Plot holes/asspulls and/or misconceptions thread Spoilers till the last chapter

Mar 3, 2015 7:15 AM

Offline

Dec 2012

24356

So, since I like this type of discussion, being less opinion based an all, and has a higher chance of civil discourse, I thought I would make a general thread regarding it. I realize that it's unlikely it will get many replies, since the manga is over, but I felt like getting some plot hole misconceptions off my chest.

So let's get to it. But first, the definition of the word:

A plot hole, or plothole is a gap or inconsistency in a storyline that creates a paradox in the story that cannot be reconciled with any explanation. These include such things as illogical or impossible events, and statements or events that contradict earlier events in the storyline. Plot holes have been defined as "...contradictions in a screenplay...[which] can both be mentioned on paper or implied by the premise and universe of the screenplay

[size=120][b][i]Sasuke Great Snake Escape[/size][/b][/i]:

Refutation:

[size=120][b]Kakashi should be blind, due to using MS multiple times[/size][/b]

Refutation

[size=120][b]How did Madara use Susanoo without an eye[/size][/b]

Answer

[size=120][b]Minato using summoning jutsu when he didn't have an arm[/size][/b]

[size=120][b]General confusion about Orochimaru and The four Hokage Edo Tensi[/size][/b]

[size=120][b]General things about Naruto sage of six path, Naruto flying, healing, etc[/size][/b]:

[size=120]Rinne Tensei[/size]

[size=120]Why is Madara reanimated to his prime/Young age when he died old[/size]

[size=120]Why is Madara able to use Kamui while Obito couldn't in the Juubi form[/size]

[size=120]Fate of the Tailed Beast after the host dies[/size]

Well, that's the most common ones from what I remember.

So list the plot holes you think the series has. You can list asspulls as well:

An Ass Pull is a moment when the writers pull something out of thin air in a less-than-graceful narrative development, violating the Law of Conservation of Detail by dropping a plot-critical detail in the middle, or near the end of their narrative without Foreshadowing

So hopefully this will be a civil thread, tho it will probably be inactive anyway >.>
no regret

tsudecimoApr 1, 2015 7:46 AM

Mar 3, 2015 9:15 AM

tsudecimo

Offline

Dec 2012

24356

Forgetfulness said:
Well since you wanted me to post it here and I don't see it in the titles (?)

how does

I've read two plausible theories regarding the whole situation.

Aloxamax said:
Luckily the mangastream version is up, having read that, the only thing that lacks an explanation is Kakashi managing to use a final Susanoo.

Obito talking with Kakashi: one thing that can be said is that as long as one's chakra remains in the physical world, the owner of said chakra has some form of control over it even if they already died. Examples of this are the Sage of the six paths and his children. Hagoromo was able to give away his own chakra to Naruto and Sasuke and also use Madara's lower half to appear in front of the Hokage.

His sons, even after dying, still had some control over their chakra that lingered, after all Hagoromo said that Ashura had chosen Naruto to reincarnate.

Obito even said something along those lines in this very chapter: "Chakra is the power that connects these two worlds."

And of course, something we've known for a very long time is that:

Chakra is a mix of spiritual and physical energies (older, better known version)
Chakra is the power used by Shinobi to mix their inner spiritual and physical energies (newer version introduced in chapter 665)

The way it is shown in this chapter, Obito gave all of his chakra to Kakashi.

Kakashi obtaining Sharingan: Nagato was the one who did this before. When he was still alive he was the only Rinnegan user in the world yet he could use techniques exclusive to the Rinnegan through dead bodies by simply having his chakra run through them. Something that came with this was the dead bodies, his paths, all having the Rinnegan.

If Obito's chakra is running through Kakashi I don't see why Kakashi couldn't use the Sharingan.

