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Discussion over, got my answer. Can be closed/deleted.

Well, the understanding you think must is, isn't think necessarily of become another field of the brain focus. Whether or yes you discover that entropy of lies within, you will forever undo as far as to decide and follow the perforations of the falcon. Be it as it do, it is, so never is can't become the lions of the become.

The heavy meaningful dialogue is a large part of what makes Kara no Kyoukai so appealing. Above trying to make the series sound smart, it plays a big part in setting the mood. When morals, ultimatums, truths/lies, and illusion/reality are all taken into consideration, deep dialogue is formed. The series doesn't spend 30 minutes explaining things and 120 with the characters in some form of action, which isn't uncommon these days. The dialogue isn't as simple as "we good guy" "you bad guy" "we fight now". By actually spending time through meaningful dialogue they are capable of setting an accurate mood and place ideas and questions into the viewers head about the discussions and the events that will soon unfold.

If you couldn't get into the dialogue then your missing at least half of the impact of the series with just that. But the problem you have with it is pretty much that the writing style isn't appealing to you, saying that others liking something that doesn't appeal to you makes it overrated is an exaggerated reaction.

The way I see it, there's no way to make the series more appealing to you. But questioning other peoples tastes because they differ is a little much, I have a hard time dealing with the term "overrated" because it insults others taste's. And I'm sure you don't want people labeling your favorite series's in such ways.

I partially agree with Ketuekigami, and this is not overrated, it's just that people like shinny things. If this had the graphics of the '80s, trust me nobody would care about the "meaningful dialogue", and the rating would drop 2 points.
People see things were there want to see them. A dialog can be meaningful without being boring.
But the main problem i had with this series is that it's predictable! It's all too obvious what'll happen, but they try to mess with our mind by skipping back and forth in time, making you lose track of what's happening. Some find this interesting, some find it annoying. So we get to have two kind of episodes: the really boring ones and the ones that make no sense, but you like the pretty pictures so you praise it anyway.
I'm not the one to diss inovation in films and anime, but this is overdoing it. They had a novel to base their script on, they didn't need to play Tarantino for a good series.

I agree with you 110% percent. Even though I've only seen the first movie, it tells me all I need to know about this franchise. I already gave my thoughts on that movie in the episode thread for it.

Basing an opinion of the whole franchise on only the first will give you an incredibly inaccurate view of the series as a whole. While the first movie does nothing in terms of characterization and plot, the rest of the moves more then make up for it. The first could even be seen as the studio playing with the novel to see the best that they could come up with animation wise since the first chapter had little in it plot wise anyways. Most of the viewers I've seen put 1 and 6 at the bottom with severe dissatisfaction and 5 and 7 at the top with absolute love. by the end the animation became second to everything else the series has to offer.

I'm not telling you to give it another shot if you don't feel like it, just that basing your whole opinion on the series because of the first move which was practically introduction is a little unfair to the series. It isn't impossible for a series to drastically improve between intervals, and as the first movie in a series of 7 where almost nothing of the actual plot is covered it should be offered some leeway before getting further to base an opinion as a whole.


They all make sense with the right information, but not everything is handed to you in the movies. Nasu is known for referencing himself in one way or another to his other works (not anime, original game). It isn't as good for the casual viewer as to one of his fans but I wouldn't denote the storytelling to much for that, it catches me as more of an extra for someone who can find themselves going much deeper into the wold.

I can easily see how someone wouldn't be able to get into the dialogue and denoting it for that, or may not be all the way sold with the plot by #5 (just a side note, since 7 is the continuation of 2, it finishes the story of Mikya and Shiki which is something I would suggest looking forward to). But as someone who doesn't see it in that same way, I really can't relate. You say that people see things the way they want, but as long as we both have different taste and even different views on any particular subject presented one of us may look at it more meaningful then the other.

And that's why i said it deserves it's rating. I can look at it and understand why you rate it highly, but it does have flaws and all these positive comments might give the wrong impression (i was eager to see this, and was very disappointed by it).

It's not that i don't like slow anime, i'm not a HnK die hard fan, but just look at movie 7 after Mikiya gets stabbed in the leg, it takes him 5 freaking minutes to get up the stairs. What did that add to the anime?

About the ones that make no sense, i was refering to those like nr.5, where you have no idea what's happening in the first half of the film because of the time and space jumping. Usually, after 10 minutes i would've just deleted it, but the pretty pictures kept me going.

Did i enjoy the 7 movies? Yes, but you can't call something a masterpiece just because you had fun watching it. I also enjoy B rank horror movies, but i don't rate them a 10.

That's my main beef with the series as well. The conversations can be quite good at times, and I wouldn't mind "slowness" because of that, but I don't enjoy what seems to be pointlessly dragging things out.

And especially the fifth movie was annoying. It was never really complicated at all, but just seemed so because they twisted and turned it so, which seemed rather a pointless trick.

This would be meaningful did the movies not get progressively worse. Series peaked at the third movie (which I think I gave an 8/10), and the fourth was so dreadful, it just stopped me from watching the supposedly epic fifth movie and the rest of the series.

It's not even enjoyable eye candy, like CANAAN. It's just LOLDEEP conversation after conversation. Anime like Legend of the Galactic Heroes proved endlessly that an anime can be built entirely around conversation and still be fascinating. Plus, Shiki is moe, that's irritating. I take her as seriously as I do the Hagen Daas plugs.

Shiki is moe only at like the last 5 minutes of any given movie. She may have other moments but they're drastically overshadowed by every other moment in the series.

