make a good point of Aaron's inexperience at the time-- he was hot-headed, and anxious for his fight. This lead to his entire plan collapsing before him. Since then, during his hiding in the wasteland , He trained, and developed his skills in every regard. He most certainly nearly died during this time, on multiple occasions, but managed to pull through via sheer strength and determination. Perhaps he met someone here... A living architect, maybe? Or if that's too far fetched, maybe he discovered some remnant from years before, or a piece of technology, that could give him the knowledge that only he knows, and would give reason to his actions. #2. That's right, it's a center question and is very important regarding the whole story. All right, let's see... Live outside the Spire - I wouldn't think it sucks. I mean, I would imagine those things like normal, or well, as for one, there are locals outside too, not just Grand Fleet survivors. Also, I would think that the outside and the inside knows about each other, at least something like the outside, the inside 1st and 2nd level, higher levels maybe hidden and unknown by most, but considering things like resources (and also the fact that at some point the inside people should move inside they must know about they're living inside the Spire - and it also not seems to have too much point the inside and outside wouldn't know about each other. So I would imagine they know about and has relationships and the outside probably brings resources and stuff to the inside they not have etc. And I also not see why would night be that cold and stuff, It also questionable if the Spire has day-night cycle or it's always in day mode? (and if it has cycle, how is it? I would think it's imitating the original day-night cycle of the planet, which is might or might not exactly as on Earth (though even on Earth, it's different on different areas, depending on how close or far it from the Equator, etc.) The whole thing sorrounding Aaron is a thing still vague, should do something with it. His grudge is one thing, and it's still not clear at all, but there are other things too. As for one, whatever his motive is for attacking, he is just a 15 years old boy, without experience, if he's just a normal boy, I not really see why would anyone (but expecially so many as an army) would follow him? To this though, I have an idea. It might could work. Let's say, the Grand Fleet was an absolute monarchy/dictature or something, point being having something like a ruler family. The actual ruler probably stayed with the Grand Fleet, but let's say he/she had several children, let's say one being Aaron's mom or dad. This said crown prince(ss) decided to leave on his/her own or something (or could be was sent for scouting or something, but let's say went away on free will) with a few of their people, the whole consisting likely only one ship or something. (They need some reason to leave the fleet though, but it could be anything) They stumple upon Planet X and land there, without much problem. Showing they arrived with peace, the locals accept them, and maybe either integrate them, or grant them a small area (what they likely not need. let's say an area relatively poor in resources, if it even has any beside land to cultive food and drinkable water. Said crown prine(ss) establish a mini-state there and has good relations with the locals. (they probably would do something the locals can use, why it's fruitful to the locals too. let's say they're mostly skilled in some kind of thing, like certain technology or something) Let's say. Everything went fine, until the Grand Fleet stumbled upon Planet X too. But that changed the situation. Maybe it would risk the status of said mini-state too, and the locals too. Maybe they would persecute the mini-state too, claiming it's the Grand Fleet ruler's and such. Although without intel, the Grand Fleet wouldn't risk an attack on the planet... even if they would have a Casus Belli like one of their ships shot down by the Spire, because an attack would be risky in their situation as I mentioned before - although why the Spire shot at it could be this way because the mini-state told about stuff and the locals try to shoo the Grand Fleet. though then they likely would message them to leave their area and such (at least first) and it not necessarily makes sense the Grand Fleet would stay and then even engage in a war. It could be some inside grudge between the Grand Fleet and said crown prine(ss)'s people (or directly an antagonism in the ruler family. - maybe the old ruler died since too, etc.)