MoeGod said:

Well I'm just gonna put his theories in here:

"First of all Kakashi using the Sharingan is obviously because of the Obito's Uchiha chakra. But how?Remember back in chapter 619, Tobirama explained that the Uchiha's special chakra effects the Optic nerve and that is how they awaken the Sharingan. In this case Obito's chakra obviously effected Kakashi's optic nerve and that is how he has the Mangekyo. What about stabilised Susanoo? The manga NEVER EVER mentions that you need Eternal Mangekyo to use stabilised/perfect Susanoo (i did research). So, you can either argue for or against in this case. I'm probably guessing this but i think it's because Obito once had the Rinnegan and his Susanoo being stabilised kind of make sense. Another thing you may be asking yourself is: shouldn't his soul/moving be moving to the next life after the body is destroyed? how is he controlling it? Yes if you the person wants to and no if they don't (but this is temporary as it was said before and in this chapter, 688). This soul/chakra thing being controlled before it leaves the body was established when the Edo tensei was released, remember? Madara was able to control his chakra/soul before it left the body and also Danny phantom, i mean Dan (Tsunade's lover) was able to control his chakra and use jutsu to fly to Tsunade to save her and give her some of his chakra.

References: chapter 591 and chapter 619"

I actually checked it and true enough Dan and Madara willed themselves to linger just for a moment. In Dan's case he was using a jutsu (and eventually gave Tsunade his chakra, which I assume is how Kakashi became reinvigorated after receiving what's left of Obito's). In Madara's case he used a jutsu to overwrite the Edo Tensei after his body already crumbled. There was also Kakashi who despite losing all of his chakra against Pain also lingered and eventually willed himself back to life despite being technically dead.

Mar 5, 2015 6:21 AM

dontbelieveit

Offline

Feb 2015

dontbelieveit said:

What happened with Bee around the end of this series? I remember tailed beast getting sucked out from him and Naruto but all the people only seemed to care about Naruto. Shouldn't Bee have died? Please explain this. My memory with the last 100 chapters of naruto is vague(since I got really bored of it and wasn't enjoying) so I'd really appreciate if you point out what I missed.

Also, these are the ones I've read somewhere and am not sure.
Sorry if they may not be plot holes but I'd like if you can explain these anyway.
2-Why did Madara get Edo-Tensei-ed in his prime, as a young man if he died as an old person?
3-Madara wasn't able to move without the Grand Mazou, how did he control the Anbu to kidnap Rin?
4-Madara was able to absorb Sasuke's Amaterasu without eyes. Is it a case similar to Susanno one? (where the user just needs eyes for awakening his/her powers)
5-Was it Obito/Zetsu who planted Rinnegan in Nagato's eyes? (since Madara could not move due to being attached to GM)

Mar 5, 2015 7:25 AM

tsudecimo

Offline

Dec 2012

24356

Bee was shown to have survived by using the chakra of Hachibee's previously severed tail, that was cut by him, when Hachiibee was being dragged into the statue by Madara.

Then he was put into Infinite Tskyuomi like everybody else except Team 7 and the Edo kages.

2-Why did Madara get Edo-Tensei-ed in his prime, as a young man if he died as an old person?

It was explained in the exact chapter Madara was revealed. That Kabuto made him special, and engineered him in a specific way, according to the tablet of the Uchiha.

https://i.imgur.com/acYbiTI.png
http://i.imgur.com/07JDLEU.png

And we are later shown, that even knew about Harishama's cells, and planted them into Madara's Edo Tensi Body.

3-Madara wasn't able to move without the Grand Mazou, how did he control the Anbu to kidnap Rin?

A lot of Scenarios can be drawn from this. He had the help of the zetsu's. They for example, could have kindnaped one of them, and brought him to Madara to cast the Genjutsu.

4-Madara was able to absorb Sasuke's Amaterasu without eyes. Is it a case similar to Susanno one? (where the user just needs eyes for awakening his/her powers)

No, I don't think he can use Petra's path without the Rinnegan. Most of the amaterasu was on his armor which he dropped. The part of his body that were caught, could have been healed by Harishama's cells regenerative powers.

5-Was it Obito/Zetsu who planted Rinnegan in Nagato's eyes? (since Madara could not move due to being attached to GM)

Yes, Zetsu is the one who planted the eyes on Nagato. In the beginning of chapter 602, where Madara first meets Obito, he only has one Sharingan.

Mar 8, 2015 5:45 AM

tsudecimo

Offline

Dec 2012

24356

Opening post updated.

Mar 9, 2015 11:07 PM

Confucius

Offline

May 2010

8122

Tobi's identity is Obito. Add that to the list lol

Even when I was in crowd, I was always alone

Mar 10, 2015 12:36 AM

tsudecimo

Offline

Dec 2012

24356

Confucius said:
Tobi's identity is Obito. Add that to the list lol

Hahaha.

