| And I mean, I am really surprised how badly some of the extremely popular shounen sit with me. Normally, when there’re so many fans, it is at least readable, but recently I’ve picked up several lauded series, and I just can’t. I’ve tried to start Pandora Hearts a dozen times or so, but the art is not that good, chibi panels seem out of place, and the characters don’t start as original enough to warrant attention. I’ve read about bizarre prison in Deadman Wonderland, and the gothic world reminds about D.Grayman (and many other works). Fans say that it gets better around 50th chapter or so, but for all my wish to see the manga bloom, I can’t last for two chapters. And I really tried. Then I started Owari no Seraph, but despite the prettiness, it just falls apart after the first chapter. The beginning is very strong, but then it quickly turns into a World Trigger with vampires. And again fans say that you should wait until chapter 20 or so, but isn’t it awfully long? Couldn’t stand Tokyo ESP as well. Though I like some newer stuff. Green Worldz or even Boku no Hero Academia are ok. I understand that there’s the matter of taste, but I really can’t see how these works can be seen as good. Maybe I am too old or have read too many mangas (the latter is doubtful), but I can’t suspend my disbelief at how unrefined the material that everybody seems to love looks to me. And I dislike that I can’t enjoy some of the well-known and influential titles. Very unsatisfying. -__- I dunno, I guess I just wanted to vent or to find a person with similar problem. Sorry to the offended fans, I guess. |
deadoptimist said: Then you don't actually understand there's the matter of taste.I understand that there’s the matter of taste, but I really can’t see how these works can be seen as good. |
     Short of the day: Monotonous Purgatory(MAL) ✰Public Domain Club | One Piece Club✰ |
IntroverTurtle said: deadoptimist said: Then you don't actually understand there's the matter of taste.I understand that there’s the matter of taste, but I really can’t see how these works can be seen as good. But we talk about mainstream, that's the issue. Also can't we be less one-track here? Of course, I'll live with it by assuming that there's something I haven't understood in these marvellous works of art. But as I've written as of now I have a hard time accepting that something, in which I see obvious flaws, gets universal 12/10. As many humans, I don't run solely on logic, and MAL forums are a good place to procrastinate and discuss. |
IntroverTurtle said: deadoptimist said: Then you don't actually understand there's the matter of taste.I understand that there’s the matter of taste, but I really can’t see how these works can be seen as good. It's not really a matter of taste. Just because you like it does not make it good. I like Resident Evil but it's a poorly made game. |
| Mitsu knows. My Manga list |
| It's not a matter of taste, it's the matter of bias towards mainstream and shonen. No matter how good it is you won't accept it anyways. Sad really :'( |
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| Well, you can't Like everything, right? That's all I can say. |
| I say 'go for what peaks your interest'. It looks to me that we actually share some shounen and seinen manga. So you're not a 'hater' of shounen. I can see why you may not like some of this stuff, because it might not be intense enough for you or down your realm of 'taste'. I'd rather say, to each his own. A lot of manga doesn't even get picked up by me. Some stuff just isn't good. Even if thousands of people like something, I may hate it. Like me hating 'south park' for instance. Millions of people love it, but I can't even get through two episodes. Why waste time on stuff you don't like anyways? Why not spend time on stuff you do like? |
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| You could try the Pandora Hearts anime and then go from there in the manga (it gives an alternate ending in the anime, so watch the anime ending and then start from just before then). It was a bit of a chore for me too at first but it's starting to intrigue me a little, and I've always liked certain elements of it. |
ichii_1 said: It's not a matter of taste, it's the matter of bias towards mainstream and shonen. No matter how good it is you won't accept it anyways. Sad really :'( Doesn't seem so, tbh. I read a lot of shounen, and usually I assume that something popular has its good sides... dakotasapphire said: I say 'go for what peaks your interest'. It looks to me that we actually share some shounen and seinen manga. So you're not a 'hater' of shounen. I can see why you may not like some of this stuff, because it might not be intense enough for you or down your realm of 'taste'. Well, yeah, "intense" is a good way to put it. My patience for fluff is pretty low. Also I think that I can accept a weak ark in the middle much easier than a weak beginnig. It's juat that when you see people discussing characters with much passion, and you, for some reason, can't get through the work, where these characters come from and without good reason, it's