... not sure about these things, but maybe you can get something useful from them too. Anyway, being the son of that crown prince(ss) would make Aaron a crown prince, and likely heir of the throne of said mini-state. It would explain why would other follow him despite being young and inexperienced. It also could explain him want the Grand Fleet go away - if try to shoo them - or provoking a war. After that...? Still not know his grudge on the locals, so his attack on them still not makes sense. I mean, there could be things like he dreams big and want to rule a huge country instead just the mini one he inherits, and thus attacks, but strategically it makes no sense since his army is significantly weaker than the local forces, his attack would be crushed like a bug even without Bishop's betrayal, and it would broke the good relationship between his and the local's (significantly bigger and stronger) coutry. The locals likely would just go out and annect his mini-state as an answer. All right, Aaron went hiding. It could change his character from a spoiled brat of a young crownprince with just big dreams to a skilled man who can survive even in harsh environment, who can get usefull tools even from scrap metal and rocks and such, someone who can stand on his legs anything would happen. He could stumble upon many things in the dark areas, like abamdoned houses, research facilities, he could found info about the developing of the Spire etc., he could find even such things like the diary of the Architect who is the Superior now, anything. All right, he get to know things. What things? And what would he want to achieve? Taking revange they crushed his ATTACK not makes sense since again, he attacked. Although he still could have big dreams and planning something like with having all these new info he found, return in secret, enter the Spire somehow, infiltrate the higher levels knowing methods now how he can do that and reach to the top to met the Superior for some reason, like a blackmailing with all the info he has. Although that would be questionable too, because the Superior basically not seems to need to fear from anything, and regardless how compromiting said info would be, he/she is still the one makes life possible, which would make people not care about those things. The Superor also not needs to fear from persecution. And also, who would believe Aaron to begin with? (though he could have evidence but still.) Also, the Superior could just kill Aaron anyway. (so let's say Aaron would want to be a big ruler, this plan wouldn't work this way, because it's no point blackmailing the Superior. - It also could be Aaron found the method how the Superior became as he/she is, and thus he could became one too, or something, but I not see exactly see the point of that in Aaron's case, I mean, if he would like to be a great emperor or something, he maybe wouldn't want to be an (although immortal, which is cool) huge stucture that can't even move freely. I mean, being the Superior probably not bad, but I'm not sure that would be what Aaron wants to achieve.) Plus, if there would be info only Aaron knows because he get to know them in the wasteland by stumbling upon lost research facilities and such, he has significant advantages compared to the other characters, even in such basic things he could know methods how to infiltrate higher levels while the main characters chasing him wouldn't know that, (and there isn't even anyone they could learn them from! since the only one knows it is Aaron (well, probably the Superior also knows it, and he/she could help the main characters, but I not see he/she has any motive to do so. I mean, he/she is far superior in power, if Aaron would posess any risk for him/her, he/she could just kill him or something and that's it.) So that way how could the main characters chase him? So this thing still not want to work fine at all. But still, I hope you can get some good ideas from these messy ideas. Anyway, back to the Night of Metal Rain, (There is no specific nights or days on planet X, being no real sun. So it all kind of blends together, therefore, just 'night' instead of 'nights'.) Afterwords the survivors of The Grand Fleet weren't simply accepted into society immediately. This was a very long, and arduous process. There was probably some executions, as well. But think, you've got thousands upon thousands of people-- many of them innocent civilians-- on board these space cruisers, what were The Observers supposed to do with them? They may be a shady organization, but their not merciless. So, the developed the plan to let the survivors remain in the lands outside The Spire, under strict observation. I still think IF the Spire manages a day-night cycle, then is would be NishtS or DayS or something of Metal rain. It's a minor thing though. Well, yeah, maybe that could make sense. Although you might wouldn't accept a laarge bunch of shady, unknown, might dangerous people (who likely also has a completely different culture, maybe not even compatible with the local) just out of being a bleeding heart, that's (probably) not how politics (supposed to) work. If there is anything why the locals need them, then maybe. like let's say, the Grand Fleet people knows technology that are useful for the locals too or anything, then it could make some sense. Then there likely would be big focus on integration too, which makes things like how could Aaron attack weird too, I mean if they did integrated them, they maybe wouldn't attack. But yeah, so probably the Grand Fleet survivors would being strictly observed, and being integrated in to locals' society. It also brings questions how different the two cultures are? As for one how the who cultures are to begin with? |
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