No.

Mar 12, 2015 4:49 PM

Confucius

Offline

May 2010

8122

tsudecimo said:

Confucius said:
Tobi's identity is Obito. Add that to the list lol

Hahaha.

No.

How about this? How many people died in this war? One - Neji.

Even when I was in crowd, I was always alone

Mar 13, 2015 10:08 AM

StevenHu

Offline

Aug 2013

1929

Confucius said:

tsudecimo said:

Hahaha.

No.

How about this? How many people died in this war? One - Neji.

Answer: Thousands of fodder ninja.

Mar 13, 2015 4:21 PM

#10

HominiLupus

Offline

Aug 2013

207

Well, just found this topic, and I got to say most of your arguments are pretty logic, so I wanted to add my coments.

1. I guess all of what you said makes sense but it only covers the chakra part and only because there is no sure way to know how much chakra he had left. My issue with the Great Escape is how he did it in a fraction of second. The only posssible way was if he somehow summoned Manda under genjutsu and in a way that he would get instantly inside him.

2. He woulld get effects similar to blindness eventually, but those didn't seem to be permanent. Should be linked to the fatigue. This one is Ok.

3. I was skeptical at first but I ended up accepting it. It's a bit like how Tobi could use Kamui with just the Sharingan.

4. Is it serious that some people didn't get this one right from the start?

5. This one is the one I just can't accept. There is a reason for the Shiki Fuujin to be the ultimate sealing technique. It wasn't supposed to be a revrsible seal. And I wonder what the tablet has to do with the Shinigami, it wasn't supposed to be anything but and encoded message (that was even modified by Zetsu). Also the biggest asspull in this whole thing IMO is that there was SIX Zetsus inside Sasuke. Conveniently the number that was needed for the ritual, plus one for Orochimaru and an spare just for it to soud less suspect.

6. Nothing can be said here except the fact that Naruto obtained the power a fell seconds before that and had instant mastery over it. Also doesn't explain how Guy survived with those third degree burns, massive exaustion and pain. And even then Naruto's power served nothing but to diminish Guy's epic sacrifice.

7. I guess Kishimoto had it planed from the start but still it was a bit of a fail, from how the fans reacted.

8. This one was barelly unoticeable i guess.

Well, I guess I should add the ones I think deserved better foreshadowing/explanation.

1. How could Orochimaru come back to life from Anko's seal? And how was he aware of everything happening around him when he came out?

2. Zetsu's Aizenpull (and while we're in it Madara ones too before Zetsu). In truth everything Zetsu said or did after he backstabed Madadra.

3. Why didn't use the Byakugan to i's full potential while fighting Naruto and Sasuke? It's okay that she wasn't really much of a fighter but she had it activated all the time yet couldn't see others aproaching from different directions like when Sakura was coming and she didn't notice when she punched her. Or how did she fell for a sexy jutsu if the byakugan isn't supposed to show anything except the chakra pathway.

4. Madara's (and Zetsu's?) ability to extract and absorb bijuus without a proper sealing ritual.

5. Don't know about you but the Zetsu being people that got caught into the infinity tskuyomi was a bit of this to me, even thought it din't have much impact in the series as a whole.

I guess those are the ones I can remember now. Notice how they're all from the last 100 or so chapters, I don't have that great of a memmory after all. Anyway I liked this topic, too bad it was made after the series finished so there's not much people to debate it.

Mar 24, 2015 11:31 AM

#11

tsudecimo

Offline

Dec 2012

24356

HominiLupus said:

1. I guess all of what you said makes sense but it only covers the chakra part and only because there is no sure way to know how much chakra he had left. My issue with the Great Escape is how he did it in a fraction of second. The only posssible way was if he somehow summoned Manda under genjutsu and in a way that he would get instantly inside him.

Hmmm. Check my posts here, and the one above it, about Deidara using the Earth Hand seal extremely quickly. That answers your issue with the hand seals, and it's timing.

He did have Manda under genjutsu, it was implied by Sugitsu.

2. He woulld get effects similar to blindness eventually, but those didn't seem to be permanent. Should be linked to the fatigue. This one is Ok.

He wouldn't. The only side effect was fatigue and chakra drainage, which led Kakashi to his death once.