somewhat depressing. Altairius said: You could try the Pandora Hearts anime and then go from there in the manga (it gives an alternate ending in the anime, so watch the anime ending and then start from just before then). It was a bit of a chore for me too at first but it's starting to intrigue me a little, and I've always liked certain elements of it. Thanks! Maybe I should try the anime out. Sometimes the unnecessary stuff cut out does wonders. duckiwi said: i feel you a lot of shounen manga recently has been pretty week, although the premises themselves have been decent. I have a feeling Owari no Seraph will get rounded out by it's anime adaptation but I put it down after the few first chapters too. didn't really thinks of it as a shounen, though, bc of all the bishies lmao same with pandora hearts Well you're right here. Both PH and OnS seem to have BL baiting. I must say that I find these types of mangas the hardest to like - not because of the BL per se, but because of the characteristic rythm of the narrative. It's a bit hard to explain, but I recognise it very fast. It's something in the composition of the panels... |
| deadoptimist: "Well, yeah, "intense" is a good way to put it. My patience for fluff is pretty low. Also I think that I can accept a weak ark in the middle much easier than a weak beginnig. It's juat that when you see people discussing characters with much passion, and you, for some reason, can't get through the work, where these characters come from and without good reason, it's somewhat depressing." I'd agree, weak beginnings are what kill mood. Don't be depressed, if its a waste of time, its a waste of time. You don't need to be a part of people discussing their favorite characters. |
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dakotasapphire said: I'd agree, weak beginnings are what kill mood. Don't be depressed, if its a waste of time, its a waste of time. You don't need to be a part of people discussing their favorite characters. Thanks! Yeah, I guess you can't read everything even in the genre that you like. At least I know I can't. |
deadoptimist said: dakotasapphire said: I'd agree, weak beginnings are what kill mood. Don't be depressed, if its a waste of time, its a waste of time. You don't need to be a part of people discussing their favorite characters. Thanks! Yeah, I guess you can't read everything even in the genre that you like. At least I know I can't. Lol! Yes! No one probably can. |
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dakotasapphire said: Lol! Yes! No one probably can. Well, not the whole bunch, of course. >< I meant picking freely. For some reason, no matter what medium/genre I like, my preferences end up limited by my personal taste very strictly. Everybody likes and recommend me something, and yet, nope, I can't stand it at all, and get in arguments all the time (also can't get references). -_-' |
| Quite the opposite for me really, a lot of shounen manga really catch my attention during the beginning, and quality starts to drop from there. |
deadoptimist said: dakotasapphire said: Lol! Yes! No one probably can. Well, not the whole bunch, of course. >< I meant picking freely. For some reason, no matter what medium/genre I like, my preferences end up limited by my personal taste very strictly. Everybody likes and recommend me something, and yet, nope, I can't stand it at all, and get in arguments all the time (also can't get references). -_-' Unfortunately we're all limited to our tastes. >_o ahhh! Well, what are your preferences? |
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Rouzhan said: Quite the opposite for me really, a lot of shounen manga really catch my attention during the beginning, and quality starts to drop from there. Yeah, happens too, though I can't remember when it was the last time I thought the beginning was very strong. Can rememeber all too well when an okeyish manga fell apart after several chapters though. dakotasapphire said: Unfortunately we're all limited to our tastes. >_o ahhh! Well, what are your preferences? True. Though I often pick in interest in something that I never thought I would like, and it's not entirely comfortable, since you both don't mean to go any further in the genre or medium and can't talk about it with the people you normally talk to. Though it probably happens to everyone. I've had a few experiences like that lately, that's all. Normally I like psychological stuff, especially darkish seinen, preferrably without excessive angst. Though I respect good adventure stories, so shounen is fine too. And lately I've been reading manga for female demographics out of interest. I don't like the usual stuff - echhi, harems, lilicon and shipping fuel. Other than that I decide individually. But since I've read some amount of mangas, I've become tired of cliches and an author wasting my time. |
deadoptimist said: It's not an action series, but if you don't mind, read this manga called Omoide Emanon, I'd say it's fresh enough.But since I've read some amount of mangas, I've become tired of cliches and an author wasting my time. |