How can you say it got progressively worse if you've only seen one movie after your impression of its supposed "peak"? Wouldn't it be more accurate to say you stopped after the fourth which was disappointing to you after the third, since doesn't the condition for it to be "progressively" worse need multiple instances of it reducing in quality?

Also, LotGH is filled with deep conversation but its usually build up which takes time, which LotGH obviously has. And It also is somewhat different since it relates directly to the plot and character development while Kara no Kyoukai is more on the philosophical side to try to make you think. They do things in a very different fashion. Whether the style of writing agrees with you will determine whether its fascinating or not.


A guess for that straight off the top of my head would be that the novel had some internal monologue at that time which might have taken a while and they wanted to keep the atmosphere. But on the other hand, If we see Koukto get stabbed straight in the leg, see him walk for a minute, then cut to him near Shiki, it doesn't play out as well in my head. The question could be less "what did it add" but more "what would have been taken away with its absence". But then again, since you were pretty disappointed by then and probably wanted it to end, it's easy to say that maybe the atmosphere could be killed in any way for you. I know that when I'm not particularly interested I start picking out "flaws", and I know that's not uncommon for a person to do.

I actually agree with your main point more then you could ever think. I find it hard for me to rate just entertaining anime high. I enjoyed Bamboo Blade, sorcerer Hunters, and ROD TV a great deal while watching but my scores on such anime would very from a 6 to 8 at best. I found Kara no Kyoukai more of a "masterpiece" (using the term loosly) then you obviously, but to each his own.

Then why do I only remember her being moe if everything else drastically overshadowed it? She's not as great as everyone thinks, and I'm all for strong female protagonists.



Because it went like this:

1. fine
2. boring
3. okay
4. crap

Wait, wait-- you just said Kara no Kyoukai is "philosophical"? Haha, all right, I'm not coming back to this thread again, clearly I'll be wasting my time. I thought someone was actually going to convince me why this was good.

Maybe because since you see that as a fault that's all you choose to remember about her. How great she is may have it's own meaning to each viewer, I like her because she IS a strong female protagonist. And I wouldn't dare start devaluing the worth of the characters on your favorites list by saying they aren't as great as you think even if our opinions were conflicting.

I've learned that convincing someone that already believes something is utter crap in their eyes is near impossible. And whether you like it or not it does have philosophical ties in its dialogue. Whether you agree with it or not doesn't change that, you only find that ridiculous because you had no interest in what the characters had to say, which isn't the fault of the anime since it's impossible to please everyone..

And you most likely didn't come here because you "thought someone was actually going to convince me why this was good", you most likely came to argue on why you thought it was was bad. If you wanted to be convinced then you would have asked more question instead of making blanket statements on how bad it was. or saying your going to leave after hearing one thing you don't agree with. Don't try to add value to your posts by saying something that isn't true.

I don't know what I can put into this debate. But I will instead give my feelings about the movies. I have seen the first 5.

For me, I find the dialog is placed in places that need it. Also the out of order timeline is appealing. The characters are presented but not forced upon you. Since they jump around, if you didn't appreciate the way the timeline move early then you have missed the beauty.

Although I do stop and admire the prettiness sometimes I find that the majority of this movie is not really eye candy, it is the story itself. You can tell especially in the first few that it has animation issues. Sometimes the backgrounds and the characters do not connect. But I think that the over feeling that it leaves it worth more then that.

I honestly find a lot of things that are rated higher in the MAL database to be quite overrated. This honestly is not one of those, it neither gets points due to moe, fighting, or slice of life. Instead I find that I appreciate the story that is told. It is part of the fun that comes from looping the stories together. I find that is what makes this a good series.

I guess that since this one has a story, and a plot, and works hard to make you appreciate it. That is deserves its place.

Perhaps this is just not the genre for you. I don't know. I thought it was going to be horror, but it turned out to be something worth for then that.

I agree with Ketuekigami, you did not come here to find out why it was good, just to complain about why it was bad. If you want to rant, please find a better place to do it. I question many high rated series but I don't dish on the people who like them. To each their own. Thank you for expressing your concern but, honestly the hatred of one will not bow many to your will.

Honestly it's a lot better if you have a bit of familiarity with and are a fan of other nasuverse stuff (as in you have read Tsukihime and/or F/SN, angel notes, etc)

This is the only anime adaptation that got it right, the Tsukihime anime pretty much butchered the original, and F/SN anime was just pretty average, and it did the least interesting route. KnK established the right atmosphere and has great production values, but like anything it's not going to appeal to everyone. I think it was really done in a way that it will appeal more to people who have read the book or are at least familiar with the setting itself, although I'm sure some can enjoy it without either.

Man, the topic's called 'Why is KnK so awesome? Can anyone explain me?', so if you want to praise it so much, you go somewhere else.

Actually, with a name like that the thread is more likely to include praise. After all, how can it be explained "Why is KnK so awesome?" without praising the positive points of the series. But if a person just wants to come in and rant on how bad it was, its still likely to happen but it doesn't really help the thread at all. The creator asked "Why do people like KnK?" not "why is KnK bad?".

I actually liked you before, but now you're just twisting the words to suit your liking.
The author of the thread clearly doesn't understand why people like this. I'm not a native english speaker and still see that, so i can only conclude you want to piss us off with your interpretation.
And we're running off-topic...

removed

Your post sounded very trollish and sarcastic so I felt like replying to. That's about it. It felt like the equivalent of "no, you" reply, if you are familiar with that.

But now that the creator has finally replied, I wouldn't mind ending it here. All are disagreements are pretty much discussed and over with.

Thread should be stickied for future users wondering what the hype of this show is about.