3. I was skeptical at first but I ended up accepting it. It's a bit like how Tobi could use Kamui with just the Sharingan.

I don't really remember Tobi using Kamui, without his Mangekyo.

4. Is it serious that some people didn't get this one right from the start?

Lol. Well, I found two people, who thought it was a plot hole, in a thread, so I figured why not add it.

5. This one is the one I just can't accept. There is a reason for the Shiki Fuujin to be the ultimate sealing technique. It wasn't supposed to be a revrsible seal. And I wonder what the tablet has to do with the Shinigami, it wasn't supposed to be anything but and encoded message (that was even modified by Zetsu). Also the biggest asspull in this whole thing IMO is that there was SIX Zetsus inside Sasuke. Conveniently the number that was needed for the ritual, plus one for Orochimaru and an spare just for it to soud less suspect.

Umm no. When the sealing happened, you can clearly see the souls going through his mouth to his stomach, it was never once said it wasn't reversable, and Orochimaru hinted at a way, to get his hands back. Hmm, I'm not sure what you mean by the tablet and Shinagami.

Not really, that was just plot convenience. They could have just used people from the village if they wanted to, but the author decided to have that instead, because at the time, Sasuke was going through a change for the better, so killing innocent people, would stain that transition and change.

6. Nothing can be said here except the fact that Naruto obtained the power a fell seconds before that and had instant mastery over it. Also doesn't explain how Guy survived with those third degree burns, massive exaustion and pain. And even then Naruto's power served nothing but to diminish Guy's epic sacrifice.

What is there to master? it just gave him specific abilities, and he is already accustomed to using a tailed beast chakra. It literally gave him life, third degree burns can be easily healed with normal Medical Ninjutsu, it was the issue of life power, that made the eight gates certain death.

Well that's not really relevant, but I disagree, I think saving Gai was the correct choice by the author.

7. I guess Kishimoto had it planed from the start but still it was a bit of a fail, from how the fans reacted.

What fans though?

Western online community is not an accurate or significant indication of reception. They don't really matter.

I, for one, really liked that, for several reasons, as it carried a significant and relevant message to Naruto and Nagato meeting.

1. How could Orochimaru come back to life from Anko's seal? And how was he aware of everything happening around him when he came out?

He explained it himself, in the same chapter when it happened.

Chapter 585 -586

2. Zetsu's Aizenpull (and while we're in it Madara ones too before Zetsu). In truth everything Zetsu said or did after he backstabed Madadra.

Well that revelation was quite convoluted, so I blocked it from my memory LOL.

For what it's worth, there are two hints about Zetsu. There him appearing at the end of Naruto vs Sasuke fight, which might haven't meant much at the time, but in hind sight after the revelation, it does mean more than that.

The other was also during Madara vs Harishama.

https://i.imgur.com/psXtjBO.jpg

Relevant to both the incarnations of the sons of the Sage. I know it's not much, but I thought I would point it out, anyway.

3. Why didn't use the Byakugan to i's full potential while fighting Naruto and Sasuke? It's okay that she wasn't really much of a fighter but she had it activated all the time yet couldn't see others aproaching from different directions like when Sakura was coming and she didn't notice when she punched her. Or how did she fell for a sexy jutsu if the byakugan isn't supposed to show anything except the chakra pathway.

Hmmm, I don't really know, there are a lot of things Kagyua didn't use, she mainly relied on her dimensions. Sakura might have came from her blind Spot? and she was also busy trying to get away from the seals, so she didn't see Sakura coming.

Umm no, it can see the chakra pathways, but doesn't mean that she doesn't see the outter/physical shapes of things.

4. Madara's (and Zetsu's?) ability to extract and absorb bijuus without a proper sealing ritual

There is no need for a sealing ritual, The Tailed Beasts were in their natural state, not inside someone.

Madara specifically said to Naruto, that him using the Kyuubi's chakra with his tailed beasts forms, helped him absorb Kyuubi faster.

I guess those are the ones I can remember now. Notice how they're all from the last 100 or so chapters, I don't have that great of a memmory after all. Anyway I liked this topic, too bad it was made after the series finished so there's not much people to debate it.

Well be sure to bring up other points if you remember.