| Honobono Log - best slice of life short -------------------------------------------- most kawaii loli overlord ---------------------------- Donquixote Doflamingo AMV - Control |
ToG25thBaam said: deadoptimist said: It's not an action series, but if you don't mind, read this manga called Omoide Emanon, I'd say it's fresh enough.But since I've read some amount of mangas, I've become tired of cliches and an author wasting my time. Thank you! I think I've read it or I've started it at least (can't remember). I can't say that I am a big fan of ages spanning kind of stories, but I guess I should go back to it for another try/reread. Damn, it's so sad that Kotonoha is inactive now. Their taste in manga was perfect. |
deadoptimist said: Rouzhan said: Quite the opposite for me really, a lot of shounen manga really catch my attention during the beginning, and quality starts to drop from there. Yeah, happens too, though I can't remember when it was the last time I thought the beginning was very strong. Can rememeber all too well when an okeyish manga fell apart after several chapters though. dakotasapphire said: Unfortunately we're all limited to our tastes. >_o ahhh! Well, what are your preferences? True. Though I often pick in interest in something that I never thought I would like, and it's not entirely comfortable, since you both don't mean to go any further in the genre or medium and can't talk about it with the people you normally talk to. Though it probably happens to everyone. I've had a few experiences like that lately, that's all. Normally I like psychological stuff, especially darkish seinen, preferrably without excessive angst. Though I respect good adventure stories, so shounen is fine too. And lately I've been reading manga for female demographics out of interest. I don't like the usual stuff - echhi, harems, lilicon and shipping fuel. Other than that I decide individually. But since I've read some amount of mangas, I've become tired of cliches and an author wasting my time. I'm totally into the same stuff. Shounen can be psychological (but rarely is). I'm a girl so I like shoujo and josei somewhat too. |
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dakotasapphire said: I'm totally into the same stuff. Shounen can be psychological (but rarely is). I'm a girl so I like shoujo and josei somewhat too. Whoa, then I am lucky - I gotta go check your list. ~_^ I think that good shounen usually has something for older audience as well - some characters, flashback stories, hints on deeper problems. The same way better stories for kids and teenagers can also open from another side for adults. Sadly, not all works get this far. |
deadoptimist said: dakotasapphire said: I'm totally into the same stuff. Shounen can be psychological (but rarely is). I'm a girl so I like shoujo and josei somewhat too. Whoa, then I am lucky - I gotta go check your list. ~_^ I think that good shounen usually has something for older audience as well - some characters, flashback stories, hints on deeper problems. The same way better stories for kids and teenagers can also open from another side for adults. Sadly, not all works get this far. I would definitely agree. And I haven't read a TON of manga unfortunately. Maybe a couple really long ones. |
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Dragon88 said: Funny thing is the ones that you listed, I don't consider as popular shounen. To me popular shounen are mangas like One Piece, Naruto, Bleach, Fairy Tail, Toriko, AOT, DB, Yu Yu Hakusho, Rurouni Kenshin, FMA, HxH. If you don't like almost all of them then you can say that you don't like popular shounen. The ones you listed are not really that popular. I never even tried them out. Well, of course there're the big three, and in general shounen is associated mostly with similar action stories. But on the other hand, Pandora Hearts has a ton of fans (just look at the review section) and it is definitely shounen. Maybe these works are not defining the popular perception of the demographic, but I'd say that they are an important part. Btw, my emphasis was not on shounen in general, more on the popularity (big active fandoms) and the fact that the stories are aimed at teens. As for my experience with shounen - I've read big chunks of Naruto, Bleach and FMA. I couldn't get into Kenshin, Fairy Tail or One Piece, though I tried reading them.The art of AOT is too bad for my taste. And I plan to get to reading HxH one day. But I also read some 500 chapters of Inuyasha and I like Kekkaishi and Ao no Exorcist, which are pretty close to this type... It's not that I have prejudice against shounen. But I've tried many titles, so I am also desperate in a sense, I guess. |
deadoptimistApr 28, 2015 12:11 PM
Dragon88 said: Funny thing is the ones that you listed, I don't consider as popular shounen. The ones you listed are not really that popular. I never even tried them out. Just cos you haven't read them, doesn't mean they aren't popular, by that logic, none of what you listed is popular. I mean, I haven't read them, so how could they be? |
| Mitsu knows. My Manga list |
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