Feb 16, 2009 10:08 AM
Trolls and Discussion Threads
People really seem to want to make me into this ridiculous troll that hates anime in the discussion forums, so I thought that I would make this blog to vent a little bit. First of all, let me say that I have really been avoiding making a blog on this site because then I would feel obliged to write something on a regular basis, so I guess we'll all just see where this goes.
To all the denizens of MAL: Everyone does not have to agree with you. Everyone does not have to have the same values that you have when watching a show. Everyone does not have to watch a show for the same reasons as you. So rather than ask inane questions like: "Why don't you drop _____?" or making childish blanket statements like, "You never _______," why don't you try to engage others in their viewpoints and start a real discussion? Why is it so hard on the internets for people to be civil? Yes, I understand that anonymity can afford us a lot of solace in the absolute douchebaggiest of behavior, but really, why jump into a discussion when the first thing that you want to do is make snide remarks about someone who thinks differently than you?
To be clear, I don't hate anime. I love anime, otherwise, why the hell would I be on this site? As I have stated in the little about me blurb in my profile, I hold anime to the same standards as film and television. I'm not going to make excuses for a show because "It's a harem, what more do you want?" or "This is a shounen, it's not going to be that deep." I think by now we have all witnessed great amounts of anime in any genre that goes above and beyond the call of what is expected in its own grouping, so that way of thinking just won't fly with me. As I have stated before in many discussions: Is it wrong to want to understand a characters motives? Is it wrong to not take certain characters at face value? Is it wrong to admit that I am not an emotionally unstable 13 year old girl having her first period, and therefore just because a "pretty" girl dies onscreen, I have to cry?
No. It isn't wrong. Writers should strive for depth in characters and logical plot no matter who the target demographic is. Unfortunately "otaku" masses are dumb enough to devour any "moe" character that has big boobs, a short skirt, and dumb eyes. Those of you who are fine with having your vapid, nonsensical anime should shut your mouth when someone calls into question what's going on. You like it, that's fine, but don't pretend it's something super meaningful. Moreover, don't defend it by saying "It's just a comedy" or whatever. The plain facts are that good characters make a comedy or a drama. If you respond to the same gags over and over in any and every show you watch, that's one thing, but don't pretend like having good characters is only for drama.
I like to talk about what's going on in a show. Sometimes I honestly might have missed things out of boredom or whatnot, or have forgotten something that has long since passed. I put my thoughts in the discussion threads to incite discussion. Do I have a slightly agressive or critical tone? Yes, but a) that's just the way I am and b) that's what gets people's attention. What I hate most is when the threads become this circle jerk of "OMG I cried so hard," "ROFL, Mariya ftw," or "Awesome episode is awesome" for 10 pages. It defeats the purpose for the thread in my mind.
Honestly, the only massive discussion thread that gets it right (out of everything I'm watching) is Toradora. People argue, make charts, conjecture, and support their arguments with facts for the most part. Sure there are some delusional people in there that refuse take things at face value, but they either own up to it, or quickly get shot down/muted in the face of real discussion.
A lot of other threads get it right, but they are so small, and its mainly the same 10-20 people every week.
That's all I had to say.
tl;dr
To all the denizens of MAL: Everyone does not have to agree with you. Everyone does not have to have the same values that you have when watching a show. Everyone does not have to watch a show for the same reasons as you. So rather than ask inane questions like: "Why don't you drop _____?" or making childish blanket statements like, "You never _______," why don't you try to engage others in their viewpoints and start a real discussion? Why is it so hard on the internets for people to be civil? Yes, I understand that anonymity can afford us a lot of solace in the absolute douchebaggiest of behavior, but really, why jump into a discussion when the first thing that you want to do is make snide remarks about someone who thinks differently than you?
To be clear, I don't hate anime. I love anime, otherwise, why the hell would I be on this site? As I have stated in the little about me blurb in my profile, I hold anime to the same standards as film and television. I'm not going to make excuses for a show because "It's a harem, what more do you want?" or "This is a shounen, it's not going to be that deep." I think by now we have all witnessed great amounts of anime in any genre that goes above and beyond the call of what is expected in its own grouping, so that way of thinking just won't fly with me. As I have stated before in many discussions: Is it wrong to want to understand a characters motives? Is it wrong to not take certain characters at face value? Is it wrong to admit that I am not an emotionally unstable 13 year old girl having her first period, and therefore just because a "pretty" girl dies onscreen, I have to cry?