Yeah I know, but on the bright side, more active posts, might have lead to un-civil posts, spams, and trolling.

tsudecimoMar 24, 2015 11:42 AM

Mar 25, 2015 10:42 AM

#12

tsudecimo

Offline

Dec 2012

24356

Opening post updated and bump!

Mar 27, 2015 4:48 AM

#13

Nuvi

Offline

Oct 2013

1753

Great thread, keep up the good work. It answered few things which irked (though not really much) me back when I was reading the manga weekly. There are still a few things I don't remember so I can't say anything about that. Anyways, thanks for the hardwork.

Mar 29, 2015 1:09 PM

#14

tsudecimo

Offline

Dec 2012

24356

Nuvi said:
Great thread, keep up the good work. It answered few things which irked (though not really much) me back when I was reading the manga weekly. There are still a few things I don't remember so I can't say anything about that. Anyways, thanks for the hardwork.

Thanks man. Be sure, to post them, if you do remember.

Mar 29, 2015 1:10 PM

#15

ichii_1

Offline

Sep 2013

22818

Forgetfulness said:
Hm, this might be really obvious but I'm just going to ask anyway to make sure

How did Obito survive? I think the manga chapter said that he "slipped through the rocks" or something as if he had Kamui, although I'm fairly certain that's one of his MS abilities and he didn't have that at the time...

No he phased through the rocks, but how could he do that if it was a regular sharigan?

Mar 29, 2015 1:12 PM

#16

tsudecimo

Offline

Dec 2012

24356

tsudecimo said:

I answered the same question here

It's just plot convenience ''a miracle you survived''.

Apr 1, 2015 7:46 AM

#17

tsudecimo

Offline

Dec 2012

24356

Opening post updated!

Apr 1, 2015 9:31 AM

#18

Eylandos

Offline

Jan 2015

754

New Naruto manga picture

April Fools :D

Signature removed. Please follow the signature rules, as defined in the Site & Forum Guidelines.

May 5, 2015 2:23 PM

#19

Andfiker

Offline

May 2015

Here's one that needs an answer:Naruto's clone using shadow clones when he met Madara initially! That seemed like a ridiculous plot hole, and it seems like the author is trying to fix that in the Naruto Boruto series by showing Naruto's clone about to do Multi-Shadow Clone jutsu against his son.

May 5, 2015 2:55 PM

#20

Isterio

Offline

Oct 2013

4275

Andfiker said:
Here's one that needs an answer:Naruto's clone using shadow clones when he met Madara initially! That seemed like a ridiculous plot hole, and it seems like the author is trying to fix that in the Naruto Boruto series by showing Naruto's clone about to do Multi-Shadow Clone jutsu against his son.

Not a plothole since it´s never stated if "shadow clones"can do this or not.
What´s clear is that it splitts the clones chakra even further, therefore the new versions are even weaker.
It´s stated that they are individual beings, even capable of thinking independant, by mirroring the main body and even mold chakra, Rasengan works based on that.
If you see a regular clone do this then yes, that´d be one.

Kage Bunshin is basicly the pinacle of clone jutsu, with the excepion of Mu´s ability which is more akin to Mitosis.

May 21, 2015 2:52 AM

#21

CaskoSuteki

Offline

May 2015

There is a plot point I'm confused by. It is mentioned in the manga that Guy and Lee and similar because they are both unable to use ninjutsu and Guy's flashback to his past clearly states that he can't use ninjutsu or genjutsu. However, he is shown using Kuchiyose no Jutsu twice in the series. Is this just a mistake in the translation of the manga I read or would this be a plot hole?

May 21, 2015 2:57 AM

#22

tsudecimo

Offline

Dec 2012

24356

CaskoSuteki said:
There is a plot point I'm confused by. It is mentioned in the manga that Guy and Lee and similar because they are both unable to use ninjutsu and Guy's flashback to his past clearly states that he can't use ninjutsu or genjutsu. However, he is shown using Kuchiyose no Jutsu twice in the series. Is this just a mistake in the translation of the manga I read or would this be a plot hole?

They are similar because Gai has difficulties doing basic jutsus, he is not 100% unable to do ninjutsu. He is able to summon the turtle, and I believe he was once able to dispel a genjutsu.

I don't think the manga directly states that Gai is unable to do ninjutsu, it just states that he is like Lee, they both excel greatly in Taijutsu, but fail short in other Ninjutsu, Gai being older than Lee, and more experienced is able to perform small ninjutsu that Lee wasn't shown to be able to.

May 23, 2015 10:55 AM

#23

Drunk_Samurai

Offline

Aug 2007

7550

tsudecimo said:

It did in Gai's flashback but apparently that was a mistranslation.

Jun 24, 2015 4:03 PM

#24

tsudecimo

Offline

Dec 2012

24356

bump, if someone has any input.

Sep 22, 2016 1:26 PM

#25

Sereneflower

Offline

Jun 2016

165

tsudecimo said:
bump, if someone has any input.

Thank you for the thread!! I like how you explained everything! I hate when people call something a plothole so easily in Naruto

Sep 22, 2016 2:13 PM

#26

Zura_Orokamono

Offline

Jan 2015

211

I have a couple of questions:
1.How come Naruto could save Guy but not Obito, in the last arc?
2.Why did Orochimaru go after Tsunade to heal his arms instead of just going to grab the Shinigami Mask?

Zura_OrokamonoSep 22, 2016 2:21 PM

Sep 23, 2016 1:58 AM

#27

Isterio

Offline

Oct 2013

4275

SML619Luci said:
I have a couple of questions:
1.How come Naruto could save Guy but not Obito, in the last arc?
2.Why did Orochimaru go after Tsunade to heal his arms instead of just going to grab the Shinigami Mask?

1. Shounen convenience, different circumstances of death. Guy was dying to self inflicted damage through the 8 Gates Obito through Biju extraction, which Naruto did slow down.
2. He only learned about the Shrine after his research, meaning it must have happened somewhere along the timeskip. At the time he wanted Sasuke as a vessel, probably to dip into the Sage powers since Kabuto later explained how they knew more than they let on.

Sep 23, 2016 5:18 AM

#28

tsudecimo

Offline

Dec 2012

24356

Obito life force was already drained and he technically was already dead. Naruto was only able to slow it down, before Obito turned to dust. In Guy's case there was a little flame remaining and Naruto ignited that in a sense.

In order to get into that shrine, he has to have a sharinigan. If you remember he only got in because the hidden thing reacted to Sasuke's eyes.
http://i.imgur.com/ANHNxVD.jpg

Sep 30, 2016 2:08 PM

#29

Citruswarrior

Offline

Oct 2015

How could Madara use Obitos Eye seconds after he put it in his head without any healing when Sausuke had to wait a couple of days with Itachis?

How could Naruto restore Kakashis eye without medical knowledge,with Guy it was something else, he restored his chakra flame and Naruto has knowlegde about chakra and chakraflow trough his link with kurama and his senjutsu training but i doubt he knew how a human eye works and about its construction?

How could Kakashi and Obito move in the super heavy dimension when Kagura and Naruto, which could fly, couldnt?

Sep 30, 2016 3:26 PM

#30

Isterio

Offline

Oct 2013

4275

Citruswarrior said:
How could Madara use Obitos Eye seconds after he put it in his head without any healing when Sausuke had to wait a couple of days with Itachis?

How could Naruto restore Kakashis eye without medical knowledge,with Guy it was something else, he restored his chakra flame and Naruto has knowlegde about chakra and chakraflow trough his link with kurama and his senjutsu training but i doubt he knew how a human eye works and about its construction?

How could Kakashi and Obito move in the super heavy dimension when Kagura and Naruto, which could fly, couldnt?

Although that´s nitpicking there are answers available, even to that.
The first situation although similar in nature wasn´t the same, one case were Brothers (Itachis) Sharingan for Sasuke, the other Rinnegan (his own) for Madara. Considering the fact that Madara was a walking hax who could apply exceptions to basicly any rule due to being virtually a god it´s not a far stretch for him to pull a stunt like this off.

The eye was a part of the Sage powers that were escribed in legends. Basicly the ability to create anything out of imagination.

Kakshi and Obito walking wasn´t anything special. Every character could after getting used to the atmosphere. It´s the Shounen clich of the "new environment". One Piece utilized that excuse during Skypea to make the Strawhats lose a fight against Viper a fairly weak foe.

Sep 30, 2016 5:04 PM

#31

Citruswarrior

Offline

Oct 2015

Isterio said:

Ah sorry didnt make that clear, i was talking about Obitos original eye which Madara took from Kakashi.
To say that Madara is godlike is as easy as for the fairy tail members to say "of course because she is Erza" and i think that it is far easier to get to thin air than to high gravity which pushs you to the ground.