No. It isn't wrong. Writers should strive for depth in characters and logical plot no matter who the target demographic is. Unfortunately "otaku" masses are dumb enough to devour any "moe" character that has big boobs, a short skirt, and dumb eyes. Those of you who are fine with having your vapid, nonsensical anime should shut your mouth when someone calls into question what's going on. You like it, that's fine, but don't pretend it's something super meaningful. Moreover, don't defend it by saying "It's just a comedy" or whatever. The plain facts are that good characters make a comedy or a drama. If you respond to the same gags over and over in any and every show you watch, that's one thing, but don't pretend like having good characters is only for drama.
I like to talk about what's going on in a show. Sometimes I honestly might have missed things out of boredom or whatnot, or have forgotten something that has long since passed. I put my thoughts in the discussion threads to incite discussion. Do I have a slightly agressive or critical tone? Yes, but a) that's just the way I am and b) that's what gets people's attention. What I hate most is when the threads become this circle jerk of "OMG I cried so hard," "ROFL, Mariya ftw," or "Awesome episode is awesome" for 10 pages. It defeats the purpose for the thread in my mind.
Honestly, the only massive discussion thread that gets it right (out of everything I'm watching) is Toradora. People argue, make charts, conjecture, and support their arguments with facts for the most part. Sure there are some delusional people in there that refuse take things at face value, but they either own up to it, or quickly get shot down/muted in the face of real discussion.
A lot of other threads get it right, but they are so small, and its mainly the same 10-20 people every week.
That's all I had to say.
tl;dr
Posted by
noteDhero
| Feb 16, 2009 10:08 AM |
4 comments
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Dark-Evolution | Feb 17, 2009 8:17 AM
You do bring up a good point in this blog. I had past experiences in forum topics before where there are annoying users bringing up information that isn't worth the time discussing. Unfortunely, some episode discussion threads seemed to follow this trend.The bottom line is we are all different in what we see is good and what we see is awful. Even though members might have their differences in certain topics like Kanon (2006) or C.C., it is only fair to get to know the members better because there may be other topics that we may like such as the FMP! series. |
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YoungVagabond | Feb 16, 2009 4:43 PM
Well, there's two reasons for what you're describing;1) The forum is horribly moderated. This is because no one cares about making it a place of meaningful discussion. And why would they? Doing so would mean banning a shitload of idiots, which means less advertisement revenue...the latter being the primary goal of the site, especially since it was recently bought by a public company. So right now, it's the worst of both worlds, because mods blindly delete posts with bad language, (so one can't call out and humiliate idiots from posting) but have no problem with the really stupid, meaningless replies with no "bad language". (Whatever the fuck that means) 2) Anime is a medium, not a genre, still mostly marketed towards a younger audience. While I think the average age of the consumer has gone up a lot since, for example, the early 90s, it's still mostly a bunch of young kids. Due to any number of stigmas attached to watching anime, too, most of these kids are anti-social, academically poor, and generally idiots. I think this has also changed a lot over the last 15-20 years, to the point where the amount of older, more normal consumers of the medium has become a pretty huge niche audience, but on a huge site not devoted to any particular series, but the medium at large, the former will still prevail. So essentially, mods instructed to do the wrong thing, and a mostly retarded, immature bunch of users. Recipe for disaster. Solution, which I've been following for a long while now, is to rarely post on the main forums, and keep discussions on profiles or clubs or whatever. Much higher standard of discourse there, too. |
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ladyxzeus | Feb 16, 2009 11:35 AM
It's due to overall retardness that I really don't discuss single episodes at the Anime Forum (and also because I don't really have patience to interrupt my continuous watch to say "ong so kewte")It's annoying, but when you stop expecting an intelligent answer, argument or debate, it turns much easier. =D And now you have to get a regular basis, haha! |
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naikou | Feb 16, 2009 11:19 AM
Yeah, I get the same thing. Not as much as you in the discussion threads, but seems like every week there's a comment on my profile that goes something like: "OMG how u give Black Lagoon a 6 and Haruhi a 10?!?" It gets tiring to explain that 6 =/= failure, and is in fact, pretty good. And even if I'd given it a 1/10, why does it matter? I have my reasons.Anyway, good lucky with keeping up on your blog. I tried it about a year ago, stopped after a few months, and deleted everything in it. Now I just post some thoughts on OP/ED animations every week, which seems to be working out well. |