Sep 30, 2016 6:20 PM

#32

Isterio

Offline

Oct 2013

4275

Citruswarrior said:

Ah sorry didnt make that clear, i was talking about Obitos original eye which Madara took from Kakashi.
To say that Madara is godlike is as easy as for the fairy tail members to say "of course because she is Erza" and i think that it is far easier to get to thin air than to high gravity which pushs you to the ground.

For the first one, no because there is a rule in writing every Shounen is guilty of igonring. It goes as follows. "Any form of fiction is never allowed to use convenience to get a character out of trouble, convenience is a tool to get characters into trouble". You probably already noticed but you rarely hear people complain about overpowered villains or let´s say Anti Heros like Alucard.
A villain becoming tougher to deal with creates obstacles for the main characters, it makes a story suspensful. On the other hand making your hero, overpowered makes a story boring and predictable. The excpetion to that rule is mostly comedy specifically parody in that regard as comic characters like Deadpool or Saitama have proven. Your comparision is especially weak as Madara reached an age of over 100 years and due to his ability to cultivate (through bullshit science that boils down to because magic) cloned tissue of his former rival we are given insight on the fact that he was knowledgeable with medical treatment.

This and the fact that he was revered as a godlike entity throughout the story make it more understandable when he pulls move like this.
Just look at other characters of similar nature that are "scientists" Orochimaru, Mayuri or Urahara from Bleach, Dr. Vegapunk in One Piece, Hohenheim in Fullmetal Alchemist (insert old Shounen master here). Erza on the other hand never had any buildup or even an explanation given as to why she is capable of beating the odds and she is a good guy.

As for the "we couldn´t breat that air excuse" it´s both equally Shounen bullshit.
Just excuses to move the plot forward in the direction the author wanted.
There are several examples of this in any Shounen that requires certain characters to stall. The dimensions in Naruto One Piece has every arc such a bs moment, and even Bleach with the epic "SHUNSUI DON´T USE YOUR BANKAI HERE "moment.

If you dissect them, every Shounen including HXH is objectively really poorly written. Even judged by their own rules, which all of them break on occasion. What makes them enjoyable is the fact that people are willing to overlook those flaws for the sake of the characters and journey´s they want to follow.

IsterioSep 30, 2016 6:28 PM

See All Discussions

Poll: » Naruto Chapter 342 Discussion kittykun2011 - Nov 8, 2008	5	by Chfenj_ »» Apr 13, 9:54 AM
Poll: » Naruto Chapter 244 Discussion Thystrix - Mar 20, 2016	6	by Chfenj_ »» Mar 30, 9:34 AM
Poll: » Naruto Chapter 649 Discussion ( 1 2 ) Blaine - Oct 2, 2013	74	by actuallytom »» Mar 29, 12:14 PM
Poll: » Naruto Chapter 97 Discussion jeanfarias - Aug 7, 2012	5	by MissDoublefinger »» Mar 13, 6:52 AM
Poll: » Naruto Chapter 87 Discussion jeanfarias - Jul 4, 2012	5	by MissDoublefinger »» Mar 12, 7:10 AM

Plot holes/asspulls and/or misconceptions thread Spoilers till the last chapter

More topics from this board

Poll: » Naruto Chapter 342 Discussion

Poll: » Naruto Chapter 244 Discussion

Poll: » Naruto Chapter 649 Discussion ( 1 2 )

Poll: » Naruto Chapter 97 Discussion

Poll: » Naruto Chapter 87 Discussion

MoreTop Anime

MoreTop Airing Anime

MoreMost Popular Characters

Plot holes/asspulls and/or misconceptions thread *Spoilers till the last chapter*

More topics from this board

Poll: » Naruto Chapter 342 Discussion

Poll: » Naruto Chapter 244 Discussion

Poll: » Naruto Chapter 649 Discussion ( 1 2 )

Poll: » Naruto Chapter 97 Discussion

Poll: » Naruto Chapter 87 Discussion

MoreTop Anime

MoreTop Airing Anime

MoreMost Popular Characters

Plot holes/asspulls and/or misconceptions thread Spoilers till the last chapter